Thought exercise: the Hauck 2.0 grizzlies are the Rob Ash Bobcats.

[GoldstoneCat]

Obviously there are lots of caveats (more top-heavy FCS being a big one), but the comparison, i think, is apt. They make a living beating up on bad teams, they don't win the cat griz game, and when they run up against teams that can match their talent and can beat them physically they don't win those games. They're flashy offensively but have deep shortcomings in defensive scheme. Strength and conditioning is obviously not good enough. Most of the fan base defends the regime and says things like "nobody is firing a coach that just went 13-2." (I'll freely admit it, I was one of those guys here) I don't know that montana will have a 5-win season like we did in 2015, but their schedule next year is not nearly as kind.
I think the comparison is apt. Discuss amongst yourselves.

[wbtfg]

And Kent Haslam is Peter Fields.

Lots of parallels here.

[tdub]

In my opinion, the length of Hauck’s tenure live and dies with his portal success this offseason. If next year’s portal roulette doesn’t hit, his seat will be extremely hot. I could easily envision a retirement at that point. UM will absolutely let him keep his dignity on the way out of door.

But if they win those bets again, who knows?? Love him or hate him, that’s got to be an exhausting way to have to run a program. He’s old school and you know he wants to build these kids from the ground up, but his booster base probably won’t allow a total reconstruction and the pain it’ll cause. That’ll take a new coach to buy that time, like Choate had here.

[MSU01]

I think a significant part of Rob Ash's downfall at MSU was his loyalty to a defensive coordinator who simply wasn't getting the job done those last couple years despite having plenty of talented players on that side of the ball to work with. The Griz seem to be facing similar issues, so it will be interesting to see how willing Bobby Hauck is to make changes to his staff and the defensive scheme they're running that obviously does not work well against MSU...and who he brings in if he does make those changes.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I think a significant part of Rob Ash's downfall at MSU was his loyalty to a defensive coordinator who simply wasn't getting the job done those last couple years despite having plenty of talented players on that side of the ball to work with. The Griz seem to be facing similar issues, so it will be interesting to see how willing Bobby Hauck is to make changes to his staff and the defensive scheme they're running that obviously does not work well against MSU...and who he brings in if he does make those changes.

He had so many more issues than that.

[MSU01]

I think a significant part of Rob Ash's downfall at MSU was his loyalty to a defensive coordinator who simply wasn't getting the job done those last couple years despite having plenty of talented players on that side of the ball to work with. The Griz seem to be facing similar issues, so it will be interesting to see how willing Bobby Hauck is to make changes to his staff and the defensive scheme they're running that obviously does not work well against MSU...and who he brings in if he does make those changes.

He had so many more issues than that.

I don't doubt it, but that's the one where I see the biggest parallel with the UM program right now. Personality-wise Ash and Hauck could not possibly be more different, at least in their public personas.

[GoldstoneCat]

I think a significant part of Rob Ash's downfall at MSU was his loyalty to a defensive coordinator who simply wasn't getting the job done those last couple years despite having plenty of talented players on that side of the ball to work with. The Griz seem to be facing similar issues, so it will be interesting to see how willing Bobby Hauck is to make changes to his staff and the defensive scheme they're running that obviously does not work well against MSU...and who he brings in if he does make those changes.

He had so many more issues than that.

I don't doubt it, but that's the one where I see the biggest parallel with the UM program right now. Personality-wise Ash and Hauck could not possibly be more different, at least in their public personas.

Very fair and very good counter point. Ash was a good guy who became stale. Hauck is... not, but may also be stale.

[Bobcat Sig]

I liked Ash a lot. He was what we needed at the time. The offense was always legit. It was such a fun era of football! The defense, aside from one or two stars, was always so frustrating. On one hand, we had dudes like Minter, Jody Owens, Daly, Schreibis, and a bunch I’m forgetting. But we could never put it together on defense. It was always a boat race.

[technoCat]

I liked Ash a lot. He was what we needed at the time. The offense was always legit. It was such a fun era of football! The defense, aside from one or two stars, was always so frustrating. On one hand, we had dudes like Minter, Jody Owens, Daly, Schreibis, and a bunch I’m forgetting. But we could never put it together on defense. It was always a boat race.

I think people forget how good our defense was during our 3 BSC championship run. Ash just never figured out how to build any depth and our stars were all worn out by the end of the year.

[MrGoodKat]

Lots of parallels.

Offense-first team (this year).

Lots of empty wins against bad teams.

Struggles in the rivalry.

And yet, Hauck 2.0 has had way more postseason success and his teams field stronger defenses.

[GoldstoneCat]

Lots of parallels.

Offense-first team (this year).

Lots of empty wins against bad teams.

Struggles in the rivalry.

And yet, Hauck 2.0 has had way more postseason success and his teams field stronger defenses.

Can't argue with the post season success, especially that 2023 run (something of a fluke IMO) and this year. 18, 19, 21, 22 and 24 though the parallels are more direct. The big comparisons to me are an overall lack of depth behind arguably the biggest star players/Frontline dudes in the league, and a refusal to acknowledge defensive liability in scheme and personnel.

[MrGoodKat]

Lots of parallels.

Offense-first team (this year).

Lots of empty wins against bad teams.

Struggles in the rivalry.

And yet, Hauck 2.0 has had way more postseason success and his teams field stronger defenses.

Can't argue with the post season success, especially that 2023 run (something of a fluke IMO) and this year. 18, 19, 21, 22 and 24 though the parallels are more direct. The big comparisons to me are an overall lack of depth behind arguably the biggest star players/Frontline dudes in the league, and a refusal to acknowledge defensive liability in scheme and personnel.

What pops to me as the biggest parallel is team builds where the LOS is the weak point.

[Prodigal Cat]

Lots of parallels.

Offense-first team (this year).

Lots of empty wins against bad teams.

Struggles in the rivalry.

And yet, Hauck 2.0 has had way more postseason success and his teams field stronger defenses.

Can't argue with the post season success, especially that 2023 run (something of a fluke IMO) and this year. 18, 19, 21, 22 and 24 though the parallels are more direct. The big comparisons to me are an overall lack of depth behind arguably the biggest star players/Frontline dudes in the league, and a refusal to acknowledge defensive liability in scheme and personnel.

It was sorta a fluke but it also wasn't. We around here know that games are won in the trenches and teams at this level are built not borrowed via the portal. That 2023 Griz team had 4 and 5 year guys all over the field. Guys like Gubner, Janacaro, Gradney and on and on. Its the only team Hauck has had that wasn't a bunch of Stitt guys and was full of developed in house players especially on defense. The problem is they graduated a ton of guys that season and they didn't have good players coming up behind that team so they keep trying to fix it with transfers. They don't have resources to put into high school kids because they need to win now so they use scholarships on 1 year portal players. They will have to do it again this year.

That '23 griz team is in my mind the only time in 2.0 that Hauck had a better team than the Cats. The loss in '21 was locker room disfunction on the Cats. Made the switch at QB, McKay jumps in the portal and it got fixed.

[GoldstoneCat]

Lots of parallels.

Offense-first team (this year).

Lots of empty wins against bad teams.

Struggles in the rivalry.

And yet, Hauck 2.0 has had way more postseason success and his teams field stronger defenses.

Can't argue with the post season success, especially that 2023 run (something of a fluke IMO) and this year. 18, 19, 21, 22 and 24 though the parallels are more direct. The big comparisons to me are an overall lack of depth behind arguably the biggest star players/Frontline dudes in the league, and a refusal to acknowledge defensive liability in scheme and personnel.

It was sorta a fluke but it also wasn't. We around here know that games are won in the trenches and teams at this level are built not borrowed via the portal. That 2023 Griz team had 4 and 5 year guys all over the field. Guys like Gubner, Janacaro, Gradney and on and on. Its the only team Hauck has had that wasn't a bunch of Stitt guys and was full of developed in house players especially on defense. The problem is they graduated a ton of guys that season and they didn't have good players coming up behind that team so they keep trying to fix it with transfers. They don't have resources to put into high school kids because they need to win now so they use scholarships on 1 year portal players. They will have to do it again this year.

That '23 griz team is in my mind the only time in 2.0 that Hauck had a better team than the Cats. The loss in '21 was locker room disfunction on the Cats. Made the switch at QB, McKay jumps in the portal and it got fixed.

Yep our 23 team was also dysfunctional with the coordinator nonsense and the look-ahead mindset after that SDSU game. They were good defensively but struggled on offense most of the year, and Bergen carried them.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I really dislike saying this, but Hauck is/was a significantly better coach than Ash.

[coloradocat]

I really dislike saying this, but Hauck is/was a significantly better coach than Ash.

Expand on that.

I don't necessarily disagree but would like to hear why. They both seem to underperform and be a product of their soft regular season schedules and strong conference reputation. Hauck 2.0 rode a punt returner to Frisco but otherwise hasn't done anything special. I say that as a charter member of the Fire Ash Club.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I really dislike saying this, but Hauck is/was a significantly better coach than Ash.

Expand on that.

I don't necessarily disagree but would like to hear why. They both seem to underperform and be a product of their soft regular season schedules and strong conference reputation. Hauck 2.0 rode a punt returner to Frisco but otherwise hasn't done anything special. I say that as a charter member of the Fire Ash Club.

Ash’s teams were remarkably dysfunctional. He didn’t value the in system players much. Guys got away with a TON of stuff. Towards the end of his tenure there was a huge divide between the offensive players/coaches and their defensive counterparts. While some players were talented, they rarely beat teams that were of a similar talent and were generally soft as a team. A poor man’s Eastern Washington if you will.


Ash got by because he came off as a nice guy, but I know enough to have absolutely zero use or respect for him. Plus the crap he pulled with his kid was ******. The university paid a fair amount of money for his useless “services”.

[Catsrgrood]

Lots of parallels.

Offense-first team (this year).

Lots of empty wins against bad teams.

Struggles in the rivalry.

And yet, Hauck 2.0 has had way more postseason success and his teams field stronger defenses.

Can't argue with the post season success, especially that 2023 run (something of a fluke IMO) and this year. 18, 19, 21, 22 and 24 though the parallels are more direct. The big comparisons to me are an overall lack of depth behind arguably the biggest star players/Frontline dudes in the league, and a refusal to acknowledge defensive liability in scheme and personnel.

It was sorta a fluke but it also wasn't. We around here know that games are won in the trenches and teams at this level are built not borrowed via the portal. That 2023 Griz team had 4 and 5 year guys all over the field. Guys like Gubner, Janacaro, Gradney and on and on. It’s the only team Hauck has had that wasn't a bunch of Stitt guys and was full of developed in house players especially on defense. The problem is they graduated a ton of guys that season and they didn't have good players coming up behind that team so they keep trying to fix it with transfers. They don't have resources to put into high school kids because they need to win now so they use scholarships on 1 year portal players. They will have to do it again this year.

While all that is true, I still tend to believe that year was more fluke than not. Their defense was good, no doubt. But even with all that, their title game run was because an NFL talent return man had 3 returns for TD’s, accounting for 21 points in two playoff games that they won by a combined 9 points, along with being the focal point of a trick play reverse pass that was tipped for a 2pt conversion in OT to win a game.

AND the only reason that NFL talent player was even at UM was because of the coaching change at MSU caused him to flip his commit.

That screams fluke run if I ever saw one. Especially since they haven’t done anything like it in the other 6 seasons Hauck’s been back, this year being the closest.

[cats2506]

I really dislike saying this, but Hauck is/was a significantly better coach than Ash.

Expand on that.

I don't necessarily disagree but would like to hear why. They both seem to underperform and be a product of their soft regular season schedules and strong conference reputation. Hauck 2.0 rode a punt returner to Frisco but otherwise hasn't done anything special. I say that as a charter member of the Fire Ash Club.

Ash’s teams were remarkably dysfunctional. He didn’t value the in system players much. Guys got away with a TON of stuff. Towards the end of his tenure there was a huge divide between the offensive players/coaches and their defensive counterparts. While some players were talented, they rarely beat teams that were of a similar talent and were generally soft as a team. A poor man’s Eastern Washington if you will.


Ash got by because he came off as a nice guy, but I know enough to have absolutely zero use or respect for him. Plus the crap he pulled with his kid was ******. The university paid a fair amount of money for his useless “services”.

Looking back 10 years, I don't really disagree

[GoldstoneCat]

I really dislike saying this, but Hauck is/was a significantly better coach than Ash.

Expand on that.

I don't necessarily disagree but would like to hear why. They both seem to underperform and be a product of their soft regular season schedules and strong conference reputation. Hauck 2.0 rode a punt returner to Frisco but otherwise hasn't done anything special. I say that as a charter member of the Fire Ash Club.

Ash’s teams were remarkably dysfunctional. He didn’t value the in system players much. Guys got away with a TON of stuff. Towards the end of his tenure there was a huge divide between the offensive players/coaches and their defensive counterparts. While some players were talented, they rarely beat teams that were of a similar talent and were generally soft as a team. A poor man’s Eastern Washington if you will.


Ash got by because he came off as a nice guy, but I know enough to have absolutely zero use or respect for him. Plus the crap he pulled with his kid was ******. The university paid a fair amount of money for his useless “services”.

I agree hauck is better but the trend is remarkably similar. They could be looking at 7-5 next year with a bad defense.