2025 Griz Hail Mary

[TomCat88]

If you were a pollster and you wanted to be fair and precise, then you'd have a lot of work to do. I mostly pay attention to MSU, NDSU and SDSU. I'm willing to pull in other teams as the season develops. I've looked closely at UM and I'm going to give Tarleton a closer look, too. Last year it was UC Davis and South Dakota, and they were on the cusp of jumping in with the Big 3 but so far this year they have taken a step back. UM has looked good offensively, but they haven't played anyone that I would consider to have a good defense. The most impressive win is probably Idaho or UND. C. Wash. looks like a really good D2 team. ISU is a good team. Indiana State isn't good. UM hasn't been impressive on defense but if they can start to mold that side of the ball together, then that would be a big step as long as their offense maintains its productivity.

MSU, NDSU and SDSU all have very good defenses. SDSU struggled a little on that side of the ball against YSU, but that was probably just a fluke. There might be some better teams offensively, but their offenses are more than adequate and much better than average with very good QBs. There are no other teams that have that situation currently. Just looking at Tarleton's scores it doesn't appear that they're in the same ballpark defensively. They looked good through the first four games but the last two not so much giving up over 400 to Chattanooga and 420 to S. Utah with both games at home.

Fans, nationally, want to point to the Mercyhurst game as a knock on MSU, but it looks like a one-off against a team that's better than people think and no one else has shut them out. They were only down by 16 at halftime to SDSU. They only lost to YSU by nine and YSU only lost to SDSU by 5. They gave SAC a game for three quarters. I'm not saying they're good, but they're better than anyone expected.

[OldGriz]

I agree with the GO BOBCATS part. But I disagree about rankings and do not believe that data analytics are superior to qualified human judgments in assessing football program strength. Football is not engineering. But go Cats. Stay healthy.

What a second! Aren’t you the same guy that was using the polls to argue the Gris were better than the Cats? And now, given that we expect the Cats should be ahead of the Gris tomorrow, you are suddenly saying the polls are no good? GOT IT!!!!

You have it wrong. The polls are good. If the coaches and writers lift the Cats above the Griz, so do I. All’s fair.

The coaches literally have interns that fill out their polls for them because they don't care. Bruce Barnum has flat out said that he makes sure all the teams they have on schedule get ranked as high as possible on his submitted polls because that helps him out.

I honestly don't care what the polls say. Even if MSU was ranked higher than UM, I've been pretty consistent on that, I just don't care what they say. I care what my eyes see in combination with what the statistics say, but as we know, stats can lie too. But seriously, if you think the coaches are spending a tremendous amount of time on their polls, you are very misguided. They don't care. The writers really only know the teams in their area. It's not hard to say that fans who pay a fair amount of attention to the FCS know more than a lot of writers. If there's one person who's poll is probably more accurate than anybody else, it's Sam Herder. I'd take his poll over the coaches poll any day, but at the end of the day, I really just don't care. It doesn't make UM better than MSU and it doesn't make MSU better than UM.

Oldgriz knows all this. He's a troll. The correct response is more along the lines of "Nobody who's ever played the game would ever say something like this about polls, particularly in early October. This post makes clears that you don't understand the game of football".

Aside from ClowderUp’s display of chronic jock sniffer syndrome stemming from his days as team manager (i.e., use of the term “who’s ever played the game”), the conversation is somewhat intelligent. Let’s be clear — no one ever said polls that produce rankings are a predictive analytics method of determining who could beat whom on a given Saturday. They are simply a snapshot of informed people’s (coaches and writers) impression of program strength. Something about the Griz being ranked higher than the Cats for a couple weeks has a lot of blue or gold panties in a bunch. Calm down. The ranking could change this week.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I agree with the GO BOBCATS part. But I disagree about rankings and do not believe that data analytics are superior to qualified human judgments in assessing football program strength. Football is not engineering. But go Cats. Stay healthy.

What a second! Aren’t you the same guy that was using the polls to argue the Gris were better than the Cats? And now, given that we expect the Cats should be ahead of the Gris tomorrow, you are suddenly saying the polls are no good? GOT IT!!!!

You have it wrong. The polls are good. If the coaches and writers lift the Cats above the Griz, so do I. All’s fair.

The coaches literally have interns that fill out their polls for them because they don't care. Bruce Barnum has flat out said that he makes sure all the teams they have on schedule get ranked as high as possible on his submitted polls because that helps him out.

I honestly don't care what the polls say. Even if MSU was ranked higher than UM, I've been pretty consistent on that, I just don't care what they say. I care what my eyes see in combination with what the statistics say, but as we know, stats can lie too. But seriously, if you think the coaches are spending a tremendous amount of time on their polls, you are very misguided. They don't care. The writers really only know the teams in their area. It's not hard to say that fans who pay a fair amount of attention to the FCS know more than a lot of writers. If there's one person who's poll is probably more accurate than anybody else, it's Sam Herder. I'd take his poll over the coaches poll any day, but at the end of the day, I really just don't care. It doesn't make UM better than MSU and it doesn't make MSU better than UM.

Oldgriz knows all this. He's a troll. The correct response is more along the lines of "Nobody who's ever played the game would ever say something like this about polls, particularly in early October. This post makes clears that you don't understand the game of football".

Aside from ClowderUp’s display of chronic jock sniffer syndrome stemming from his days as team manager (i.e., use of the term “who’s ever played the game”), the conversation is somewhat intelligent. Let’s be clear — no one ever said polls that produce rankings are a predictive analytics method of determining who could beat whom on a given Saturday. They are simply a snapshot of informed people’s (coaches and writers) impression of program strength. Something about the Griz being ranked higher than the Cats for a couple weeks has a lot of blue or gold panties in a bunch. Calm down. The ranking could change this week.

Several things.

“Who’s ever played the game” is just picking on a Griz poster who came here a few times who always says this. PlayerRep, MTHoops, same guy. That’s where that comes from, just so you’re aware, and I think you already were.

Second, your idea that the polls are an informed impression of program ranks is false, especially early on in the year. We know that the coaches themselves aren’t filling it out, and we know that coaches like Bruce Barnum manipulate them to help his own team. You’re naive if you think he’s the only one.

Third, nobody actually cares if UM is ranked higher or lower at the beginning of October. This will get settled in November like it always does.

Don’t pretend that you’re playing things here without bias, or even with intelligence. You’re not here for an honest conversation and you know it. Quit pretending otherwise, it’s not fooling anybody.

[OldGriz]

A couple things.

Good to know that the “who’s ever played the game” bunk was intended as sarcasm. I’m now on the same page.

As for an “informed impression,” what I actually said was “a snapshot of informed people’s impression.” Those people are responsible for their own quality control. Bruce Barnum, a well-known regional comedian, who moonlights as a college football coach, once said some things about poll methods that some of you guys are taking to the bank (viewing as good as gold). He does not speak for other coaches. Clearly, his claim that he handles the poll dishonestly to help his team is a one-liner quip to make someone laugh. Anyone who takes it seriously should ask himself, “How could that really help his team?” Answer: it can’t.

[ClowderUp]

Wait a minute. I'm confused. Did people not actually realize Oldgriz was PlayerRep from the first few words of his first post? That's hard to believe.

[OldGriz]

Wait a minute. I'm confused. Did people not actually realize Oldgriz was PlayerRep from the first few words of his first post? That's hard to believe.

[OldGriz]

Griz are still ranked above the Cats.

https://www.ncaa.com/rankings/football/ ... aches-poll

[RickRund]

I agree with the GO BOBCATS part. But I disagree about rankings and do not believe that data analytics are superior to qualified human judgments in assessing football program strength. Football is not engineering. But go Cats. Stay healthy.

What a second! Aren’t you the same guy that was using the polls to argue the Gris were better than the Cats? And now, given that we expect the Cats should be ahead of the Gris tomorrow, you are suddenly saying the polls are no good? GOT IT!!!!

You have it wrong. The polls are good. If the coaches and writers lift the Cats above the Griz, so do I. All’s fair.

The coaches literally have interns that fill out their polls for them because they don't care. Bruce Barnum has flat out said that he makes sure all the teams they have on schedule get ranked as high as possible on his submitted polls because that helps him out.

I honestly don't care what the polls say. Even if MSU was ranked higher than UM, I've been pretty consistent on that, I just don't care what they say. I care what my eyes see in combination with what the statistics say, but as we know, stats can lie too. But seriously, if you think the coaches are spending a tremendous amount of time on their polls, you are very misguided. They don't care. The writers really only know the teams in their area. It's not hard to say that fans who pay a fair amount of attention to the FCS know more than a lot of writers. If there's one person who's poll is probably more accurate than anybody else, it's Sam Herder. I'd take his poll over the coaches poll any day, but at the end of the day, I really just don't care. It doesn't make UM better than MSU and it doesn't make MSU better than UM.

Oldgriz knows all this. He's a troll. The correct response is more along the lines of "Nobody who's ever played the game would ever say something like this about polls, particularly in early October. This post makes clears that you don't understand the game of football".

Aside from ClowderUp’s display of chronic jock sniffer syndrome stemming from his days as team manager (i.e., use of the term “who’s ever played the game”), the conversation is somewhat intelligent. Let’s be clear — no one ever said polls that produce rankings are a predictive analytics method of determining who could beat whom on a given Saturday. They are simply a snapshot of informed people’s (coaches and writers) impression of program strength. Something about the Griz being ranked higher than the Cats for a couple weeks has a lot of blue or gold panties in a bunch. Calm down. The ranking could change this week.

I am just going by Massey, but Sagarin is basically the same, the CATS #3 beat #8 (now #10) NAU SOUNDLY. The gris #5 had their hand FULL against ISU #39, needing a last minute score to squeak out a win. That will not place them above the CATS. No one is saying the gris are cold balogna, just that they haven’t shown they deserve to be above the CATS. They could be better than Tarleton. In a few weeks the ratings will be more closely showing who is deserving of their ranking.

[catatac]

So after the dust settles after the regular season, the Cats will have played the #2 or #3 FBS team Oregon, the #2 FCS team SDSU, #13 FCS team NAU, #6 (currently) FCS team US Davis, and #4 (currently) FCS team UM. That's quite the resume.

[BelligerentBobcat]

A couple things.

Good to know that the “who’s ever played the game” bunk was intended as sarcasm. I’m now on the same page.

As for an “informed impression,” what I actually said was “a snapshot of informed people’s impression.” Those people are responsible for their own quality control. Bruce Barnum, a well-known regional comedian, who moonlights as a college football coach, once said some things about poll methods that some of you guys are taking to the bank (viewing as good as gold). He does not speak for other coaches. Clearly, his claim that he handles the poll dishonestly to help his team is a one-liner quip to make someone laugh. Anyone who takes it seriously should ask himself, “How could that really help his team?” Answer: it can’t.

@Colter_Nuanez can you explain to this guy that the coaches poll should actually be called the SID’s Poll?

Thanks.

[BelligerentBobcat]

A couple things.

Good to know that the “who’s ever played the game” bunk was intended as sarcasm. I’m now on the same page.

As for an “informed impression,” what I actually said was “a snapshot of informed people’s impression.” Those people are responsible for their own quality control. Bruce Barnum, a well-known regional comedian, who moonlights as a college football coach, once said some things about poll methods that some of you guys are taking to the bank (viewing as good as gold). He does not speak for other coaches. Clearly, his claim that he handles the poll dishonestly to help his team is a one-liner quip to make someone laugh. Anyone who takes it seriously should ask himself, “How could that really help his team?” Answer: it can’t.

Ranking teams higher helps with his SOS. If you think a coach wouldn’t do that, you’re delusional. Any little thing, they’ll do it.

[ClowderUp]

Personally I believe the pollsters ranking gris above the Cats may recognize the Brawl is in Missoula and believe gris will win at home. Or they aren't paying any attention and have auto pen as described in this thread. Anybody who's actually paying attention, even just a little bit, have the Cats ahead. The eye test is overwhelming in favor of the Cats.

[tetoncat]

I laugh at the informed people comment. Most poll voters are not very informed.

[iaafan]

Anybody who's actually paying attention, even just a little bit, have the Cats ahead. The eye test is overwhelming in favor of the Cats.

I agree with this 100% but there are quite a few Cat fans that think the two teams are even. Some who claim they use the eye test. It’s frigging amazing.

[OldGriz]

I love how Cat fans know more than coaches, beat writers, and referees. You’re seldom informed, but never in doubt. LOL. Confidence.

[tetoncat]

I love how Cat fans know more than coaches, beat writers, and referees. You’re seldom informed, but never in doubt. LOL. Confidence.

Referees vote in polls now. My how times have changed.

[ClowderUp]

I love how Cat fans know more than coaches, beat writers, and referees. You’re seldom informed, but never in doubt. LOL. Confidence.

Referees vote in polls now. My how times have changed.

Nobody who understands the game of football or has played the game, at least at a meaningful level, would ever say referees have anything to do with polls. Complete and total lack of football knowledge from Oldgris.

[OldGriz]

I love how Cat fans know more than coaches, beat writers, and referees. You’re seldom informed, but never in doubt. LOL. Confidence.

Referees vote in polls now. My how times have changed.

Nobody who understands the game of football or has played the game, at least at a meaningful level, would ever say referees have anything to do with polls. Complete and total lack of football knowledge from Oldgris.

I’ve never said referees vote in polls.

[catatac]

OldGriz every Monday afternoon checking the polls..... "Whew, Griz are still better than the Cats. I should be able to sleep tonight." lol

[catatac]

Oh, and I've been meaning to ask, what is this year's theme over there in Bobbie Land..... is it RTD, DOLA, a little of both, or did he come up with a dUMb new one?