FIRE EVERYONE!

[technoCat]

MSU, SDSU and NDSU are in lock step with each other. The deciding factor when they play other each is randomness. Since 2021, MSU is 1-5 with four losses by miniscule fractions. SDSU is up on NDSU 4-2, but four games have been decided by a TD or less. The only blowouts were by SDSU over NDSU in 2023, when NDSU was down a tad, SDSU over MSU in 2022 and MSU knew its lines weren't ready for prime time. NDSU over MSU in 2021 when Mellott went out on the first series. Other than that, it's just a knockdown, drag out fight. Especially since the start of 2023 when MSU actually caught up physically. No other teams are in the same ballpark.

You can flip a coin, and it'll come up heads 10 times in a row sometimes, and that's kinda what's happening to MSU. There's not guarantee it won't be 20.

SDSU is 7-2, NDSU is 5-4, MSU is 1-5. All three of them blow everyone's doors off unless they're just having a bad day. The eight contestants in the last four title games have been those three teams 7 times. The Griz had a good defense and Bergen and it got them in the title game, but they didn't make a semifinal other than that year. Out of 12 possible chances MSU, NDSU and SDSU have been in the semifinals 10 times the last four years.

All MSU can do is keep chopping wood or as Julius Davis said, keep heading into the storm and don't look back.

They all play the same style of football. It's no big secret to each other when they get on the field.

To say MSU is in “lock step” with the Dakotas is a wild take. The stats, the eye test, and the results don’t support that.


MSU has closed the gap in recent years, but we’re still running to catch the bus that’s pulling away

Bring receipts. Lets see what you have that backs up your statement. The stats in the last four games are almost identical, and I think if you added them up MSU would be slightly ahead in terms of total yards.

The eye test tells you they beat SDSU in 2023 only to lose due to a bad call and they out-played NDSU in 2023. Most NDSU people staff/fans felt like they stole one last year and were glad the clock ran out. The results, show MSU 0-4, but if you don't think all four of those could've gone either way, you're lying to yourself.

But they didn't go the other way. If a game is close, we have not found a way to win. That isn't a coin flip, that is a culture. We need to stop acting like this team is on the same level because obviously something is missing and we need to take another step to get there.

Don't take everything literally. Yes, of course it wasn't a coin flip. That's a verbal illustration to make a point. The only thing missing is a play or two. MSU doesn't need to go into a deep dive to seek out why they've lost these last four games. A bad call based on all video evidence I've seen in 2023 vs SDSU; an injury to Mellott in 2023 playoff game vs NDSU (not to mention a pair of missed FGs and a blocked XP and Chambers just barely stepping out of bounds); a fluke first half vs NDSU that saw a 4.9 40 guy go 60+ yards for a TD, among other things; and this game which featured a TF punter getting blocked by a TF special teamer and a shanked punt. That led to 14 of SDSU's 17 regulation points. Yes, I realize they gave one back.

These aren't games where MSU is getting pushed around in the trenches or where they don't have the skill players to keep up. It just boils down to goofy stuff that every game has, but that is magnified x100 in games between evenly matched teams.

There are a ton of examples of teams and athletes going through what MSU is going through and breaking through, and some that never broke through.

who's taking it literally? My point was that if after every game we are saying we are right there except for x and y excuses, maybe we aren't right there.

[TomCat88]

LOL!! I'd really love to see someone explain what it is MSU needs to be better at. Just saying 'need a new coach' or 'something must be wrong if...' 'just aren't good enough' doesn't really cut it. If it's so obvious, then someone should be able to explain it clearly and concisely. tick-tock

If MSU was getting pushed around, turning the ball over or committing penalties consistently or just wasn't a talented or fundamentally sound team, I could see a path to fixing a problem. I just don't see it. Now, if the punter keeps getting his punts blocked every game or if MSU is in the negative in turnovers game in and game out, then you might have something, but hasn't been the case in these games.

SDSU was ecstatic to get the win. The players and coaches were giddy after the game. They know what they did wasn't going to be easy and wasn't easy.

When two really good, evenly matched teams play there isn't some magic elixir that the team that ends up winning used. It usually just boils down to a play or two and the team that makes those plays wins, but they had no special enzymes in their system that made the difference.

There are a couple things I'm really good at, but I still don't win every time. I'm sure most everyone can relate.

[TomCat88]

MSU, SDSU and NDSU are in lock step with each other. The deciding factor when they play other each is randomness. Since 2021, MSU is 1-5 with four losses by miniscule fractions. SDSU is up on NDSU 4-2, but four games have been decided by a TD or less. The only blowouts were by SDSU over NDSU in 2023, when NDSU was down a tad, SDSU over MSU in 2022 and MSU knew its lines weren't ready for prime time. NDSU over MSU in 2021 when Mellott went out on the first series. Other than that, it's just a knockdown, drag out fight. Especially since the start of 2023 when MSU actually caught up physically. No other teams are in the same ballpark.

You can flip a coin, and it'll come up heads 10 times in a row sometimes, and that's kinda what's happening to MSU. There's not guarantee it won't be 20.

SDSU is 7-2, NDSU is 5-4, MSU is 1-5. All three of them blow everyone's doors off unless they're just having a bad day. The eight contestants in the last four title games have been those three teams 7 times. The Griz had a good defense and Bergen and it got them in the title game, but they didn't make a semifinal other than that year. Out of 12 possible chances MSU, NDSU and SDSU have been in the semifinals 10 times the last four years.

All MSU can do is keep chopping wood or as Julius Davis said, keep heading into the storm and don't look back.

They all play the same style of football. It's no big secret to each other when they get on the field.

To say MSU is in “lock step” with the Dakotas is a wild take. The stats, the eye test, and the results don’t support that.


MSU has closed the gap in recent years, but we’re still running to catch the bus that’s pulling away

Bring receipts. Lets see what you have that backs up your statement. The stats in the last four games are almost identical, and I think if you added them up MSU would be slightly ahead in terms of total yards.

The eye test tells you they beat SDSU in 2023 only to lose due to a bad call and they out-played NDSU in 2023. Most NDSU people staff/fans felt like they stole one last year and were glad the clock ran out. The results, show MSU 0-4, but if you don't think all four of those could've gone either way, you're lying to yourself.

But they didn't go the other way. If a game is close, we have not found a way to win. That isn't a coin flip, that is a culture. We need to stop acting like this team is on the same level because obviously something is missing and we need to take another step to get there.

Don't take everything literally. Yes, of course it wasn't a coin flip. That's a verbal illustration to make a point. The only thing missing is a play or two. MSU doesn't need to go into a deep dive to seek out why they've lost these last four games. A bad call based on all video evidence I've seen in 2023 vs SDSU; an injury to Mellott in 2023 playoff game vs NDSU (not to mention a pair of missed FGs and a blocked XP and Chambers just barely stepping out of bounds); a fluke first half vs NDSU that saw a 4.9 40 guy go 60+ yards for a TD, among other things; and this game which featured a TF punter getting blocked by a TF special teamer and a shanked punt. That led to 14 of SDSU's 17 regulation points. Yes, I realize they gave one back.

These aren't games where MSU is getting pushed around in the trenches or where they don't have the skill players to keep up. It just boils down to goofy stuff that every game has, but that is magnified x100 in games between evenly matched teams.

There are a ton of examples of teams and athletes going through what MSU is going through and breaking through, and some that never broke through.

who's taking it literally? My point was that if after every game we are saying we are right there except for x and y excuses, maybe we aren't right there.

Yes, I understand that train of thought. But I'm trying to drag it out of someone just what it is that MSU is missing. Someone has to win, just like a coin has to end up heads or tails, unless it lands on its side and balances. The teams are very evenly matched. Over 16 regulation time quarters the point spread is 7 points. I bet the yardages is less than 50.

I don't like to use excuses, which why I give and ask for thought out rationale and reasons.

I was talking about the coin flip analogy, when I said literally. What's missing is wins. I think if MSU wins, then the discussion goes away. There isn't anything they can do at practice or in meetings that's magically going to make them win. Getting another game with them, is the only way to get a win. And if you don't win that one, schedule another one and another and another.

[TomCat88]

I'm a good skier. If, say, I have a bad mogul run (lose) I don't go buy new skis, practice on an easier run and do a bunch of drills. I know I'm still good and can have a good run, so I just go back and do it again (win).

[technoCat]

LOL!! I'd really love to see someone explain what it is MSU needs to be better at. Just saying 'need a new coach' or 'something must be wrong if...' 'just aren't good enough' doesn't really cut it. If it's so obvious, then someone should be able to explain it clearly and concisely. tick-tock

If MSU was getting pushed around, turning the ball over or committing penalties consistently or just wasn't a talented or fundamentally sound team, I could see a path to fixing a problem. I just don't see it. Now, if the punter keeps getting his punts blocked every game or if MSU is in the negative in turnovers game in and game out, then you might have something, but hasn't been the case in these games.

SDSU was ecstatic to get the win. The players and coaches were giddy after the game. They know what they did wasn't going to be easy and wasn't easy.

When two really good, evenly matched teams play there isn't some magic elixir that the team that ends up winning used. It usually just boils down to a play or two and the team that makes those plays wins, but they had no special enzymes in their system that made the difference.

There are a couple things I'm really good at, but I still don't win every time. I'm sure most everyone can relate.

1) Untimely penalties. That PI in overtime and the 12 men were huge. Not to mention the false start that led to the shanked punt.

2) Shifting around the line. Our OL was pushed around for most of the game. It was obvious they were not getting half the push SDSU was and were letting rushers get pressure consistently.

3) Defensive breakdowns. At the minimum, 2 tds were just complete breakdowns where we left a receiver completely uncovered.

We also wasted home field advantage again. That was at least good for 7-10 points yesterday and made up for several mistakes. We cant make those if we want to have any chance on the road.

[ilovethecats]

All just semantics at this point. I don’t care what people call it. If people wanna say we’re as good as the dakotas so be it. Hell, they can say we’re better than the chiefs and eagles too. It’s all talk. Nothing matters but wins and losses and we haven’t shown we can win. Are we good enough to win? Probably. But we don’t so who cares.

Many of the games during the streak we were good enough to win. Who cares? In the end I could have said we were right there with the griz. But they had a decade and a half of wins so I’m sure they really didn’t care if some of us thought we were right there with them. Until we actually start beating the Dakotas, I can’t imagine they or anyone else really cares if we say we’re “right there” with them.

[iaafan]

LOL!! I'd really love to see someone explain what it is MSU needs to be better at. Just saying 'need a new coach' or 'something must be wrong if...' 'just aren't good enough' doesn't really cut it. If it's so obvious, then someone should be able to explain it clearly and concisely. tick-tock

If MSU was getting pushed around, turning the ball over or committing penalties consistently or just wasn't a talented or fundamentally sound team, I could see a path to fixing a problem. I just don't see it. Now, if the punter keeps getting his punts blocked every game or if MSU is in the negative in turnovers game in and game out, then you might have something, but hasn't been the case in these games.

SDSU was ecstatic to get the win. The players and coaches were giddy after the game. They know what they did wasn't going to be easy and wasn't easy.

When two really good, evenly matched teams play there isn't some magic elixir that the team that ends up winning used. It usually just boils down to a play or two and the team that makes those plays wins, but they had no special enzymes in their system that made the difference.

There are a couple things I'm really good at, but I still don't win every time. I'm sure most everyone can relate.

1) Untimely penalties. That PI in overtime and the 12 men were huge. Not to mention the false start that led to the shanked punt.

2) Shifting around the line. Our OL was pushed around for most of the game. It was obvious they were not getting half the push SDSU was and were letting rushers get pressure consistently.

3) Defensive breakdowns. At the minimum, 2 tds were just complete breakdowns where we left a receiver completely uncovered.

We also wasted home field advantage again. That was at least good for 7-10 points yesterday and made up for several mistakes. We cant make those if we want to have any chance on the road.

SDSU must’ve done a bunch of stuff wrong too to get taken into double overtime by a team that messed up as much as MSU did. Hey! I know!! Maybe both teams suck! Yeah, that’s it. That’s the ticket!! You’re welcome everyone.

[iaafan]

I'm a good skier. If, say, I have a bad mogul run (lose) I don't go buy new skis, practice on an easier run and do a bunch of drills. I know I'm still good and can have a good run, so I just go back and do it again (win).

This. I don’t really care if we lost. It’s over with now. Get back out there and try, try again. It’ll happen. And when it does everyone will forget this conversation.

[iaafan]

All just semantics at this point. I don’t care what people call it. If people wanna say we’re as good as the dakotas so be it. Hell, they can say we’re better than the chiefs and eagles too. It’s all talk. Nothing matters but wins and losses and we haven’t shown we can win. Are we good enough to win? Probably. But we don’t so who cares.

Many of the games during the streak we were good enough to win. Who cares? In the end I could have said we were right there with the griz. But they had a decade and a half of wins so I’m sure they really didn’t care if some of us thought we were right there with them. Until we actually start beating the Dakotas, I can’t imagine they or anyone else really cares if we say we’re “right there” with them.

I don’t care either. If people want to say were not any good and are going to quit going to games that’s fine. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. I used to go to games when we were 0-11. We lost, so what. I still had fun.

Idiotic take though. lol. You say it’s all semantics then you only discuss one side of the semantics. It sounds like you’re crying in your beer. Cats lost. Boo-hoo.

[gris_h8er]

MSU, SDSU and NDSU are in lock step with each other. The deciding factor when they play other each is randomness. Since 2021, MSU is 1-5 with four losses by miniscule fractions. SDSU is up on NDSU 4-2, but four games have been decided by a TD or less. The only blowouts were by SDSU over NDSU in 2023, when NDSU was down a tad, SDSU over MSU in 2022 and MSU knew its lines weren't ready for prime time. NDSU over MSU in 2021 when Mellott went out on the first series. Other than that, it's just a knockdown, drag out fight. Especially since the start of 2023 when MSU actually caught up physically. No other teams are in the same ballpark.

You can flip a coin, and it'll come up heads 10 times in a row sometimes, and that's kinda what's happening to MSU. There's not guarantee it won't be 20.

SDSU is 7-2, NDSU is 5-4, MSU is 1-5. All three of them blow everyone's doors off unless they're just having a bad day. The eight contestants in the last four title games have been those three teams 7 times. The Griz had a good defense and Bergen and it got them in the title game, but they didn't make a semifinal other than that year. Out of 12 possible chances MSU, NDSU and SDSU have been in the semifinals 10 times the last four years.

All MSU can do is keep chopping wood or as Julius Davis said, keep heading into the storm and don't look back.

They all play the same style of football. It's no big secret to each other when they get on the field.

Saying that the loss last night was “like flipping a coin” “it could come up heads 10 times in a row” is delusional and disingenuous. Saying that a victory over the DSU schools is purely up to chance might be one of the worst college football analysis I’ve ever seen. If you’re consistently losing to a group of teams or team you’re doing something wrong. I’m not guaranteeing that I know the right answer but I know something is wrong. Anyone gifted with the ability to observe and basic deduction can figure that out.

It's called an exaggeration for effect. However, if you don't realize the amount of randomness that's involved in sports, you've got your head buried in the sand. When two evenly matched teams play, you get what you saw last night. It took two extra periods to determine a winner. It came down to one play in the end.

SDSU did a lot of things wrong last night as well. So did NDSU last year and the year before, and so did SDSU in the 2023 game. Sometimes the winning team does more things wrong that the losing team but still wins.

Football, unlike almost every sport in the world (soccer, baseball, basketball, hockey), doesn't have the "luxury" of playing 50-82-162 games a year. There isn't a seven-game series to sort out the "better" team. The NCAA hoop tournament is the only thing that's similar and how many times to you see the final four not have a #1 seed in it?

I realize people are mad that MSU got beat...again...but it's not a black and white issue of 'they're just better than us.' None of those three teams is going to get better, at least not dramatically. Barring a swath of injuries they're all going to play really good football all year and then face each other in the playoffs.

If the Cats win, it'll be because they make the plays they need to make at key times. It won't because they became magically better.

There’s no argument over the randomness of sports however, you have to control what you can control. I saw a lack of control and a lack of preparation in the places that the cats have control over. Bad playcalling is not random. Blocked punts are not random. A team that looks unprepared is not random. Fumbles are not random. Ball security is a skill that can and should be taught. Last time I checked, you don’t flip a coin over whether or not you hold onto the ball at the end of a run. Don’t flip a coil to see if a punt is blocked. Don’t flip a coin to decide what offensive play you’re running at fourth and one in overtime. Don’t flip a coin on whether or not you should attack their tight safeties down the middle. Don’t flip a coin on whether or not you call pass plays with the routes shorter than the line to gain in late down situations. Maybe we should flip a coin to see whether or not this loss is acceptable?

As far as being magically better, you don’t get magically better you control what you can control and if you still lose well, that’s what happens. However If you fail to control what you can control and fail to prepare, that’s a problem. The good news is it’s a problem that can be fixed. Excuses and acceptance are problems, there’s no debate that that mentality is not a recipe for success.

[gris_h8er]

All just semantics at this point. I don’t care what people call it. If people wanna say we’re as good as the dakotas so be it. Hell, they can say we’re better than the chiefs and eagles too. It’s all talk. Nothing matters but wins and losses and we haven’t shown we can win. Are we good enough to win? Probably. But we don’t so who cares.

Many of the games during the streak we were good enough to win. Who cares? In the end I could have said we were right there with the griz. But they had a decade and a half of wins so I’m sure they really didn’t care if some of us thought we were right there with them. Until we actually start beating the Dakotas, I can’t imagine they or anyone else really cares if we say we’re “right there” with them.

I would argue that it’s not semantics but coping and delusion that leads people to believe that it is acceptable to lose games to teams that are allegedly peers. “Right there” with the Dakota schools doesn’t mean squat until it results in a victory.

[iaafan]

All just semantics at this point. I don’t care what people call it. If people wanna say we’re as good as the dakotas so be it. Hell, they can say we’re better than the chiefs and eagles too. It’s all talk. Nothing matters but wins and losses and we haven’t shown we can win. Are we good enough to win? Probably. But we don’t so who cares.

Many of the games during the streak we were good enough to win. Who cares? In the end I could have said we were right there with the griz. But they had a decade and a half of wins so I’m sure they really didn’t care if some of us thought we were right there with them. Until we actually start beating the Dakotas, I can’t imagine they or anyone else really cares if we say we’re “right there” with them.

I would argue that it’s not semantics but coping and delusion that leads people to believe that it is acceptable to lose games to teams that are allegedly peers. “Right there” with the Dakota schools doesn’t mean squat until it results in a victory.

No one thinks it’s acceptable to lose. But crying and giving up is unacceptable. Just go to the next game.

[msuhunter]

As a wise man once said “stats are for losers.” At the end of the day, the only stat that matters is the score. MSU hasn’t faired well in this statistical category against the Dakotas. Moral victories are a temporary solution to a larger problem. That’s the point I’m making. Like I said, cats have narrowed the gap in recent years but haven’t been able to break thru when it counts. The receipts are in the final scores.

[iaafan]

As a wise man once said “stats are for losers.” At the end of the day, the only stat that matters is the score. MSU hasn’t faired well in this statistical category against the Dakotas. Moral victories are a temporary solution to a larger problem. That’s the point I’m making. Like I said, cats have narrowed the gap in recent years but haven’t been able to break thru when it counts. The receipts are in the final scores.

So if we lost 45-0 and looks years away from building a team good enough to beating them, you’re cool with that?

[gris_h8er]

All just semantics at this point. I don’t care what people call it. If people wanna say we’re as good as the dakotas so be it. Hell, they can say we’re better than the chiefs and eagles too. It’s all talk. Nothing matters but wins and losses and we haven’t shown we can win. Are we good enough to win? Probably. But we don’t so who cares.

Many of the games during the streak we were good enough to win. Who cares? In the end I could have said we were right there with the griz. But they had a decade and a half of wins so I’m sure they really didn’t care if some of us thought we were right there with them. Until we actually start beating the Dakotas, I can’t imagine they or anyone else really cares if we say we’re “right there” with them.

I would argue that it’s not semantics but coping and delusion that leads people to believe that it is acceptable to lose games to teams that are allegedly peers. “Right there” with the Dakota schools doesn’t mean squat until it results in a victory.

No one thinks it’s acceptable to lose. But crying and giving is unacceptable. Just go to the next game.

You’re right we have to go to the next game. However, you didn’t finish the sentence. The rest of the sentence is: Go to the next game with things to fix and problems that need to be addressed. I see coaching as a problem and needs to be addressed. These problems have been here since Vigen took the job and at some point it has to be his fault that they’re not getting fixed. We’ve had multiple coordinators, multiple rosters. And yet the problem persists, at some point it’s his fault.

[gris_h8er]

I think there's a better than 50/50 chance this season ends in Fargo or Brookings...but our stats will be pretty even so there's that.

Another moral victory. “Right there!” “So close” I can’t wait for another one of those.

[gris_h8er]

As a wise man once said “stats are for losers.” At the end of the day, the only stat that matters is the score. MSU hasn’t faired well in this statistical category against the Dakotas. Moral victories are a temporary solution to a larger problem. That’s the point I’m making. Like I said, cats have narrowed the gap in recent years but haven’t been able to break thru when it counts. The receipts are in the final scores.

So if we lost 45-0 and looks years away from building a team good enough to beating them, you’re cool with that?

At least there would be no doubt, coming up short is more frustrating than getting routed out of the building. The complacency of “almost” from the fan base and coaches is getting old.

[gris_h8er]

Please do elaborate Mr. Madden

You have eyes. This is either the first game you've watched or you're just another emotional clown arguing in bad faith.
Go to bed and come back later.

You’re right. I saw:
1) playing for a field goal at half time
2) miscues, fumbles and blocked punts and 12 men on the field
3) a new offensive coordinator and the same suspect and unexplainable play calls
4) inconsistent play
5) talented kids as always. (He recruits well) but they’re not sharp, seem unprepared.

So who is to blame for those things? Things which we regularly see from Vigen coached teams. Who is the boogeyman that keeps thwarting the coaching genius that is Brent Vigen?

#1 has been consistent through Vigens career. It's not ever going to change. Its got him to a 79% win percentage with the Cats, 2 natties, a few semis, and a bunch of wins at NDSU

2). Correct. Totally unacceptable. Really boggles the mind.

3) Yes

4) I think thats to be expected 2 games in with new co-ordinator, QB, etc. Vigen has a history of getting these things cleaned up as the season goes on.

5) Except in the 80% of games that Vigen wins.

1) losses close games, see Idaho two years ago and tonight
3) has to be Vigen
4) isn’t the point of practice and the team arriving before classes so they’re prepared for games? Oregon doesn’t count. Outlier and irrelevant. SDSU tonight was sloppy and has to be someone’s fault
5) I’m worried about the 20% he doesn’t win. Let’s get it to 95% and then I’ll shut up about the vegetablist.

OK...where exactly are you going to find a coach that wins 95% of games?

Here it is again. “This is good enough cause they’re the cats and they’ve been bad before” that is not an acceptable reason. I don’t understand why so many of our fan base accepts almost just because there have been some bad seasons in the past. That fan mentality is nearly as infuriating as Vigen’s almost good enough, almost prepared, almost beat a good team coaching style.

Complacency kills success. The mindset you describe seems to have a grip on the program as a whole, and that’s culturally problematic.

Culture runs downhill.

There are those that disagree but I see a problem and it’s not a new one. It is one that has plagued the vegetablist and Ash. Sure looks the be a culture/attitude problem. There’s no reason the Cats can’t be better and improve (beat the gris and dsu consistently) with the money that has been put into the program, the talent on the roster and the largest university in the state behind them. We take academics seriously, never had a prof say “that was almost good enough here’s an A” so why does Vigen get that courtesy?

Because Vigen is clearly an ‘A’ coach with an ‘A’ team…that occasionally loses to other A or A+ teams

OCCASIONALLY? He’s beat them once. How many times have we played the DSUs and lost under his tenure?

[msuhunter]

As a wise man once said “stats are for losers.” At the end of the day, the only stat that matters is the score. MSU hasn’t faired well in this statistical category against the Dakotas. Moral victories are a temporary solution to a larger problem. That’s the point I’m making. Like I said, cats have narrowed the gap in recent years but haven’t been able to break thru when it counts. The receipts are in the final scores.

So if we lost 45-0 and looks years away from building a team good enough to beating them, you’re cool with that?

I’m not following.

[gris_h8er]

You have eyes. This is either the first game you've watched or you're just another emotional clown arguing in bad faith.
Go to bed and come back later.

You’re right. I saw:
1) playing for a field goal at half time
2) miscues, fumbles and blocked punts and 12 men on the field
3) a new offensive coordinator and the same suspect and unexplainable play calls
4) inconsistent play
5) talented kids as always. (He recruits well) but they’re not sharp, seem unprepared.

So who is to blame for those things? Things which we regularly see from Vigen coached teams. Who is the boogeyman that keeps thwarting the coaching genius that is Brent Vigen?

#1 has been consistent through Vigens career. It's not ever going to change. Its got him to a 79% win percentage with the Cats, 2 natties, a few semis, and a bunch of wins at NDSU

2). Correct. Totally unacceptable. Really boggles the mind.

3) Yes

4) I think thats to be expected 2 games in with new co-ordinator, QB, etc. Vigen has a history of getting these things cleaned up as the season goes on.

5) Except in the 80% of games that Vigen wins.

1) losses close games, see Idaho two years ago and tonight
3) has to be Vigen
4) isn’t the point of practice and the team arriving before classes so they’re prepared for games? Oregon doesn’t count. Outlier and irrelevant. SDSU tonight was sloppy and has to be someone’s fault
5) I’m worried about the 20% he doesn’t win. Let’s get it to 95% and then I’ll shut up about the vegetablist.

OK...where exactly are you going to find a coach that wins 95% of games?

Here it is again. “This is good enough cause they’re the cats and they’ve been bad before” that is not an acceptable reason. I don’t understand why so many of our fan base accepts almost just because there have been some bad seasons in the past. That fan mentality is nearly as infuriating as Vigen’s almost good enough, almost prepared, almost beat a good team coaching style.

Complacency kills success. The mindset you describe seems to have a grip on the program as a whole, and that’s culturally problematic.

I also don’t get why a few posters on here are entitled and act like the program owes them a championship. Some of you live in a fantasy world. Next time there is a job opening some of you should apply.

Having standards and expectations is not entitlement it’s the fact of life. You don’t buy a car and just pick whatever car you get. You don’t build/buy a house and accept whatever one you get. You have standards and expectations as with anything in life; anyone who suggests otherwise is either complacent or a liar.

So then shop around for a new team that meets your expectations, your highness. What you listed are investments, that give you the power to make a choice. You voluntarily invest your time to watch the Cats, so if they do not meet your expectations, maybe shop around. Are there better coaches and staff than Vigen, of course, if you axe a coach after a legitimate winning record, losing a great senior class, and having staff jump ship, good luck brining in a great coaching mind.

1) football coaches fall from the sky
2) Shopping around for a team that meets expectations is not how alma mater works
3) Expectations are the enemy of complacency, which is why you disagree with my analysis, you are ragingly complacent. Which frankly is your choice. Just as I choose to have an different attitude.