MSU women suffer first BSC loss

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John K
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MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by John K » Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:48 pm

MSU women couldn't buy a basket down the stretch and lose to Idaho 69-68 in double OT, to fall to 4-1 in conference. Liz and Natalie Klinker from Fairfield play for UI. Liz started out at Utah State, and transferred to Idaho, and the oldest sister Molly played for UM. I dont know how we missed out on all 3 of them, considering their dad is a big Bobcat fan. The MSU men were on the other side of an equally close game and an almost identical score, beating UI 71-68, with Harold Frey converting a 3-point play at the end to seal the deal.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by Bobcat4Ever » Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:01 pm

Layups. Composure. Need work.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by aucat » Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:10 am

Bad games happen but what bothered me the most were the 14 offensive rebounds by Idaho that led to a bunch of points. That’s basic stuff. Pure fundamentals. It’s called BOXING OUT!!



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by iaafan » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:43 am

John K wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:48 pm
MSU women couldn't buy a basket down the stretch and lose to Idaho 69-68 in double OT, to fall to 4-1 in conference. Liz and Natalie Klinker from Fairfield play for UI. Liz started out at Utah State, and transferred to Idaho, and the oldest sister Molly played for UM. I dont know how we missed out on all 3 of them, considering their dad is a big Bobcat fan. The MSU men were on the other side of an equally close game and an almost identical score, beating UI 71-68, with Harold Frey converting a 3-point play at the end to seal the deal.
Who would you trade out our nine player rotation for the Klinker sisters?



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by iaafan » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:48 am

aucat wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:10 am
Bad games happen but what bothered me the most were the 14 offensive rebounds by Idaho that led to a bunch of points. That’s basic stuff. Pure fundamentals. It’s called BOXING OUT!!
I wasn’t at the game, so you’re probably right that they weren’t boxing out. However, I go to lots of basketball games at various levels and whenever the opposing team gets an offensive rebound, a lot of people automatically scream BOX OUT! They do this regardless of whether or not someone actually failed to box out or not. Boxing out doesn’t guarantee getting all of your opponents missed shots.

MSU outrebounded Idaho 51-49, including 19-14 on the offensive glass.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by iaafan » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:56 am

Bobcat4Ever wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:01 pm
Layups. Composure. Need work.
A player for Idaho scored 14 over her average.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by Catlady » Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:05 am

Braxton had 5 offensive Rebs, Smith had 3. I thought the issue last night was composure. I love the aggressiveness of White and Jackson, but they took some ill advised shots. They’re freshmen so that’s to be expected, but last night should’ve been a huge teaching moment for Binford. Jackson went 1 on 5 often in the last quarter and White went 1-14 from the field, but didn’t hesitate to keep shooting. Tough to have two freshmen on the floor in the last 4 minutes. Tough loss in a game we probably should’ve won! 3 pt defense in the 4th quarter was horrendous. Scouting report was clear that number 23 loves shooting the three, but was often left open. Refs seem to reward Idaho for their constant flopping after setting picks. Seems like our players should’ve known that from the scouting report. Kuderer never figured it out!



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by Ilikecats » Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:27 am

I agree that the Freshmen were in a tough situation in OT, but Squires was injured and Jackson did provide a spark. Also want to note that Braxton’s 5 offensive rebounds was in 19 minutes of play. We missed a ton of layups and was a little loose with the ball. When you have a talent like White, you have to provide some guidance. I’m ok with her taking 14 shots, but her misses were bad. Going to be important to give her some leadership as the season develops. I thought she shot us out of the game last night. I would spend an extra 30 minutes working on 3pt defense until this team gets it right. Everyone on the court knew what Idaho was going to do, but our players looked lost!



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by aucat » Fri Jan 10, 2020 1:22 pm

Actually, the bottom line is: MSU was outcoached. The Idaho coach is really a good one and he had a great plan for exploiting MSU's weaknesses. I could accept this loss if it had been on the road, but to lose a game like this at home is inexcusable. But like I said earlier, bad games do happen, and this was really a poor performance. I DO feel if Squires had not been injured, MSU would have pulled it out.

For those of you who feel the 14 offensive rebounds that led to 23 points were not a big deal (you know, there was not a problem with our players not properly boxing out) here is what Colton Pool reported in the Bozeman Chronicle today, quoting straight from Coach Binford's mouth as well as Fallyn Freije and Madeline Smith:

MSU head coach Tricia Binford, Smith and Freije all pointed to Idaho’s 23 second-chance points as crucial.

“We gave up some clutch ‘O’ boards to them,” Smith said, “and that got us to where we were.”



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by Ilikecats » Fri Jan 10, 2020 2:41 pm

Not my intention to second guess Binford’s analysis of the reason for the loss, but MSU had 19 offensive rebounds and we had one player with 5, Idaho had 14. I agree that they did a great job of making the most of their offensive rebounds. They had 23 second chance points, MSU had 16. We had three players that were a combined 8-38 from the field. That’s the reason we did not win the game. Our bench scored 20 points and their bench scored 13. We also pounded them in points in the paint and points off turnovers, but when the game was on the line and we had built a decent lead, we got lazy on ball screen defense, and they made us pay. I do agree we got out coached, but I don’t see the accountability for the laziness on defense. Until Binford makes a commitment to defense, we are always going to struggle in close games. When we won the Big Sky a couple of seasons ago, Ferris, Nordgaard, Hatcher, Junkermeir and Braxton tried to shut teams down. I don’t see that kind of intensity right now. We don’t dive on the floor for loose balls and we don’t make the opponent pay if they flop on a ball screen.
Binford should’ve pulled White and Jackson to the side and coached them up during pressure situations. Maybe tell White.... hey your shot isn’t on tonight let’s get the ball to one of your teammates on this possession! I saw Jackson run a fast break when Idaho had 5 players back on defense. She failed miserably but that’s when a coach needs to reemphasize the need to hold the ball the last minute. That’s where we lost the game. We lost our composure the last couple of minutes in the 4th quarter and in overtime. Binford and the Seniors need to lead. I can only imagine what would’ve happened to White or Jackson if they played hero ball when Norgaard or Ferris were on the floor!



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by aucat » Fri Jan 10, 2020 3:07 pm

Frankly, I wondered if some of our players were sick last night. Something was missing and maybe a couple were under the weather



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by John K » Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:14 pm

iaafan wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:43 am
John K wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:48 pm
MSU women couldn't buy a basket down the stretch and lose to Idaho 69-68 in double OT, to fall to 4-1 in conference. Liz and Natalie Klinker from Fairfield play for UI. Liz started out at Utah State, and transferred to Idaho, and the oldest sister Molly played for UM. I dont know how we missed out on all 3 of them, considering their dad is a big Bobcat fan. The MSU men were on the other side of an equally close game and an almost identical score, beating UI 71-68, with Harold Frey converting a 3-point play at the end to seal the deal.
Who would you trade out our nine player rotation for the Klinker sisters?
They are both part of the rotation for a team that beat us on our home court last night, and Liz is good enough to have been originally signed by Utah State coming out of high school. Based upon that, it seems likely that they'd both be good enough to play for us too.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by Catlady » Fri Jan 10, 2020 5:35 pm

I’m not sure what the point is to this. They chose other schools and I’m happy for them. We have a great team and I’m excited about this season. I’d love to have Zion Williamson on our men’s team, but he chose Duke. No disrespect to the Klinker’s but I like our team!



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by BelgradeBobcat » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:20 pm

The Klinkers are good solid role players for Idaho, but neither would beat out Madeline Smith or Blaire Braxton.
I still can't figure out how we lost that game. Shots just didn't want to go down-and almost everybody was way off on their shot...except Kuderer, but I think she only shot it twice from three point range and hit both. Squires seemed to be warming up a bit, but then got hurt. That was probably the key right there.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by Bobcat4Ever » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:11 pm

@BelgradeBobcat I know how you feel. All games like that can be said to be lost by a missed free throw in the first quarter or any other opportunity not taken. The layup bugaboo did bite again last night, not least because of their rather violent style of defense. But given the cards we were dealt, from memory we had at least three opportunities to end that one in our favor. This is not an indictment of our team, but my memories of what went wrong. I love this team, love to watch them play. I believe we had six or seven empty possessions with the score 54-48. Any score there may have won it. We had some forced shots and at least one layup that went awry. Composure. An excellent chance was with a great steal that nearly would have allowed us to run the clock out, but it was immediately turned over. Composure. Clock awareness was missing a couple of times. We missed Oliana, plain and simple, after she got hurt. We needed on-court leadership to steady the ship. I also thought we missed having everyone on the same page when a defensive rebound was in play and Idaho recovered it. By the time we got into any semblance of defense they had found their shooter and bingo. We did a great job of holding her down during transition and half court play. But on some of those long rebounds that caromed around we had everyone chasing and no staying home on an extremely good shooter. It’s frustrating but we’ll be okay. By tournament time our freshmen will be sophomores. From what I have seen we have at least as much quality athleticism and depth as any team. Stay the course. “Trust the system.” — J. Choate, 2019-2020.

Go ‘Cats. With favorable weather and health I’ll see you all in Cedar City on March 4th.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by rivercat » Fri Jan 10, 2020 10:11 pm

Wow. A lot of you need to relax. Idaho was picked second in the BSC because they are good. Idaho played well. MSU was a little off. It's not the end of the world. It seems like starting conference play 4-0 with most being dominant wins has set expectation at perfection.


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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by bobcat2651 » Sat Jan 11, 2020 9:37 am

lot of missed layups, when you are double or triple teamed going to the basket someone close by is open. keep playing hard you are getting better



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by Ilikecats » Sat Jan 11, 2020 9:53 am

bobcat2651 wrote:
Sat Jan 11, 2020 9:37 am
lot of missed layups, when you are double or triple teamed going to the basket someone close by is open. keep playing hard you are getting better
That’s 100% correct! This was the first game that I thought we got more than a little selfish. Good post!



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by aucat » Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:37 pm

If you want to win championships you have to protect your home court. We didn't do this. So basically this team will need to go on the road and win a big one. We will have several opportunities. The first one is today against Portland State, who DOMINATED Idaho 74-53 on Jan. 2. Then we will have big games at UM and Idaho on the road in early Feb. So we will know very soon just what kind of team we have. If we play anything CLOSE to the way we played on our home court against Idaho, we will lose all three of those games. I don't expect that to happen though. I don't see how we can play that bad again.



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Re: MSU women suffer first BSC loss

Post by BobcatDel » Sat Jan 11, 2020 2:07 pm

rivercat wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 10:11 pm
Wow. A lot of you need to relax. Idaho was picked second in the BSC because they are good. Idaho played well. MSU was a little off. It's not the end of the world. It seems like starting conference play 4-0 with most being dominant wins has set expectation at perfection.
Boy you got that right! A guy was up behind me chewing on Fallyn whole game on her play. She drew a cheap foul so had to sit a long time due to 3 fouls. Then gets hurt in Q3 and is taken to locker room but returns. She comes out and is playing in pain in Q4 (you could see her wince a couple times as she tried to get a move to the bucket)..finishes just 1 point short of her averaging, pulls in 9 boards, shoots 100% from FT line.

So you got a kid playing her hind end off and playing through pain and as a fan you sit on your backside and gripe. I see a lot of that going on here.



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