MSU Enrollment

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MSU Enrollment

Post by HiLineCat » Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:36 pm

Didn't know where to put this so mods please move it if you feel it should be somewhere else.

BOZEMAN – Amid a pandemic that has dramatically altered the world of higher education and introduced new complexity into families’ decisions about attending college, Montana State University reported today that its fall enrollment remained strong and set new records for graduation rates and student retention.

The traditional fall headcount, taken after the 15th day of classes, showed that 16,249 students are attending classes at MSU. That includes students who are taking courses in person, remotely or in a blended fashion — the three course modes offered at the university this fall. MSU’s fall enrollment may continue to increase as high school students, who started three weeks later than MSU, register for dual enrollment courses.

The enrollment is the fifth highest in MSU’s 127-year history, with the record set in 2018 at 16,902. The fall count is “stunningly strong,” all things considered, said MSU President Waded Cruzado. She noted that the pandemic has prompted many students to change their educational plans or to defer the start of their college careers.

The full story can be found here: http://www.montana.edu/news/20418



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by kennethnoisewater » Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:46 pm

Thanks for posting. I've been curious about that.


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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by ilovethecats » Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:49 pm

Considering how life is just ridiculous right now that is a pretty amazing stat!



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by coloradocat » Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:37 pm

Congrats to MSU on continued improvement. There are some interesting stats in the article though.
MSU’s retention rate – the percentage of first-year students returning for their second year – hit its highest mark in more than 30 years of modern record keeping at 78.2% percent.
Crazy that they set a record in this department. However, I suppose students may have felt they would be better off coming back to Bozeman and hanging out with their friends than staying home with their parents. Also, many unskilled jobs are probably still be unavailable.
MSU recorded modern-era records in its four- and six-year graduation rates as well. The fall figures showed that the four-year graduation rate was up to 34.7% from 29.7% last year. And the six-year rate — which is commonly looked at in federal statistics — was up slightly to 56.4%.

“One in three of our students is graduating in four years,” Cruzado said. “That is simply amazing.”
I'm not sure how good those numbers are relative to other universities but as nominal percentages they're terrible and prove that too many kids go to college. A college degree generally pays off (results vary across majors of course) but I don't see how dropping out of college can possibly pay off. Based on these numbers more than half of the students should either get a job or find a trade school / community college. They can still try a university later but clearly it's not the correct choice right out of high school. It's too bad high schools have become a feeder system for four year colleges rather than helping students identify the best avenue for success.


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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by coachouert » Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:55 pm

coloradocat wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:37 pm
Congrats to MSU on continued improvement. There are some interesting stats in the article though.
MSU’s retention rate – the percentage of first-year students returning for their second year – hit its highest mark in more than 30 years of modern record keeping at 78.2% percent.
Crazy that they set a record in this department. However, I suppose students may have felt they would be better off coming back to Bozeman and hanging out with their friends than staying home with their parents. Also, many unskilled jobs are probably still be unavailable.
MSU recorded modern-era records in its four- and six-year graduation rates as well. The fall figures showed that the four-year graduation rate was up to 34.7% from 29.7% last year. And the six-year rate — which is commonly looked at in federal statistics — was up slightly to 56.4%.

“One in three of our students is graduating in four years,” Cruzado said. “That is simply amazing.”
I'm not sure how good those numbers are relative to other universities but as nominal percentages they're terrible and prove that too many kids go to college. A college degree generally pays off (results vary across majors of course) but I don't see how dropping out of college can possibly pay off. Based on these numbers more than half of the students should either get a job or find a trade school / community college. They can still try a university later but clearly it's not the correct choice right out of high school. It's too bad high schools have become a feeder system for four year colleges rather than helping students identify the best avenue for success.
Keep in mind that MSU's foundation is built on access and that access mission is grounded in the admission requirements. As long as a student has a 2.5 GPA, 22 ACT or 1120 SAT this past year, they would be admitted. In many other states that have stronger community college systems, many students towards the bottom of those ranges would not be admitted, but have the option to attend a two-year school that is nearby and eventually transfer to a four-year. In MT, we have three community colleges (FVCC, DCC and MCC) and a handful of two year schools that provide both a community college-ish education and technical education (Great Falls College, City College, Highlands College, Missoula College and Helena College) along with the seven tribal colleges. In Montana, depending on where a student is living may have the luxury of attending a CC so they see a four-year school like MSU as the only option even if they need more preparedness. There is also still the stigma for students that after high school you go to college and if you don't, you're a failure which is another challenge in itself.

As an aside, MUS is no longer requiring test scores for students entering in the fall of 2021 so as long as a student has a 2.5 GPA out of high school, they will be admitted to any four-year campus in MT. This will have long-term impacts on graduation and retention for all schools. It'll be interesting to see how that plays out.

In relation to the original post, while these numbers are down compared to where we have been previously, this is a win considering the current climate and all the challenges we are experiencing daily. Between graduating more students this last spring, increasing retention and of course COVID, the faculty and staff at MSU did an excellent job.

Sorry for the long winded post.


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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by coloradocat » Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:51 pm

coachouert wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:55 pm
coloradocat wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:37 pm
Congrats to MSU on continued improvement. There are some interesting stats in the article though.
MSU’s retention rate – the percentage of first-year students returning for their second year – hit its highest mark in more than 30 years of modern record keeping at 78.2% percent.
Crazy that they set a record in this department. However, I suppose students may have felt they would be better off coming back to Bozeman and hanging out with their friends than staying home with their parents. Also, many unskilled jobs are probably still be unavailable.
MSU recorded modern-era records in its four- and six-year graduation rates as well. The fall figures showed that the four-year graduation rate was up to 34.7% from 29.7% last year. And the six-year rate — which is commonly looked at in federal statistics — was up slightly to 56.4%.

“One in three of our students is graduating in four years,” Cruzado said. “That is simply amazing.”
I'm not sure how good those numbers are relative to other universities but as nominal percentages they're terrible and prove that too many kids go to college. A college degree generally pays off (results vary across majors of course) but I don't see how dropping out of college can possibly pay off. Based on these numbers more than half of the students should either get a job or find a trade school / community college. They can still try a university later but clearly it's not the correct choice right out of high school. It's too bad high schools have become a feeder system for four year colleges rather than helping students identify the best avenue for success.
Keep in mind that MSU's foundation is built on access and that access mission is grounded in the admission requirements. As long as a student has a 2.5 GPA, 22 ACT or 1120 SAT this past year, they would be admitted. In many other states that have stronger community college systems, many students towards the bottom of those ranges would not be admitted, but have the option to attend a two-year school that is nearby and eventually transfer to a four-year. In MT, we have three community colleges (FVCC, DCC and MCC) and a handful of two year schools that provide both a community college-ish education and technical education (Great Falls College, City College, Highlands College, Missoula College and Helena College) along with the seven tribal colleges. In Montana, depending on where a student is living may have the luxury of attending a CC so they see a four-year school like MSU as the only option even if they need more preparedness. There is also still the stigma for students that after high school you go to college and if you don't, you're a failure which is another challenge in itself.

As an aside, MUS is no longer requiring test scores for students entering in the fall of 2021 so as long as a student has a 2.5 GPA out of high school, they will be admitted to any four-year campus in MT. This will have long-term impacts on graduation and retention for all schools. It'll be interesting to see how that plays out.

In relation to the original post, while these numbers are down compared to where we have been previously, this is a win considering the current climate and all the challenges we are experiencing daily. Between graduating more students this last spring, increasing retention and of course COVID, the faculty and staff at MSU did an excellent job.

Sorry for the long winded post.
I think the part of your post that I bolded is the biggest issue that needs to be overcome. There's definitely a lack of community colleges in Montana (makes sense considering our small and spread out population) but it sure seems like they would be a better option for a majority of high school graduates, at least for the first year or two. I assume Gallatin College belongs in one of your two lists as well by the way. It would be great if high schools instituted a program where they educated students on options post-HS as well as financial life skills and provided them with a look at what kind of options there are for each path (university, community college, tech school, jobs that don't require post-HS ed). I think a lot of kids just go to college because that's what they assume they have to do.


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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by onceacat » Tue Sep 15, 2020 10:33 pm

coloradocat wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:51 pm
coachouert wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:55 pm
coloradocat wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:37 pm
Congrats to MSU on continued improvement. There are some interesting stats in the article though.
MSU’s retention rate – the percentage of first-year students returning for their second year – hit its highest mark in more than 30 years of modern record keeping at 78.2% percent.
Crazy that they set a record in this department. However, I suppose students may have felt they would be better off coming back to Bozeman and hanging out with their friends than staying home with their parents. Also, many unskilled jobs are probably still be unavailable.
MSU recorded modern-era records in its four- and six-year graduation rates as well. The fall figures showed that the four-year graduation rate was up to 34.7% from 29.7% last year. And the six-year rate — which is commonly looked at in federal statistics — was up slightly to 56.4%.

“One in three of our students is graduating in four years,” Cruzado said. “That is simply amazing.”
I'm not sure how good those numbers are relative to other universities but as nominal percentages they're terrible and prove that too many kids go to college. A college degree generally pays off (results vary across majors of course) but I don't see how dropping out of college can possibly pay off. Based on these numbers more than half of the students should either get a job or find a trade school / community college. They can still try a university later but clearly it's not the correct choice right out of high school. It's too bad high schools have become a feeder system for four year colleges rather than helping students identify the best avenue for success.
Keep in mind that MSU's foundation is built on access and that access mission is grounded in the admission requirements. As long as a student has a 2.5 GPA, 22 ACT or 1120 SAT this past year, they would be admitted. In many other states that have stronger community college systems, many students towards the bottom of those ranges would not be admitted, but have the option to attend a two-year school that is nearby and eventually transfer to a four-year. In MT, we have three community colleges (FVCC, DCC and MCC) and a handful of two year schools that provide both a community college-ish education and technical education (Great Falls College, City College, Highlands College, Missoula College and Helena College) along with the seven tribal colleges. In Montana, depending on where a student is living may have the luxury of attending a CC so they see a four-year school like MSU as the only option even if they need more preparedness. There is also still the stigma for students that after high school you go to college and if you don't, you're a failure which is another challenge in itself.

As an aside, MUS is no longer requiring test scores for students entering in the fall of 2021 so as long as a student has a 2.5 GPA out of high school, they will be admitted to any four-year campus in MT. This will have long-term impacts on graduation and retention for all schools. It'll be interesting to see how that plays out.

In relation to the original post, while these numbers are down compared to where we have been previously, this is a win considering the current climate and all the challenges we are experiencing daily. Between graduating more students this last spring, increasing retention and of course COVID, the faculty and staff at MSU did an excellent job.

Sorry for the long winded post.
I think the part of your post that I bolded is the biggest issue that needs to be overcome. There's definitely a lack of community colleges in Montana (makes sense considering our small and spread out population) but it sure seems like they would be a better option for a majority of high school graduates, at least for the first year or two. I assume Gallatin College belongs in one of your two lists as well by the way. It would be great if high schools instituted a program where they educated students on options post-HS as well as financial life skills and provided them with a look at what kind of options there are for each path (university, community college, tech school, jobs that don't require post-HS ed). I think a lot of kids just go to college because that's what they assume they have to do.
Its a pretty rational decision: Stay home & take a low wage job without a ton of job prospects & pay your own way...or move to Bozeman/Missoula where all the cute girls/guys are & go to football games on Saturdays for 4 years.

Its wrong for a whole lot of them (At least the 44% who don't graduate in 6 years and probably the 70% who don't graduate in 4) but its pretty rational.



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by grizzh8r » Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:28 pm

onceacat wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 10:33 pm
coloradocat wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:51 pm
coachouert wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:55 pm
coloradocat wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:37 pm
Congrats to MSU on continued improvement. There are some interesting stats in the article though.
MSU’s retention rate – the percentage of first-year students returning for their second year – hit its highest mark in more than 30 years of modern record keeping at 78.2% percent.
Crazy that they set a record in this department. However, I suppose students may have felt they would be better off coming back to Bozeman and hanging out with their friends than staying home with their parents. Also, many unskilled jobs are probably still be unavailable.
MSU recorded modern-era records in its four- and six-year graduation rates as well. The fall figures showed that the four-year graduation rate was up to 34.7% from 29.7% last year. And the six-year rate — which is commonly looked at in federal statistics — was up slightly to 56.4%.

“One in three of our students is graduating in four years,” Cruzado said. “That is simply amazing.”
I'm not sure how good those numbers are relative to other universities but as nominal percentages they're terrible and prove that too many kids go to college. A college degree generally pays off (results vary across majors of course) but I don't see how dropping out of college can possibly pay off. Based on these numbers more than half of the students should either get a job or find a trade school / community college. They can still try a university later but clearly it's not the correct choice right out of high school. It's too bad high schools have become a feeder system for four year colleges rather than helping students identify the best avenue for success.
Keep in mind that MSU's foundation is built on access and that access mission is grounded in the admission requirements. As long as a student has a 2.5 GPA, 22 ACT or 1120 SAT this past year, they would be admitted. In many other states that have stronger community college systems, many students towards the bottom of those ranges would not be admitted, but have the option to attend a two-year school that is nearby and eventually transfer to a four-year. In MT, we have three community colleges (FVCC, DCC and MCC) and a handful of two year schools that provide both a community college-ish education and technical education (Great Falls College, City College, Highlands College, Missoula College and Helena College) along with the seven tribal colleges. In Montana, depending on where a student is living may have the luxury of attending a CC so they see a four-year school like MSU as the only option even if they need more preparedness. There is also still the stigma for students that after high school you go to college and if you don't, you're a failure which is another challenge in itself.

As an aside, MUS is no longer requiring test scores for students entering in the fall of 2021 so as long as a student has a 2.5 GPA out of high school, they will be admitted to any four-year campus in MT. This will have long-term impacts on graduation and retention for all schools. It'll be interesting to see how that plays out.

In relation to the original post, while these numbers are down compared to where we have been previously, this is a win considering the current climate and all the challenges we are experiencing daily. Between graduating more students this last spring, increasing retention and of course COVID, the faculty and staff at MSU did an excellent job.

Sorry for the long winded post.
I think the part of your post that I bolded is the biggest issue that needs to be overcome. There's definitely a lack of community colleges in Montana (makes sense considering our small and spread out population) but it sure seems like they would be a better option for a majority of high school graduates, at least for the first year or two. I assume Gallatin College belongs in one of your two lists as well by the way. It would be great if high schools instituted a program where they educated students on options post-HS as well as financial life skills and provided them with a look at what kind of options there are for each path (university, community college, tech school, jobs that don't require post-HS ed). I think a lot of kids just go to college because that's what they assume they have to do.
Its a pretty rational decision: Stay home & take a low wage job without a ton of job prospects & pay your own way...or move to Bozeman/Missoula where all the cute girls/guys are & go to football games on Saturdays for 4 years.

Its wrong for a whole lot of them (At least the 44% who don't graduate in 6 years and probably the 70% who don't graduate in 4) but its pretty rational.
Or, start an apprenticeship, get paid a good wage while learning a trade, have zero student debt, and start out after the apprenticeship is over at a very decent wage with what going forward will likely be a skill set of high demand. Just yesterday I read a ThomasNet article about this very thing, and the looming labor crisis on the horizon for American manufacturing due to the lack of the younger generation going into the skilled trades.

While I will raise my kids to pursue something after high school, I will NOT force college on them There is nothing wrong with being a Tradesperson.


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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by wbtfg » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:44 am

This is really a remarkable accomplishment for MSU. I was expecting a 10%+ decline in enrollment. This is a major accomplishment for the University.



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by iaafan » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am

What's UM's enrollment?



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by HiLineCat » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:20 am

MSU- Northern in Havre offers 2 year Associate Degrees in plumbing, electrical and welding. The electrical is actually an apprenticeship program. Their enrollment in these programs is always strong. They dropped the plumbing and electrical programs quite a while ago and then brought them back when they saw the need.



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by RickRund » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:32 am

iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am
What's UM's enrollment?
Also wondering iaafan. Am a little surprised that MSU has such strong numbers. But success breeds success!!!



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by wbtfg » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:12 am

iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am
What's UM's enrollment?
I assume they will release numbers later this week. I think UM started 2-3 days later than MSU this year.



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by St George » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:18 am

iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am
What's UM's enrollment?
If I read this right. um is at 7692 for fall enrollment.

https://missoulian.com/news/local/um-fa ... 7ea9a.html



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by bobcat99 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:17 am

HiLineCat wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:20 am
MSU- Northern in Havre offers 2 year Associate Degrees in plumbing, electrical and welding. The electrical is actually an apprenticeship program. Their enrollment in these programs is always strong. They dropped the plumbing and electrical programs quite a while ago and then brought them back when they saw the need.
They do a good job in Havre. Very practical. Wish we had more of that.



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by iaafan » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:22 am

St George wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:18 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am
What's UM's enrollment?
If I read this right. um is at 7692 for fall enrollment.

https://missoulian.com/news/local/um-fa ... 7ea9a.html
Thanks. I read that, but saw it was a projection based on registrations and couldn't extrapolate a number. What you have sounds about right. If so, and considering the drop off over the past 10 years or so, it will eventually become difficult for UM to fund sports with private funding since a big chunk of that comes from alumni.



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by coloradocat » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:33 am

iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:22 am
St George wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:18 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am
What's UM's enrollment?
If I read this right. um is at 7692 for fall enrollment.

https://missoulian.com/news/local/um-fa ... 7ea9a.html
Thanks. I read that, but saw it was a projection based on registrations and couldn't extrapolate a number. What you have sounds about right. If so, and considering the drop off over the past 10 years or so, it will eventually become difficult for UM to fund sports with private funding since a big chunk of that comes from one family.
FTFY


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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by iaafan » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:13 pm

coloradocat wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:33 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:22 am
St George wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:18 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am
What's UM's enrollment?
If I read this right. um is at 7692 for fall enrollment.

https://missoulian.com/news/local/um-fa ... 7ea9a.html
Thanks. I read that, but saw it was a projection based on registrations and couldn't extrapolate a number. What you have sounds about right. If so, and considering the drop off over the past 10 years or so, it will eventually become difficult for UM to fund sports with private funding since a big chunk of that comes from one family.
FTFY
:lol:
Thanks!



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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by KittieKop » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:29 pm

iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:22 am
St George wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:18 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:12 am
What's UM's enrollment?
If I read this right. um is at 7692 for fall enrollment.

https://missoulian.com/news/local/um-fa ... 7ea9a.html
Thanks. I read that, but saw it was a projection based on registrations and couldn't extrapolate a number. What you have sounds about right. If so, and considering the drop off over the past 10 years or so, it will eventually become difficult for UM to fund sports with private funding since a big chunk of that comes from alumni.
Reported just over 10,000 total enrollment, down 4.5%. MSU's drop in enrollment was about 3%

https://helenair.com/news/state-and-reg ... the-latest


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Re: MSU Enrollment

Post by wbtfg » Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:04 am

A few things jump out at me here.

-great job to Msu staff!

-it looks to me like um is combining the 4 year and 2 year college numbers in this report. It would be interesting to see specific 4 year campus numbers.

-the article says UM’s 400+ enrollment decline was “almost exclusively” freshman. Last year their freshman class was about 1100. Did their freshman class numbers drop 30+%?

-It will be interesting to see how much MSU subsidizes UM this year. If I remember correctly, last year it was in the $18 million range.



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