WBB COACHES

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Cataholic
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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by Cataholic » Sun Apr 18, 2021 11:13 am

Catlady wrote:
Sat Apr 17, 2021 7:03 pm
coloradocat wrote:
Sat Apr 17, 2021 3:30 pm
I still don't see a problem here. Why do women need to coach men? Or is this just something new to get mad about? Like I said before, if you want more female head coaches in WBB then that seems like something worth discussing, but the absence of female head coaches in MBB seems like an exercise in looking for a problem.
So........ thinking like you! If women shouldn’t coach Men, why do Men need to Coach women?
🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
I thought it was about best qualified? I guess that only refers to WBB!
Sad that in 2021 we still have dinosaurs 😂
Hi Cat Lady. Sorry for the trip back to the dark ages with some of these guys. There is no question that there are female coaches qualified to coach a men’s team. The problem seems to be within the whole coaching profession and not just college basketball. How many women’s coaches do you see for boys high school basketball in Montana? I know some assistants, but I can’t think of one female that is a head coach at a Montana high school. Even youth basketball for boys travel basketball rarely has a female head coach. On the flip side, women regularly coach the girls teams in high school.

While institutions could do more to encourage females to apply, I think it is rare for a female to even apply for a men’s team job. I think this is a societal issue for this specific profession that is so ingrained in this industry, that female coaches don’t even consider applying for men’s teams. I want to emphasize that this is not right - but it will probably take Becky Hammond to be successful as a men’s coach before other females start to even pursue similar positions.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by tetoncat » Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:51 pm

On one hand we are commenting that there are no women coaching men's programs but when asked no one is able to name any that applied. Then we are blaming the system. If they are not applying the will never be hired. If they are being beat out by someone the hiring committee feels is better do be it. They should not be hired just because we feel that we need more women coaches. Griz just hired a male to coach their women's team. Pretty accomplished do should they have not hired him.


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by Ilikecats » Sun Apr 18, 2021 6:09 pm

Tetoncat......

There’s a lot of recruiting going on during a search process. If you just apply, your chances of getting the job are slim. Boosters, administrators all have favorites and recruit them as candidates. It’s truly not an application process. I believe the reason there’s a lack of females in line for HC jobs is due to some of the thinking you see on this forum. There’s a belief that women cannot coach men. There’s also a belief that men are better suited to lead programs. Even when the players are female. It’s a sad commentary on our society.

I’m not privy to Montana’s search process. I do know that a former WNBA player and Assistant Coach at the University of Texas was a finalist and did not get the job. She also serves as the Assistant Director with Women’s USA National team! She played at Stanford and Texas in college and her career has been spectacular. It’s not my place to question the search committee’s decision to not hire her, but let’s drop the crap about female candidates not being qualified.

Coach Binford has been inspiring in what she’s done in her career as a player and Coach. It’s awesome that she took an opportunity and built a quality program....... one of the best in the Big Sky. I have no doubt that her skills as a coach and program manager would translate to coaching Men’s Basketball. Luckily she’s at a progressive institution and she’s being compensated based on her positive results. I like what she’s done with Blaire and Peyton in giving them the opportunity to become part of her coaching tree!



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by tetoncat » Sun Apr 18, 2021 6:28 pm

Not sure the crap your talking about. My initial post was simply hire the best applicant. I do think these days people look for issues for everything. My point is simple. I agree it would be good to have more female coaches. I disagree that it should get to a point that schools have to have so many in the pool, or in final interview. It leads to quotas which I oppose.


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by grizzh8r » Sun Apr 18, 2021 8:05 pm

tetoncat wrote:
Sun Apr 18, 2021 6:28 pm
Not sure the crap your talking about. My initial post was simply hire the best applicant. I do think these days people look for issues for everything. My point is simple. I agree it would be good to have more female coaches. I disagree that it should get to a point that schools have to have so many in the pool, or in final interview. It leads to quotas which I oppose.
You mean just like how United has sworn to ensure 50% of pilots in their fleet will be anything but white males? Dunno about you, but establishing arbitrary quotas like that is absurd. I don't care who pilots the plane I'm flying on. It could be a black female who wants to be a man, so long as they are the absolute best of the best at their job. But getting ANY job should be based on talent alone, not any other factor that's completely unrelated to talent. Should we be establishing quotas for males in nursing, just because it is a field dominated by females?


Eric Curry STILL makes me sad.
94VegasCat wrote:Are you for real? That is just a plain ol dumb paragraph! You just nailed every note in the Full Retard sing-a-long choir!!!
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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by Catlady » Sun Apr 18, 2021 8:51 pm

I’m not a fan of quota’s unfortunately it’s used as a way to combat racism and sexism. United wants diverse, well trained and certified pilots, But they also want their pilots to be as diverse as their passengers. Why is that a problem?

I’d more than be happy to see quotas go away if society would end discrimination. People just want the chance to compete! They want to be judge on their capabilities, not their sex or the color of their skin.

Again, there isn’t one female head coach in D1 Men’s basketball. I forgot.... they’re not qualified so they don't apply! 🤷‍♀️



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by Griz__00 » Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:34 pm

Catlady wrote:
Sun Apr 18, 2021 8:51 pm
I’m not a fan of quota’s unfortunately it’s used as a way to combat racism and sexism. United wants diverse, well trained and certified pilots, But they also want their pilots to be as diverse as their passengers. Why is that a problem?

I’d more than be happy to see quotas go away if society would end discrimination. People just want the chance to compete! They want to be judge on their capabilities, not their sex or the color of their skin.

Again, there isn’t one female head coach in D1 Men’s basketball. I forgot.... they’re not qualified so they don't apply! 🤷‍♀️
Once again, name me one single female who has experience coaching division 1 MENS basketball and is qualified to be a MENS basketball head coach. Watch a game of women’s basketball, and then watch a game of men’s basketball, and come back and tell me they are even close to played the same way.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by Ilikecats » Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:35 am

Edniesha Curry is an assistant coach on the University of Maine men’s basketball team. She is the lone female assistant coach in all of Division I men’s college basketball, and the first 16 years. She’s the fourth woman in history to serve in this role, following the footsteps of Bernadette Mattox, an assistant at Kentucky from 1990 to 1995; Stephanie Ready, an assistant at Coppin State from 1999 to 2001, and Jennifer Johnston, an assistant at Oakland from 1999 to 2002.

Yup, there’s been coaches and they feel the game is the same. The hiring process they feel is difficult because 90% of the AD’s are Men and they’ve formed relationships with coaches over the years. They’re not asking for a handout, just an opportunity.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by tetoncat » Mon Apr 19, 2021 4:10 pm

Catlady wrote:
Sun Apr 18, 2021 8:51 pm
I’m not a fan of quota’s unfortunately it’s used as a way to combat racism and sexism. United wants diverse, well trained and certified pilots, But they also want their pilots to be as diverse as their passengers. Why is that a problem?

I’d more than be happy to see quotas go away if society would end discrimination. People just want the chance to compete! They want to be judge on their capabilities, not their sex or the color of their skin.

Again, there isn’t one female head coach in D1 Men’s basketball. I forgot.... they’re not qualified so they don't apply! 🤷‍♀️
Show any where in this thread where someone has said that none are qualified. You are picking a fight for the sake of an argument. I know you will take this the wrong way, so up front I am not saying female coaches need a training program. But, if United said they were going to implement a program to create more qualified pilots that's are minority or female in order to have a diverse crew wouldn't that be better than just saying they are committed to hiring a certain percentage with arbitrary goal dates.


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by tetoncat » Mon Apr 19, 2021 4:13 pm

Ilikecats wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:35 am
Edniesha Curry is an assistant coach on the University of Maine men’s basketball team. She is the lone female assistant coach in all of Division I men’s college basketball, and the first 16 years. She’s the fourth woman in history to serve in this role, following the footsteps of Bernadette Mattox, an assistant at Kentucky from 1990 to 1995; Stephanie Ready, an assistant at Coppin State from 1999 to 2001, and Jennifer Johnston, an assistant at Oakland from 1999 to 2002.

Yup, there’s been coaches and they feel the game is the same. The hiring process they feel is difficult because 90% of the AD’s are Men and they’ve formed relationships with coaches over the years. They’re not asking for a handout, just an opportunity.
Yet these same name AD'S sometimes hire women for women's sports. So they must have had a relationship with them as well.


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by mslacat » Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:13 pm

Little surprised to see this has not been mentioned. 3-4 Days ago it was announced former Bobcat Women's assistant head coach Nate Harris left his Angelo State (D-2) Women’s Head Basketball Coach to take an assistants job for the Lady Griz. Harris left MSU to take an assistants job with Angelo St
and to be the coach in waiting when the then current head coach announce he would only coach 1 more year before retiring. Nate took over the following year and has been at Angelo St HC for the past 2 year. I talked to Nate just after he announced he was resigning from MSU. At the time he said he felt Binford, no matter how successful Binford was going to be he did not see her moving on/up any time soon and he felt the Angelo St. opportunity was his best option to move up the coaching ranks

How Harrison got his job at MSU: Nate is one of the few assistant coaches that I know of that actually won his first D-1 job on the court. About 8-10 year ago (to lazy to look up the exact dates) MSU played MSU-B two year in a row, and MSU-B won both years. MSU-B won by playing tough, tough defense against MSU, and the architect of the MSU-B defense was an assistant Nate Harris. Binford Noticed. That year MSU had an assistant coach opening at the end of the year, I am not even sure if Binford interviewed any other candidates but Harris was her guy.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by Bobcat4Ever » Sat May 01, 2021 3:57 am

Well, that’s a bummer. We missed him when he left, and I’m not happy we have to face him in the conference.
Last edited by Bobcat4Ever on Sun May 02, 2021 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by rivercat » Sun May 02, 2021 8:26 pm

I wondered why he left MSU. There was a noticeable drop in defense for a year or two after Nate left.

Yeah, not happy to see him on that side of the divide. I think the Lady griz will be in the upper echelons of the BSC sooner than later. On the bright side, having 4 strong teams pushing each other could raise the BSC to be a mid-major power. The Summit put both S. Dakota and S Dakota State in the tournament this year with decent seeds. I hope to see that happen with the BSC someday.


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by ilovethecats » Mon May 03, 2021 10:09 am

I'm sure there are many reasons why women aren't coaching mens basketball, one of them likely being some sort of sexism.

That said, I would ask two questions I think are important while trying to figure this out.

The first would be, how many womens coaches are there right now in the college ranks total. Not just head coaches but all coaches. In my experience in coaching about 20 years ago, men seemed to make up the majority of coaches in both high school and college. Even working summer camps in which gilrs could coach as well as we needed all the help we could get, it was mainly men who signed up. Are there enough women after high school, or even within high school that WANT to coach. It seems to me that if men make up something like 70-80% of the "workforce", that would play a factor down the road in regards to head coaching jobs. If one women applied for a HC position compared to 8-9 men, that would be tough sledding. Not because she couldn't be more qualified, but by the sheer numbers themselves.

I'd be curious if these numbers are available. Just seems to me that more men than women have chosen to make coaching their profession after high school or college, but I could be way off there.

Next, and following the same line of thought as my first question, how many women WANT to coach mens basketball? Again, if the numbers show that a huge majority of women are wanting and applying for these jobs, then I would agree we have an issue as there are a ton of very qualified womens coaches out there. But if there are only a handful of women with these aspirations, and far more men with the same aspirations, it would likely be a big factor in why we're seeing what we see with way more men as head coaches than women.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by AFCAT » Mon May 03, 2021 10:17 am

rivercat wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 8:26 pm
I wondered why he left MSU. There was a noticeable drop in defense for a year or two after Nate left.

Yeah, not happy to see him on that side of the divide. I think the Lady griz will be in the upper echelons of the BSC sooner than later. On the bright side, having 4 strong teams pushing each other could raise the BSC to be a mid-major power. The Summit put both S. Dakota and S Dakota State in the tournament this year with decent seeds. I hope to see that happen with the BSC someday.
His arrival certainly helped with the rise of the Cats, but his departure doesn't indicate any worsening of the defense.

2014-15 - scoring defense 8th
2015-16 - scoring defense 6th
2016-17 - scoring defense 4th
2017-18 - scoring defense 4th
2018-19 - scoring defense 4th
2019-20 - scoring defense 3rd
2020-21 - scoring defense 2nd


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by rivercat » Mon May 03, 2021 8:59 pm

AFCAT wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 10:17 am
rivercat wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 8:26 pm
I wondered why he left MSU. There was a noticeable drop in defense for a year or two after Nate left.

Yeah, not happy to see him on that side of the divide. I think the Lady griz will be in the upper echelons of the BSC sooner than later. On the bright side, having 4 strong teams pushing each other could raise the BSC to be a mid-major power. The Summit put both S. Dakota and S Dakota State in the tournament this year with decent seeds. I hope to see that happen with the BSC someday.
His arrival certainly helped with the rise of the Cats, but his departure doesn't indicate any worsening of the defense.

2014-15 - scoring defense 8th
2015-16 - scoring defense 6th
2016-17 - scoring defense 4th
2017-18 - scoring defense 4th
2018-19 - scoring defense 4th
2019-20 - scoring defense 3rd
2020-21 - scoring defense 2nd
That's surprising. Sometimes what you think you see on the court doesn't prove out in statistics. My kids played high level hockey. Some players would be all over the ice skating like crazy and you'd think they were really good but ultimately made no impact on the game. Thanks for the research.


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by Bobcat4Ever » Tue May 04, 2021 3:47 am

Interesting. Maybe it was the 4th place plateau that felt like a struggle because otherwise they were improving every year. Did you happen to notice the points per game allowed for those years.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by dwainegf » Tue May 04, 2021 7:32 am

Scoring defense can be a misleading stat if it is used in a per game manner. The stat should be points allowed per possession. The reason is if a team plays a slow tempo, the other team will likely get few possessions and therefor score fewer points. I don't know what statistic was used in this case, I do know that this is often used to help prop up sometimes mediocre coaches.



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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by AFCAT » Tue May 04, 2021 11:41 am

rivercat wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:59 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 10:17 am
rivercat wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 8:26 pm
I wondered why he left MSU. There was a noticeable drop in defense for a year or two after Nate left.

Yeah, not happy to see him on that side of the divide. I think the Lady griz will be in the upper echelons of the BSC sooner than later. On the bright side, having 4 strong teams pushing each other could raise the BSC to be a mid-major power. The Summit put both S. Dakota and S Dakota State in the tournament this year with decent seeds. I hope to see that happen with the BSC someday.
His arrival certainly helped with the rise of the Cats, but his departure doesn't indicate any worsening of the defense.

2014-15 - scoring defense 8th - 68 points per game
2015-16 - scoring defense 6th - 65.5 points per game
2016-17 - scoring defense 4th - 64.7 points per game
2017-18 - scoring defense 4th - 66.3 points per game
2018-19 - scoring defense 4th - 66.4 points per game
2019-20 - scoring defense 3rd - 62.5 points per game
2020-21 - scoring defense 2nd - 63.4 points per game
That's surprising. Sometimes what you think you see on the court doesn't prove out in statistics. My kids played high level hockey. Some players would be all over the ice skating like crazy and you'd think they were really good but ultimately made no impact on the game. Thanks for the research.


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Re: WBB COACHES

Post by tetoncat » Tue May 04, 2021 1:20 pm

dwainegf wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 7:32 am
Scoring defense can be a misleading stat if it is used in a per game manner. The stat should be points allowed per possession. The reason is if a team plays a slow tempo, the other team will likely get few possessions and therefor score fewer points. I don't know what statistic was used in this case, I do know that this is often used to help prop up sometimes mediocre coaches.
What is more important is the trend and the trend here has been excellent


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