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More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:14 am
by catatac
Looking at some numbers showing the differences between states with very different Covid policies, and also showing the U.S. as a whole. See below.

Deaths per 100,000 Seniors (65+):

United States - 691
California - 608
New York - 534
Florida - 492

On the surface I look at this data and it tells me all the lockdowns and mandates don't change $#%&, virus gonna virus. Maybe somebody can tell me where I'm wrong.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:34 am
by MSU01
Well, for one thing we would need to be sure that the data reporting in each of the states you listed is accurate and was done consistently. In the case of Florida, there have been many allegations that they are manipulating data or hiding data to make their numbers not look as bad as they really are. I'd take those death rates you posted with a very large grain of salt.

I think you're very wrong when you say that lockdowns and mandates don't change anything. Cases plummeted back last Spring in the areas in which stricter lockdowns were in place. The reason cases exploded again was because the lockdowns and mandates (whether you like them or not) that were working were ended or relaxed before we really had the virus under control. In hindsight given that there was a worldwide resurgence of the virus in the fall, I think it's entirely valid to argue that we never should've locked down like we did, but instead just gone with the strategy of social distancing and mask wearing as much as possible while keeping things open. But that doesn't mean that the lockdowns didn't have the effect they were intended to have at the times they were in place.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:12 am
by TomCat88
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:14 am
Looking at some numbers showing the differences between states with very different Covid policies, and also showing the U.S. as a whole. See below.

Deaths per 100,000 people:

United States - 691
California - 608
New York - 534
Florida - 492

On the surface I look at this data and it tells me all the lockdowns and mandates don't change $#%&, virus gonna virus. Maybe somebody can tell me where I'm wrong.
Where did you find these numbers?

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:17 am
by RickRund
Didn't want to derail the Football posts so will bring this question here.

Kids are vaccinated for several diseases to immunize them. People that take the seasonal flu vaccines take them to immunize against getting the flu. From a few posts I have seen the covid vaccines may not immunize us against covid, they may just give our bodies a boost to fight the covid. Have I worded the question correctly? In other words it won't stop you from being infected, just make it a lesser case.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:24 am
by MSU01
RickRund wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:17 am
Didn't want to derail the Football posts so will bring this question here.

Kids are vaccinated for several diseases to immunize them. People that take the seasonal flu vaccines take them to immunize against getting the flu. From a few posts I have seen the covid vaccines may not immunize us against covid, they may just give our bodies a boost to fight the covid. Have I worded the question correctly? In other words it won't stop you from being infected, just make it a lesser case.
There's no difference between how the Covid vaccine works and how the flu vaccine works. Neither prevents infection - either type of virus can still get into your body if you are exposed to it, whether you're vaccinated or not vaccinated. What the vaccines do is to build antibodies that help your immune system to fight off the virus more effectively so that if you are exposed, you are much less likely to become sick or have a severe illness.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:46 am
by catatac
MSU01 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:34 am
Well, for one thing we would need to be sure that the data reporting in each of the states you listed is accurate and was done consistently. In the case of Florida, there have been many allegations that they are manipulating data or hiding data to make their numbers not look as bad as they really are. I'd take those death rates you posted with a very large grain of salt.

I think you're very wrong when you say that lockdowns and mandates don't change anything. Cases plummeted back last Spring in the areas in which stricter lockdowns were in place. The reason cases exploded again was because the lockdowns and mandates (whether you like them or not) that were working were ended or relaxed before we really had the virus under control. In hindsight given that there was a worldwide resurgence of the virus in the fall, I think it's entirely valid to argue that we never should've locked down like we did, but instead just gone with the strategy of social distancing and mask wearing as much as possible while keeping things open. But that doesn't mean that the lockdowns didn't have the effect they were intended to have at the times they were in place.
Thanks for the info, good points. I'm in the camp bolded above. Sources for this data linked below.

ourworldindata.org
covidtracking.com
census.gov

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 2:08 pm
by Cataholic
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:14 am
Looking at some numbers showing the differences between states with very different Covid policies, and also showing the U.S. as a whole. See below.

Deaths per 100,000 people:

United States - 691
California - 608
New York - 534
Florida - 492

On the surface I look at this data and it tells me all the lockdowns and mandates don't change $#%&, virus gonna virus. Maybe somebody can tell me where I'm wrong.
This is pretty interesting. Another factor to consider is the age demographics of each state. I am guessing the average age in Florida is higher than either NY or CA. That should translate to more deaths per 100,000 in FL which the data does not show.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 2:17 pm
by TomCat88
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:46 am
MSU01 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:34 am
Well, for one thing we would need to be sure that the data reporting in each of the states you listed is accurate and was done consistently. In the case of Florida, there have been many allegations that they are manipulating data or hiding data to make their numbers not look as bad as they really are. I'd take those death rates you posted with a very large grain of salt.

I think you're very wrong when you say that lockdowns and mandates don't change anything. Cases plummeted back last Spring in the areas in which stricter lockdowns were in place. The reason cases exploded again was because the lockdowns and mandates (whether you like them or not) that were working were ended or relaxed before we really had the virus under control. In hindsight given that there was a worldwide resurgence of the virus in the fall, I think it's entirely valid to argue that we never should've locked down like we did, but instead just gone with the strategy of social distancing and mask wearing as much as possible while keeping things open. But that doesn't mean that the lockdowns didn't have the effect they were intended to have at the times they were in place.
Thanks for the info, good points. I'm in the camp bolded above. Sources for this data linked below.

ourworldindata.org
covidtrackng.com
census.gov
Unless I’m mistaken those numbers translate to something like 2.2 million deaths (it’s 500,000) in the USA. 691 deaths per 100,000 is 691 x 3,300. Someone check my math on that please. Not sure I’m right.

California would be 182,000, but it’s actually shy of 50,000. Again, please check my math.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 3:37 pm
by catatac
TomCat88 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 2:17 pm
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:46 am
MSU01 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:34 am
Well, for one thing we would need to be sure that the data reporting in each of the states you listed is accurate and was done consistently. In the case of Florida, there have been many allegations that they are manipulating data or hiding data to make their numbers not look as bad as they really are. I'd take those death rates you posted with a very large grain of salt.

I think you're very wrong when you say that lockdowns and mandates don't change anything. Cases plummeted back last Spring in the areas in which stricter lockdowns were in place. The reason cases exploded again was because the lockdowns and mandates (whether you like them or not) that were working were ended or relaxed before we really had the virus under control. In hindsight given that there was a worldwide resurgence of the virus in the fall, I think it's entirely valid to argue that we never should've locked down like we did, but instead just gone with the strategy of social distancing and mask wearing as much as possible while keeping things open. But that doesn't mean that the lockdowns didn't have the effect they were intended to have at the times they were in place.
Thanks for the info, good points. I'm in the camp bolded above. Sources for this data linked below.

ourworldindata.org
covidtracking.com
census.gov
Unless I’m mistaken those numbers translate to something like 2.2 million deaths (it’s 500,000) in the USA. 691 deaths per 100,000 is 691 x 3,300. Someone check my math on that please. Not sure I’m right.

California would be 182,000, but it’s actually shy of 50,000. Again, please check my math.
Good catch. I looked back at the graph I was using for the numbers and those data were for deaths of people over the age of 65. Sorry about that, I corrected it in the original post.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 3:49 pm
by RickRund
MSU01 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:24 am
RickRund wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:17 am
Didn't want to derail the Football posts so will bring this question here.

Kids are vaccinated for several diseases to immunize them. People that take the seasonal flu vaccines take them to immunize against getting the flu. From a few posts I have seen the covid vaccines may not immunize us against covid, they may just give our bodies a boost to fight the covid. Have I worded the question correctly? In other words it won't stop you from being infected, just make it a lesser case.
There's no difference between how the Covid vaccine works and how the flu vaccine works. Neither prevents infection - either type of virus can still get into your body if you are exposed to it, whether you're vaccinated or not vaccinated. What the vaccines do is to build antibodies that help your immune system to fight off the virus more effectively so that if you are exposed, you are much less likely to become sick or have a severe illness.
Thank you. Had no idea that they worked that way. So I guess that 95% efficacy rate, if accurate, make many feel much more safe. When you consider the flu vaccines are roughly 60%+-...

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:46 am
by The Butcher
TomCat88 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:12 am
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:14 am
Looking at some numbers showing the differences between states with very different Covid policies, and also showing the U.S. as a whole. See below.

Deaths per 100,000 people:

United States - 691
California - 608
New York - 534
Florida - 492

On the surface I look at this data and it tells me all the lockdowns and mandates don't change $#%&, virus gonna virus. Maybe somebody can tell me where I'm wrong.
Where did you find these numbers?
These numbers are obviously not correct. We have lost 501,000 Americans... Only off by a few million deaths with these numbers.
Anyway here are real numbers from Johns Hopkins:
Deaths per 100,000 by state:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/states-comparison

Can't argue with people that don't think the spread of COVID can be mitigated. South Dakota's governor said the CA governor's response to COVID was overblown (per a fundraiser she held via Zoom). Deaths per 100,000 in SD 210 while CA is 122. But draw your own conclusion.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:55 am
by catatac
The Butcher wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:46 am
TomCat88 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:12 am
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:14 am
Looking at some numbers showing the differences between states with very different Covid policies, and also showing the U.S. as a whole. See below.

Deaths per 100,000 people:

United States - 691
California - 608
New York - 534
Florida - 492

On the surface I look at this data and it tells me all the lockdowns and mandates don't change $#%&, virus gonna virus. Maybe somebody can tell me where I'm wrong.
Where did you find these numbers?
These numbers are obviously not correct. We have lost 501,000 Americans... Only off by a few million deaths with these numbers.
Anyway here are real numbers from Johns Hopkins:
Deaths per 100,000 by state:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/states-comparison

Can't argue with people that don't think the spread of COVID can be mitigated. South Dakota's governor said the CA governor's response to COVID was overblown (per a fundraiser she held via Zoom). Deaths per 100,000 in SD 210 while CA is 122. But draw your own conclusion.
Yep, I had corrected that above. The numbers I posted were for people 65 and older.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:24 pm
by Cataholic
The Butcher wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:46 am
TomCat88 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:12 am
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:14 am
Looking at some numbers showing the differences between states with very different Covid policies, and also showing the U.S. as a whole. See below.

Deaths per 100,000 people:

United States - 691
California - 608
New York - 534
Florida - 492

On the surface I look at this data and it tells me all the lockdowns and mandates don't change $#%&, virus gonna virus. Maybe somebody can tell me where I'm wrong.
Where did you find these numbers?
These numbers are obviously not correct. We have lost 501,000 Americans... Only off by a few million deaths with these numbers.
Anyway here are real numbers from Johns Hopkins:
Deaths per 100,000 by state:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/states-comparison

Can't argue with people that don't think the spread of COVID can be mitigated. South Dakota's governor said the CA governor's response to COVID was overblown (per a fundraiser she held via Zoom). Deaths per 100,000 in SD 210 while CA is 122. But draw your own conclusion.
Using the chart you provided, NY has a higher deaths per 100,000 than SD. As a matter of fact, FL (140) and TX (146) were significantly lower than NY (239) and they were comparable to CA (124). But hey, draw your own conclusion.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:59 pm
by TomCat88
Cataholic wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:24 pm
The Butcher wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:46 am
TomCat88 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:12 am
catatac wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:14 am
Looking at some numbers showing the differences between states with very different Covid policies, and also showing the U.S. as a whole. See below.

Deaths per 100,000 people:

United States - 691
California - 608
New York - 534
Florida - 492

On the surface I look at this data and it tells me all the lockdowns and mandates don't change $#%&, virus gonna virus. Maybe somebody can tell me where I'm wrong.
Where did you find these numbers?
These numbers are obviously not correct. We have lost 501,000 Americans... Only off by a few million deaths with these numbers.
Anyway here are real numbers from Johns Hopkins:
Deaths per 100,000 by state:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/states-comparison

Can't argue with people that don't think the spread of COVID can be mitigated. South Dakota's governor said the CA governor's response to COVID was overblown (per a fundraiser she held via Zoom). Deaths per 100,000 in SD 210 while CA is 122. But draw your own conclusion.
Using the chart you provided, NY has a higher deaths per 100,000 than SD. As a matter of fact, FL (140) and TX (146) were significantly lower than NY (239) and they were comparable to CA (124). But hey, draw your own conclusion.
It's hard to make comparisons between areas (northeast states) hit hard early in the pandemic with areas that didn't see a surge until months later. The states hit early weren't as prepared as states hit later and will consequently have higher death rates. The top four states in deaths/million are NJ, NY, Rh. Island and Mass. They were also four states hit hard early.

As for SD and ND, they rank 7th and 11th. Their neighbor states are Iowa, Minn. Mont., Wyo., Nebraska. Those five states rank 17, 34, 32, 35 and 38. Based on that, which isn't the only data set, it doesn't look good for SD and ND. There could be other data sets that show something else less damning for SD and ND, but this one is pretty glaring.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:52 am
by The Butcher
TomCat88 wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:59 pm
It's hard to make comparisons between areas (northeast states) hit hard early in the pandemic with areas that didn't see a surge until months later. The states hit early weren't as prepared as states hit later and will consequently have higher death rates. The top four states in deaths/million are NJ, NY, Rh. Island and Mass. They were also four states hit hard early.

As for SD and ND, they rank 7th and 11th. Their neighbor states are Iowa, Minn. Mont., Wyo., Nebraska. Those five states rank 17, 34, 32, 35 and 38. Based on that, which isn't the only data set, it doesn't look good for SD and ND. There could be other data sets that show something else less damning for SD and ND, but this one is pretty glaring.
South Dakota and North Dakota to a lesser extent were proud to tout personal freedom (no restrictions) as COVID spread rapidly. The South Dakota Governor even refused to suggest people wear masks. Without a mask, she famously went to a 3M ribbon cutting ceremony for an expansion specifically for making N95s. Her views have been echoed by citizens and other politicians. You do not have to wear a mask at the Capitol in South Dakota and obviously there was a spreader event immediately when they went into session (see link below). Luckily South Dakota is doing a good job with vaccinations (thanks to the healthcare providers as the Governor has handed them the reigns). Unfortunately a colleague has reported they are seeing an increase in college age young adults contracting the virus a second time. The young adults are not getting any sicker, but the lung tissue has not fully healed resulting in further lung damage. They do not know how long the damage will take to heal or if it could be permanent.

https://www.keloland.com/news/local-new ... -outbreak/

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2021 8:38 am
by The Butcher
The Butcher wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:52 am
Unfortunately a colleague has reported they are seeing an increase in college age young adults contracting the virus a second time.
I seriously jinxed myself. Yesterday we had our first employee test positive for COVID a second time. The person is in their 20s. ](*,)

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Sun Feb 28, 2021 8:05 pm
by wbtfg
Today I looked at the California data broken down by county. It’s fascinating that a huge majority of the Covid cases are in LA and surrounding counties. San Francisco county only has 34k total positive tests.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 9:46 am
by catatac
Looking at the numbers for Covid deaths, the U.S. accounts for 25% of all Covid deaths world wide, yet the U.S. only accounts for 4% of the worlds population. How can there be such a HUGE disparity like this?

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 11:39 am
by BozoneCat
catatac wrote:
Fri Mar 05, 2021 9:46 am
Looking at the numbers for Covid deaths, the U.S. accounts for 25% of all Covid deaths world wide, yet the U.S. only accounts for 4% of the worlds population. How can there be such a HUGE disparity like this?
It's pretty simple. We went through the meat of the pandemic with a president that refused to acknowledge the seriousness of this virus and turned simple preventative measures into a divisive political issue. To boot, Americans are acting like the spoiled, petulant children that most of the rest of the world thinks we are and refusing to take said preventative measures. On top of that, Americans are some of the unhealthiest people on the planet, so when they get COVID, they are at higher risk for more severe symptoms, including death.

Re: More Covid Data

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:11 pm
by Cataholic
catatac wrote:
Fri Mar 05, 2021 9:46 am
Looking at the numbers for Covid deaths, the U.S. accounts for 25% of all Covid deaths world wide, yet the U.S. only accounts for 4% of the worlds population. How can there be such a HUGE disparity like this?
The US has the worlds 3rd largest population of people over 65 years old with 52 million people. Only China and India have more elderly people. We all know that Covid attacks the elderly population so it only makes sense that we would see more deaths with the worlds third largest elderly population. There is very little validity to the numbers that China and India have reported. Russia is a distant 5th having only half of the elderly population of the US. Japan has faired well keeping their numbers down, but they have been wearing masks regularly well before Covid started. Cleanliness has always been a high priority in Japan.

https://www.prb.org/countries-with-the- ... pulations/