FIRE EVERYONE!

[gris_h8er]

I hope I’m wrong and my frustrations with Vigen are nothing more than small missteps. I hope he’s thinking of all the things to fix this and beat them in the playoffs. I hope all of the people not seeing anything wrong are right. If thats the case it means the plane is gonna be one trophy heavier taking off from Frisco that the plane that left Bozeman. That will be a great day.

If that’s not the case then something has to be done to beat the dsus and the gris in missoula. I think that starts with a new HC. Am I right? Who knows

Either win in which case I’m wrong about Vigen and my skepticism was overplayed or my detractions of Vigen are anccurate and I think a change of leadership is in order.

I don’t think that’s unreasonable. I would hope we can agree that being a Bobcat is great and winning makes it that much sweater. I hope Vigen accomplishes the goals he was hired to achieve. If he doesn’t show him the door.

I think Vigen had to have lost track of all the mistakes made that we haven't witnessed in years...I know i did...

I’m sure someone can find him a notebook to write them in during film review.

Another fan with standards? Expectations? All the “good enough” folks better round us looneys up and burn us at the stake.

[coachouert]

It's almost noon. Do we know who the new coach is since we're firing everyone? Is it gris_h8ter? I expect a 110% win rate for whoever it is.

This place is hilarious sometimes.

[gris_h8er]

All just semantics at this point. I don’t care what people call it. If people wanna say we’re as good as the dakotas so be it. Hell, they can say we’re better than the chiefs and eagles too. It’s all talk. Nothing matters but wins and losses and we haven’t shown we can win. Are we good enough to win? Probably. But we don’t so who cares.

Many of the games during the streak we were good enough to win. Who cares? In the end I could have said we were right there with the griz. But they had a decade and a half of wins so I’m sure they really didn’t care if some of us thought we were right there with them. Until we actually start beating the Dakotas, I can’t imagine they or anyone else really cares if we say we’re “right there” with them.

I would argue that it’s not semantics but coping and delusion that leads people to believe that it is acceptable to lose games to teams that are allegedly peers. “Right there” with the Dakota schools doesn’t mean squat until it results in a victory.

No one thinks it’s acceptable to lose. But crying and giving is unacceptable. Just go to the next game.

You’re right we have to go to the next game. However, you didn’t finish the sentence. The rest of the sentence is: Go to the next game with things to fix and problems that need to be addressed. I see coaching as a problem and needs to be addressed. These problems have been here since Vigen took the job and at some point it has to be his fault that they’re not getting fixed. We’ve had multiple coordinators, multiple rosters. And yet the problem persists, at some point it’s his fault.

Holy crap, you sound like my emotionally immature 7 year old who always thinks it's "someone else's fault!" And "it's not fair!". Give it up, man. It's a freaking game. The MSU Football team doesn't owe you Jack.

Can’t refute any points so you leverage the old “immature” label around. Care to disagree with evidence or is discrediting me all you’ve got?

[SonomaCat]

I hope I’m wrong and my frustrations with Vigen are nothing more than small missteps. I hope he’s thinking of all the things to fix this and beat them in the playoffs. I hope all of the people not seeing anything wrong are right. If thats the case it means the plane is gonna be one trophy heavier taking off from Frisco that the plane that left Bozeman. That will be a great day.

If that’s not the case then something has to be done to beat the dsus and the gris in missoula. I think that starts with a new HC. Am I right? Who knows

Either win in which case I’m wrong about Vigen and my skepticism was overplayed or my detractions of Vigen are anccurate and I think a change of leadership is in order.

I don’t think that’s unreasonable. I would hope we can agree that being a Bobcat is great and winning makes it that much sweater. I hope Vigen accomplishes the goals he was hired to achieve. If he doesn’t show him the door.

I think Vigen had to have lost track of all the mistakes made that we haven't witnessed in years...I know i did...

I’m sure someone can find him a notebook to write them in during film review.

Another fan with standards? Expectations? All the “good enough” folks better round us looneys up and burn us at the stake.

Lighten up, Francis.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I recall this gris_h8 poster complaining about Vigen in the past. His username is a variation of another poster here so it stuck in my mind. I looked at his previous posts and He clearly has some personal vendetta against Vigen. His last posts prior to yesterday was to berate Vigen for being a terrible coach when we beat New Mexico last year. We then ran 14 straight wins and he didn’t make a peep till yesterday. He is an entitled fan who just makes the fan base look bad.

We just took the number two team in the nation into double overtime. We had chances to win the game right. There is no problem. If we lose a couple more games, let’s talk then, but I see this team with 10 straight wins. The OC needs to quit running Lamson so much and the offensive line needs to figure out some things. We will be okay.

Definitely be ok and likely be an 8+ win season. However that doesn’t mean that’s the end goal or there is nothing to improve. It also doesn’t mean that winning a cream puff schedule makes Vigen the second coming.

You’re absolutely right I have a bone to pick with Vigen, he was supposed to elevate to the dsus and win a national championship. Unless I missed something we’re still waiting on him to accomplish those goals. So the question is how many mistakes, how many close calls and how many coming up short games is enough? Should the Vigen train be ridden to .500 or below? Or should the plug be pulled now and try to push to the next level with a new guy?

And you’re right, I had nothing to say cause it looked like the problems were solved. I wasn’t thrilled with how they called plays for Tommy but it worked out in spite of what I saw to be mistakes. Unfortunately this team is making the same mistakes that showed up two years ago against Idaho. So the question is what happened? Did Vigen learn/not learn? New roster? Coordinators not listening to the greatest coach in Bobcat history?

How old are you? My guess is early 30’s and have never experienced a rough patch. I can tell you with 100% certainty that 2 losses to VERY good teams (they both might undefeated) is not indicative of trouble. The cupboard is certainly not bare. We have multiple dudes that will be recruited by FBS programs for next season.

You act like winning a national championship is a god given right. It isn’t. Other teams with very qualified personnel, and in many cases better resources, are striving for the same goal.

If you are so passionate about your “right” to a national championship, why don’t you pull out your checkbook and start writing NIL checks to keep our top guys. Zimmer will be offered a six figure deal this offseason to play somewhere else next year. It is the reality of today’s game. You basically have called for firings of people who make their livelihood coaching at MSU, why don’t you put your financial commitment in the same category?

Lastly, the past 4 years of Bobcat football have been some of the most successful (if not the best ever) run of football MSU has ever seen. If you want to be that entitled fan and trash coaches with no real justification, then you are better off at egriz.

Oregon doesn’t count. I personally have nothing to say about it they were the number one team in the country for multiple weeks last year. Outlier and irrelevant. Losing to a dsu for the 6th time during his tenure is frustrating. His objectives 1 and 1a have not yet been achieved. So what’s his timeline? How long is too long? Is he capable of achieving the objectives cited in his hiring? Who knows but I’m skeptical.

As far as your ramblings about the roster. It’s a good roster and the kids played well. Blaming the loss to sdsu on losing guys is baseless. Kids graduate, kids transfer, welcome to college football. I personally think Vigen manages the roster very well in the new era of college football. I don’t like how he coaches games. I don’t like his game plans. I don’t like that after three OCs the offense looks the same and calls the same plays in situations those plays have no place. I saw kids achieving to their ability levels the kids were let down by coaching.

You can act indignant about what you perceive to be my belief that I am “owed” a title but the fact is he was hired to accomplish a goal. If he can’t it’s time to look elsewhere for leadership.

If MSU chose to fire Vigen, with what he’s done here, what coach in their right mind would want to come here? Obviously somebody would, but it definitely wouldn’t be somebody as good as what you would want. I’m frustrated with the loss too, but maybe wait until the end of the year before you start calling for people to be let go.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I hope I’m wrong and my frustrations with Vigen are nothing more than small missteps. I hope he’s thinking of all the things to fix this and beat them in the playoffs. I hope all of the people not seeing anything wrong are right. If thats the case it means the plane is gonna be one trophy heavier taking off from Frisco that the plane that left Bozeman. That will be a great day.

If that’s not the case then something has to be done to beat the dsus and the gris in missoula. I think that starts with a new HC. Am I right? Who knows

Either win in which case I’m wrong about Vigen and my skepticism was overplayed or my detractions of Vigen are anccurate and I think a change of leadership is in order.

I don’t think that’s unreasonable. I would hope we can agree that being a Bobcat is great and winning makes it that much sweater. I hope Vigen accomplishes the goals he was hired to achieve. If he doesn’t show him the door.

I think Vigen had to have lost track of all the mistakes made that we haven't witnessed in years...I know i did...

I’m sure someone can find him a notebook to write them in during film review.

Another fan with standards? Expectations? All the “good enough” folks better round us looneys up and burn us at the stake.

Understanding how a team could lose to a perennial top 3 FCS school in double OT isn’t the same as not having standards.

Standards are good. Necessary. You’re acting like a petulant child who didn’t get exactly what they wanted and you’re lashing out because you have no real understanding of what you’re talking about.

[MSUBobcat04]

I recall this gris_h8 poster complaining about Vigen in the past. His username is a variation of another poster here so it stuck in my mind. I looked at his previous posts and He clearly has some personal vendetta against Vigen. His last posts prior to yesterday was to berate Vigen for being a terrible coach when we beat New Mexico last year. We then ran 14 straight wins and he didn’t make a peep till yesterday. He is an entitled fan who just makes the fan base look bad.

We just took the number two team in the nation into double overtime. We had chances to win the game right. There is no problem. If we lose a couple more games, let’s talk then, but I see this team with 10 straight wins. The OC needs to quit running Lamson so much and the offensive line needs to figure out some things. We will be okay.

People like him, or the inverse who think their team can do no wrong, are why I have 60 posts here and 3,450 on the anygivensaturday.com forum. I do appreciate that there may be a bit more "insider information" on the Bobcats from posters here, but there's more argumentative people on a site that is presumably 99% Bobcat fans than on one that caters to the FCS as a whole, and it also provides insight into many of the other teams that I don't follow as closely.

[gris_h8er]

I hope I’m wrong and my frustrations with Vigen are nothing more than small missteps. I hope he’s thinking of all the things to fix this and beat them in the playoffs. I hope all of the people not seeing anything wrong are right. If thats the case it means the plane is gonna be one trophy heavier taking off from Frisco that the plane that left Bozeman. That will be a great day.

If that’s not the case then something has to be done to beat the dsus and the gris in missoula. I think that starts with a new HC. Am I right? Who knows

Either win in which case I’m wrong about Vigen and my skepticism was overplayed or my detractions of Vigen are anccurate and I think a change of leadership is in order.

I don’t think that’s unreasonable. I would hope we can agree that being a Bobcat is great and winning makes it that much sweater. I hope Vigen accomplishes the goals he was hired to achieve. If he doesn’t show him the door.

I think Vigen had to have lost track of all the mistakes made that we haven't witnessed in years...I know i did...

I’m sure someone can find him a notebook to write them in during film review.

Another fan with standards? Expectations? All the “good enough” folks better round us looneys up and burn us at the stake.

Understanding how a team could lose to a perennial top 3 FCS school in double OT isn’t the same as not having standards.

Standards are good. Necessary. You’re acting like a petulant child who didn’t get exactly what they wanted and you’re lashing out because you have no real understanding of what you’re talking about.

I can understand an event and still expect change. Analyze what changes would be ideal to achieve the goal.

I could be misunderstanding but I’ve read a lot of “you don’t remember how bad it was” to me that’s communicating this is “good enough”. That phrasing doesn’t demonstrate understanding the loss, I read it as “accept this is the best it’s ever gonna be”. I could be wrong. You’d have to ask the guys saying that.

As an isolated event, I’m not even particularly mad about it. My frustration arises from repeated coaching discussions, and repeated mistakes that I think should be addressed. Fact is these mistakes have shown up in multiple games against multiple opponents. If they are not going to be addressed, then the person not addressing them needs to be addressed. I can’t even say for certain that these problems are Vigen’s fault. However the evidence would lead a rational person down the Vigen road

[PapaG]

Didn’t know where else to put this, but I am very impressed with the image that Dan Jackson portrayed in all of the media I saw of him prior to the game and also the interviews at halftime and end of fame. He just seems to get it and have something that will lead him to a decent FCS job in the future.

[GoldstoneCat]

gris-h8er, you much like Veruca Salt, are a bad egg. ‘Hey, Daddy, I want a National Championship! I want you to get me a National Championship right away!’

Then you will say, ‘at least I’m not complacent’. Thing is, no one here is complacent, any current player I have spoken to loves the culture Vigen has created and respect him as a coach. So, I guess you’re also calling out the players, busting their butts for our entertainment, for being complacent. You are just a spoiled brat.

Right away is false. It’s been 4 years and change. By no definition of the phrase does that qualify as “right away”. What was one of the goals cited during his hiring? Something along the lines of national championship victory I believe. Who knows, maybe the spoiled attitude I have is clouding my memory.

There is a 0% chance Vigen ever gets fired for performance here. 0%. By all means continue your crusade if you like. But it'll never happen. He's elevated us, like it or not. Ash did, then the wheels fell off. Choate got that out of the ditch but never elevated us even to the top of the big sky. Vigen has. And the arrow is still up, in my view. We are going to win either 9 or 10 games and be a seed in a year where we have to replace some of the best guys to ever play for us. A fireable offense? I think decidedly not.

It’s not a fireable offense. Unfortunately you chose to sidestep and not directly address my cited reasons.

However, not changing is. Not learning is. Repeating mistakes from the Idaho implosion two years ago is. Not accomplishing the objectives set publicly in his hiring is a fireable offense.

0%. But keep beating the drum.

[MSUBobcat04]

Enough already.

Yep! I'm just trying to see how many times Chicken Little makes the same whiny argument! Only two more pages to slog through....

[MSUBobcat04]

I’ll say this.

After these two losses, this team more than knows what they need to do to win. They know where they’re weak. They know what mistakes to fix, and the mistakes that were made are for the most part, easy to fix. I would much rather have this loss now, than later. Now they have the entire season to fix and improve, and they will. The coaches here have been good, despite what many think. The talent is good. Young, but good. I feel bad for what San Diego is about to get thrown at them.

No doubt! I personally think we run the table at least until the brawl. Hopefully after.

Really? What makes you think that?

I don't see anyone left on the schedule that is winning in Bobcat Stadium. Davis looked decent in their canceled opener against Mercer, until Mercer proceeded to lose to non-scholly Presbyterian, then needed a furious comeback effort against an improved by still not top-25 UTU and got dump trucked worse by unranked Washington than we did by Oregon (who also beat Ok State worse than us). Outside of that is the house of horrors that is Walkup Skydome, but I see that as a very winnable game (assuming we learn that Lamson is not Tommy, nor Troy for that matter).

[CelticCat]

Even mentioning the possibility of firing the only coach to take us to one NC, let alone 2, in the last 40 years, especially since the most recent one was last year after a 15-1 season, after 2 games is nuts. I'm sorry. That is bonkers.

Now if we want to point out shortcomings or look at trends and tendencies, that's fair. And can Vigen get us to that level with the DSUs? I'm honestly not sure. It's frustrating losing to the DSU's, and falling short in the NC. But the grass is extremely green and you don't need to look further than Missoula to see what happens what a fanbase gets tired of almost winning the NC. Hauck left on his own but people forget how many fans wanted him gone, I'm convinced he left before things fell apart or before he was forced out, despite having one of the best runs in the Big Sky Conference history. He couldn't win the NC and fans were tired of it. What succeeded that was a run of mediocrity from 2010-2018 before Hauck got the program back on track in 2019. One could even argue MSU's rise could be correlated to UM's downfall during the 2010s.

Now if we finish 8-4 with a one and done in the playoffs, or worse, we can talk about warming his seat up. Warming, unless the wheels completely fall off.

Right now I agree with the posters who say winning is all the matters - we can't put ourselves in that same conversation with the DSU's until we win a few, that's just how it is. It kind of feels like we graduated from being the little brother in Montana to being the little brother on the national stage. And it is frustrating, but I have seen the gap close and that keeps me optimistic it can continue to close, but that may not happen this year simply due to a small step back in. But, it could be our year too, lots of football left to be played and the Cats have a lot of new pieces that I think can come together to be very dangerous for anyone in the country.

[MSUBobcat04]

Didn’t know where else to put this, but I am very impressed with the image that Dan Jackson portrayed in all of the media I saw of him prior to the game and also the interviews at halftime and end of fame. He just seems to get it and have something that will lead him to a decent FCS job in the future.

I know living in Brookings sounds terrible, but to say being HC of SDSU (apparently in the top tier of just 2 teams, according to this thread) isn't a decent FCS job is WILD! (had to poke a little fun at your typo since this thread is a bit heated)

[Cataholic]

Did anybody see the Baltimore-Buffalo game last night? I am guessing that Baltimore fans are calling for Harbaughs head after that loss! Heck, he was hired to win a Super Bowl and he can’t beat one of the favorites this year. I am guessing grish8 is raving mad on Ravens.com about Harbaugh and expectations!!!

[RKMCMT]

Oregon doesn’t count. I personally have nothing to say about it they were the number one team in the country for multiple weeks last year. Outlier and irrelevant. Losing to a dsu for the 6th time during his tenure is frustrating. His objectives 1 and 1a have not yet been achieved. So what’s his timeline? How long is too long? Is he capable of achieving the objectives cited in his hiring? Who knows but I’m skeptical.

As far as your ramblings about the roster. It’s a good roster and the kids played well. Blaming the loss to sdsu on losing guys is baseless. Kids graduate, kids transfer, welcome to college football. I personally think Vigen manages the roster very well in the new era of college football. I don’t like how he coaches games. I don’t like his game plans. I don’t like that after three OCs the offense looks the same and calls the same plays in situations those plays have no place. I saw kids achieving to their ability levels the kids were let down by coaching.

You can act indignant about what you perceive to be my belief that I am “owed” a title but the fact is he was hired to accomplish a goal. If he can’t it’s time to look elsewhere for leadership.

Truth is it takes talent and diligence to get where we are. But fortune still plays a big part in whether that finally translates all the way to the top.

[84CatGrad]

"If MSU chose to fire Vigen, with what he’s done here, what coach in their right mind would want to come here? Obviously somebody would, but it definitely wouldn’t be somebody as good as what you would want. I’m frustrated with the loss too, but maybe wait until the end of the year before you start calling for people to be let go."

I know you know this but nobody is seriously talking about firing Vigen who may (arguably?) already be the greatest coach we've ever had. Anyone bringing that up is either being tongue-in-cheek or wanting to start another boring BN cat fight.

[rfischer94]

If you’re looking to fire someone, start with whoever thought it was a good idea to schedule these two matchups to open the season. Imagine the conversations we’d be having right now if we had started with two “cupcake” opponents like Central Washington. Cats would be 2-0 and we would be saying we have a few things to work on but damn we look good for being so early in the year and with all the changes we have had from last years team.

The way I see it, we’ll head into the playoffs with two losses—but we’ll also be far more battle-tested and better prepared because of these early games.

[84CatGrad]

"The way I see it, we’ll head into the playoffs with two losses—but we’ll also be far more battle-tested and better prepared because of these early games."

What he said.

[rfischer94]

I wasn't paying attention during the streak so its possible that this is a bad analogy. Is the Bobcats' repeated losses to the XDSUs this generation's "streak?"