Has this ever happened before?

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The Butcher
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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by The Butcher » Mon Dec 14, 2020 12:45 pm

wbtfg wrote:
Sat Dec 12, 2020 3:31 pm
I don’t even know where to post this one. This is craaaaazzzzzy

Trump didn't create the hate and craziness, but he has made it acceptable to fully display.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by Cataholic » Thu Dec 17, 2020 1:17 am

AOC says Democrats need new leadership.

https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/3932396001



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by TomCat88 » Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:28 am

Cataholic wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 1:17 am
AOC says Democrats need new leadership.

https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/3932396001
Great post. So cool to see a politician critical of their own party. Paul Mitchell just bailed out of his party. I’d prefer he had stayed and tried to influence the party to change, but he took a stand at least. Party members do not need to be in lock step with each other. It isn’t a sign of party weakness. It’s a sign of independent, diverse thought within the party.


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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by The Butcher » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:59 am

TomCat88 wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:28 am
Cataholic wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 1:17 am
AOC says Democrats need new leadership.

https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/3932396001
Great post. So cool to see a politician critical of their own party. Paul Mitchell just bailed out of his party. I’d prefer he had stayed and tried to influence the party to change, but he took a stand at least. Party members do not need to be in lock step with each other. It isn’t a sign of party weakness. It’s a sign of independent, diverse thought within the party.
This reminds me of a conversation I had with Senator Barrasso (WY R) after Betsy DeVos was approved for her Cabinet position. I asked the Senator why he would support a person that wanted to give public funding to private schools when Wyoming doesn't have hardly any private schools (additionally Wyoming takes great pride in their public school system). He gave an example of a single private school in Casper (one school out of the whole state!). It was very obvious the decision to confirm was not made in the best interest of his constituents, but rather his party. I won’t pretend that Democrats don’t have to hold their noses on certain decisions, but it seems like the Republican Party has lost their sense of smell entirely.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by wbtfg » Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:36 pm

Lol!!!




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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by wbtfg » Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:20 pm

File this in the category of things I didn’t see coming.....I just saw that Trump sided with Pelosi, AOC, Bernie and “the squad” and said that a $600/person stimulus that was agreed to isn’t enough and needs to be $2000. Now that puts Mitch McConnell and senate republicans in a difficult place as they were strongly against such a high number.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by BigBruceBaker » Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:29 pm

wbtfg wrote:
Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:20 pm
File this in the category of things I didn’t see coming.....I just saw that Trump sided with Pelosi, AOC, Bernie and “the squad” and said that a $600/person stimulus that was agreed to isn’t enough and needs to be $2000. Now that puts Mitch McConnell and senate republicans in a difficult place as they were strongly against such a high number.
Real question, who’s idea was it to put all that insane spending for other countries in this bill? Is that something we always give?


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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by Cataholic » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:50 pm

BigBruceBaker wrote:
Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:29 pm
wbtfg wrote:
Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:20 pm
File this in the category of things I didn’t see coming.....I just saw that Trump sided with Pelosi, AOC, Bernie and “the squad” and said that a $600/person stimulus that was agreed to isn’t enough and needs to be $2000. Now that puts Mitch McConnell and senate republicans in a difficult place as they were strongly against such a high number.
Real question, who’s idea was it to put all that insane spending for other countries in this bill? Is that something we always give?
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/foreig ... ief-uproar

The garbage in this bill is unreal.
Also included in the massive omnibus package is $700 million in aid for Sudan; $135 million for Burma; $1.3 billion in military assistance for Egypt; $506 million for Belize, Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua and Panama as part of the Central America Regional Security Initiative; and much more. 

Roy pointed out that there were "over 60 standalone bills that are unrelated to government funding or COVID relief, such as one regarding how the Dalai Lama is chosen, one to regulate horse racing, and one creating new Smithsonian museums."
And the rush to push it through is ridiculous.
"This bill was produced by legislative malpractice. The people’s representatives were locked out of this process. We didn’t get bill text until just before 2 p.m. Monday," he said. "The bill was almost 5,600 pages long. They didn’t want us to read it. They just wanted us to pass it. Given what is in it, it is easy to see why."



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by wbtfg » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:23 am

BigBruceBaker wrote:
Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:29 pm
wbtfg wrote:
Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:20 pm
File this in the category of things I didn’t see coming.....I just saw that Trump sided with Pelosi, AOC, Bernie and “the squad” and said that a $600/person stimulus that was agreed to isn’t enough and needs to be $2000. Now that puts Mitch McConnell and senate republicans in a difficult place as they were strongly against such a high number.
Real question, who’s idea was it to put all that insane spending for other countries in this bill? Is that something we always give?
That’s a good question, however, it’s something that happens every year when congress approves the omnibus Bill. My understanding is that the omnibus process wraps up multiple bills and puts them all in essentially one spending package. This is an annual process and an opportunity for lawmakers to slip in their pet projects with minimal scrutiny.

It’s a broken system controlled by special interests.

It’s good to see FoxNews finally scrutinizing the budget again. They took a hiatus from that the past few years.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by iaafan » Wed Dec 23, 2020 8:19 am



This would be a great moment for Trump, and America.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by Mtcatfan » Wed Dec 23, 2020 9:30 am

It makes great sense as long as they eliminate all the pork in the bill that has nothing to do with Covid relief and hold the cost of the bill to 900 billion.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by wbtfg » Wed Dec 23, 2020 9:34 am

Mtcatfan wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 9:30 am
It makes great sense as long as they eliminate all the pork in the bill that has nothing to do with Covid relief and hold the cost of the bill to 900 billion.
I don’t thing there is a stand alone Covid relief bill anymore. It’s part of an omnibus with multiple (15?) spending bills packaged together.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by ilovethecats » Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:32 am

iaafan wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 8:19 am


This would be a great moment for Trump, and America.
As a business owner the stimulus stuff is tricky. On one hand, people have gotten absolutely decimated during this pandemic. I know lost lives are most important, and keeping track of daily deaths is relevant, but aside from that, tens of millions of lives and businesses have been ruined. The thought that $1200 9 months ago, and $600 now; or even $2,000 now, even puts a dent in peoples' financial woes is laughable. If we truly cared about containing this virus, and saving lives, we would have taken care of our people.

That said, when people DID get that money, and others were getting extra money even on top of unemployment, that brought on a whole new set of issues. Namely, the fact that many people were making MORE money not working than they were working! Even right now people are hiring all over and it's impossible to find employees. It's really a catch-22. Businesses are already struggling and going under, and if people continue to just get handed money it's only going to get worse.

I'm not smart enough to have a solution for this... #-o



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by iaafan » Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:41 am

ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:32 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 8:19 am


This would be a great moment for Trump, and America.
As a business owner the stimulus stuff is tricky. On one hand, people have gotten absolutely decimated during this pandemic. I know lost lives are most important, and keeping track of daily deaths is relevant, but aside from that, tens of millions of lives and businesses have been ruined. The thought that $1200 9 months ago, and $600 now; or even $2,000 now, even puts a dent in peoples' financial woes is laughable. If we truly cared about containing this virus, and saving lives, we would have taken care of our people.

That said, when people DID get that money, and others were getting extra money even on top of unemployment, that brought on a whole new set of issues. Namely, the fact that many people were making MORE money not working than they were working! Even right now people are hiring all over and it's impossible to find employees. It's really a catch-22. Businesses are already struggling and going under, and if people continue to just get handed money it's only going to get worse.

I'm not smart enough to have a solution for this... #-o
I'm not smart enough either, but don't businesses need people to have money to spend at their businesses. I would think the business community would want as much money going out to people as possible. I also think businesses should be getting money to compensate for lost income. The way money is being doled out to individuals needs some work, but the way they're doing it is better than nothing. I agree with Trump that individuals should get $2,000. I know when I get this money my first thought is to spend it locally. I think the majority of people think the same thing. Folks that are strapped for cash will pay rent (makes landlords happy), buy groceries.

We've failed at containing the virus, which as you said is the #1 priority, so lets not screw up stimulating the economy, too. Their absolutely needs to be another stimulus package after this omnibus thing, which is just a temporary fix IMO.

Note: the reason I called it a great moment is because it would be very nice to see Trump and Pelosi et al come to agreement on something like this. It would be a boost to the morale of the country. I think we all need that.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by ilovethecats » Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:56 am

iaafan wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:41 am
ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:32 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 8:19 am


This would be a great moment for Trump, and America.
As a business owner the stimulus stuff is tricky. On one hand, people have gotten absolutely decimated during this pandemic. I know lost lives are most important, and keeping track of daily deaths is relevant, but aside from that, tens of millions of lives and businesses have been ruined. The thought that $1200 9 months ago, and $600 now; or even $2,000 now, even puts a dent in peoples' financial woes is laughable. If we truly cared about containing this virus, and saving lives, we would have taken care of our people.

That said, when people DID get that money, and others were getting extra money even on top of unemployment, that brought on a whole new set of issues. Namely, the fact that many people were making MORE money not working than they were working! Even right now people are hiring all over and it's impossible to find employees. It's really a catch-22. Businesses are already struggling and going under, and if people continue to just get handed money it's only going to get worse.

I'm not smart enough to have a solution for this... #-o
I'm not smart enough either, but don't businesses need people to have money to spend at their businesses. I would think the business community would want as much money going out to people as possible. I also think businesses should be getting money to compensate for lost income. The way money is being doled out to individuals needs some work, but the way they're doing it is better than nothing. I agree with Trump that individuals should get $2,000. I know when I get this money my first thought is to spend it locally. I think the majority of people think the same thing. Folks that are strapped for cash will pay rent (makes landlords happy), buy groceries.

We've failed at containing the virus, which as you said is the #1 priority, so lets not screw up stimulating the economy, too. Their absolutely needs to be another stimulus package after this omnibus thing, which is just a temporary fix IMO.

Note: the reason I called it a great moment is because it would be very nice to see Trump and Pelosi et al come to agreement on something like this. It would be a boost to the morale of the country. I think we all need that.
These are great points. If we took those hundreds of millions that is for whatever reason going outside of our country, you think we could stimulate the businesses AND the people which I think everyone would agree would be ideal.

I think one could make the case that had they taken these steps in the beginning it would have done wonders containing the virus. Too many people simply had to work to get by, thus being out and about every day.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by iaafan » Wed Dec 23, 2020 12:03 pm

ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:56 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:41 am
ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:32 am
iaafan wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 8:19 am


This would be a great moment for Trump, and America.
As a business owner the stimulus stuff is tricky. On one hand, people have gotten absolutely decimated during this pandemic. I know lost lives are most important, and keeping track of daily deaths is relevant, but aside from that, tens of millions of lives and businesses have been ruined. The thought that $1200 9 months ago, and $600 now; or even $2,000 now, even puts a dent in peoples' financial woes is laughable. If we truly cared about containing this virus, and saving lives, we would have taken care of our people.

That said, when people DID get that money, and others were getting extra money even on top of unemployment, that brought on a whole new set of issues. Namely, the fact that many people were making MORE money not working than they were working! Even right now people are hiring all over and it's impossible to find employees. It's really a catch-22. Businesses are already struggling and going under, and if people continue to just get handed money it's only going to get worse.

I'm not smart enough to have a solution for this... #-o
I'm not smart enough either, but don't businesses need people to have money to spend at their businesses. I would think the business community would want as much money going out to people as possible. I also think businesses should be getting money to compensate for lost income. The way money is being doled out to individuals needs some work, but the way they're doing it is better than nothing. I agree with Trump that individuals should get $2,000. I know when I get this money my first thought is to spend it locally. I think the majority of people think the same thing. Folks that are strapped for cash will pay rent (makes landlords happy), buy groceries.

We've failed at containing the virus, which as you said is the #1 priority, so lets not screw up stimulating the economy, too. Their absolutely needs to be another stimulus package after this omnibus thing, which is just a temporary fix IMO.

Note: the reason I called it a great moment is because it would be very nice to see Trump and Pelosi et al come to agreement on something like this. It would be a boost to the morale of the country. I think we all need that.
These are great points. If we took those hundreds of millions that is for whatever reason going outside of our country, you think we could stimulate the businesses AND the people which I think everyone would agree would be ideal.

I think one could make the case that had they taken these steps in the beginning it would have done wonders containing the virus. Too many people simply had to work to get by, thus being out and about every day.
Yes, we've all but botched the response to Covid in every way possible.

I think the money going outside the country is getting overblown, but the optics are horrendous. The omnibus bill should've been a standalone bill with no Covid funds in it, then there should be a standalone Covid bill. But that''s politics in DC. They couldn't pass many of the bills in the omnibus bill by themselves so they packaged it all together. I don't like it, but I kind of get it. The fact that they're calling this $900 billion in Covid relief is a sham. Call it what it is: an omnibus/covid bill. We definitely need a standalone Covid bill after this, and soon!



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by Cataholic » Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:36 pm

I have not seen anything from Pelosi or AOC or Schumer or Talib saying let’s remove the pork spending and get the checks out to the people. That is Trumps message. Get money into the hands of American people - not spend money on stuff like gender education in Pakistan ($10 million). This bill will not become law unless the garbage is removed. Seriously, how can the government contemplate two additions to the Smithsonian when many people across this country are struggling to make ends meet?



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by wbtfg » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:10 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:36 pm
I have not seen anything from Pelosi or AOC or Schumer or Talib saying let’s remove the pork spending and get the checks out to the people. That is Trumps message. Get money into the hands of American people - not spend money on stuff like gender education in Pakistan ($10 million). This bill will not become law unless the garbage is removed. Seriously, how can the government contemplate two additions to the Smithsonian when many people across this country are struggling to make ends meet?
As I said. There are numerous separate bills that have been packaged together as an omnibus (which has been standard practice).

I think AOC and Pelosi have been saying pass the omnibus and pass a separate amendment that increases the stimulus amount to $2000



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by Cataholic » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:36 pm

wbtfg wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:10 pm
Cataholic wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:36 pm
I have not seen anything from Pelosi or AOC or Schumer or Talib saying let’s remove the pork spending and get the checks out to the people. That is Trumps message. Get money into the hands of American people - not spend money on stuff like gender education in Pakistan ($10 million). This bill will not become law unless the garbage is removed. Seriously, how can the government contemplate two additions to the Smithsonian when many people across this country are struggling to make ends meet?
As I said. There are numerous separate bills that have been packaged together as an omnibus (which has been standard practice).

I think AOC and Pelosi have been saying pass the omnibus and pass a separate amendment that increases the stimulus amount to $2000
Yes, and the omnibus has all kinds of pork in it. The omnibus is not going to happen (and the Covid package as part of it) unless the pork is removed. Adding the Covid package to the omnibus was a way of getting all the pork approved. It will probably not happen even with $2,000 stimulus amount because of all the unnecessary spending in the omnibus. Trump is considering a pocket veto.

No matter what happens, this is another example of the problems we have on capital hill. What a bunch of crap. People are struggling and opportunistic politicians find a way to get their projects funded by attaching the Covid bill. This was no mistake. If the Covid package was separate, this would have been approved with no issues.



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Re: Has this ever happened before?

Post by Hawks86 » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:49 pm

4 years of hibernation.

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