Cure worse than the problem?

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The Butcher
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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by The Butcher » Thu Oct 08, 2020 6:08 pm

RickRund wrote:
Thu Oct 08, 2020 4:49 pm
The Butcher wrote:
Thu Oct 08, 2020 1:21 pm
Onion headline nails the Trump perfectly :lol: :

Trump To Nation: ‘Don’t Let Your Lives Be Dominated By Fear Unless It’s Related To Immigrants’
From a satire site, OK...
The Onion is satire! What!!! 😂🤣😂



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by Cataholic » Sat Oct 10, 2020 7:53 pm

Democrats have been extremely critical of Trump on his handling of Covid and have been pointing to Europe as an example of what should have been done. That has not been a big discussion point recently though as Europe is undergoing a second covid wave and their economies may be heading for another shutdown.

https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbre ... c153994c70



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by The Butcher » Mon Oct 12, 2020 1:26 pm

COVID-19 Stalks A Montana Town Already Grappling With Asbestos Disease

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-sho ... ium=social



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by RickRund » Mon Oct 12, 2020 3:14 pm

The Butcher wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 1:26 pm
COVID-19 Stalks A Montana Town Already Grappling With Asbestos Disease

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-sho ... ium=social
Wow, had no idea. And wasn't aware that vermiculite was a byproduct of asbestos. I am guessing the reason vermiculite is used is it is not friable???



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The Butcher
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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by The Butcher » Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:32 am

The Covid-19 pandemic has claimed far more lives than reported, study says.
On top of that, the U.S. has fared much worse than most high-income countries, a separate study found.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-n ... y-n1242970



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by Cataholic » Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm

Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.




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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by ilovethecats » Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:45 am

Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Are you implying that the $1200 each person got 6 months ago after being forced to stop working and going to school wasn't enough to keep their lives from getting destroyed? That sounds like a huge leap to me. :coffee:



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by The Butcher » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:07 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Pelosi is absolutely right about childcare. There is NO plan for when childcare centers or schools close. That is what I worry about the most. There has been no leadership on the development of a strategy to minimize the potential of closures. Right now if you are exposed they close the whole room or quarantine those in close contact because there is not enough testing available to determine who actually has the virus. To put it into perspective there are 4 school districts in a 50 mile radius where I live and there are 4 different plans on how to operate during this pandemic. How does that make any sense???



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by Cledus » Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:58 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Random act of journalism. Makes you wonder what's really going on. :-k


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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by catatac » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:05 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

She certainly comes off as looking like a scary crazy person, whereas Wolf comes off as calm and collected, wanting to figure out a plan to help people.


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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by Cataholic » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:15 pm

ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:45 am
Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Are you implying that the $1200 each person got 6 months ago after being forced to stop working and going to school wasn't enough to keep their lives from getting destroyed? That sounds like a huge leap to me. :coffee:
I am not sure what you are talking about. I was talking about the strange behavior by Pelosi in her interview with Blitzer.



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by ilovethecats » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:18 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:15 pm
ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:45 am
Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Are you implying that the $1200 each person got 6 months ago after being forced to stop working and going to school wasn't enough to keep their lives from getting destroyed? That sounds like a huge leap to me. :coffee:
I am not sure what you are talking about. I was talking about the strange behavior by Pelosi in her interview with Blitzer.
I was talking about what a joke the "covid relief package" is. As was the first "relief package" 6 months ago. I was joking.... 8)



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by Cataholic » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:23 pm

The Butcher wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:07 pm
Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Pelosi is absolutely right about childcare. There is NO plan for when childcare centers or schools close. That is what I worry about the most. There has been no leadership on the development of a strategy to minimize the potential of closures. Right now if you are exposed they close the whole room or quarantine those in close contact because there is not enough testing available to determine who actually has the virus. To put it into perspective there are 4 school districts in a 50 mile radius where I live and there are 4 different plans on how to operate during this pandemic. How does that make any sense???
I am pretty sure that states (and local jurisdictions) have requested the ability to make their decisions and policies regarding Covid. Can you imagine the pushback if Trump tried to implement a national policy? Heck, when businesses are being rioted, local leaders don’t want federal help and you think they would embrace a federal policy from Trump? And clearly, a Covid policy for New York would be significantly different than policy for Montana.



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by Cataholic » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:29 pm

ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:18 pm
Cataholic wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:15 pm
ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:45 am
Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Are you implying that the $1200 each person got 6 months ago after being forced to stop working and going to school wasn't enough to keep their lives from getting destroyed? That sounds like a huge leap to me. :coffee:
I am not sure what you are talking about. I was talking about the strange behavior by Pelosi in her interview with Blitzer.
I was talking about what a joke the "covid relief package" is. As was the first "relief package" 6 months ago. I was joking.... 8)
Got it👏👏👏. It is a crazy time. I was helping my daughter move into an apartment in August and we went to buy some furniture. It was amazing as many stores were completely out of inventory. It was partly because Covid caused manufacturing delays, but the overriding thought was that people were spending their Covid checks on new stuff - like couches, TV’s, etc.



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by ilovethecats » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:29 pm
ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:18 pm
Cataholic wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:15 pm
ilovethecats wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:45 am
Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

Are you implying that the $1200 each person got 6 months ago after being forced to stop working and going to school wasn't enough to keep their lives from getting destroyed? That sounds like a huge leap to me. :coffee:
I am not sure what you are talking about. I was talking about the strange behavior by Pelosi in her interview with Blitzer.
I was talking about what a joke the "covid relief package" is. As was the first "relief package" 6 months ago. I was joking.... 8)
Got it👏👏👏. It is a crazy time. I was helping my daughter move into an apartment in August and we went to buy some furniture. It was amazing as many stores were completely out of inventory. It was partly because Covid caused manufacturing delays, but the overriding thought was that people were spending their Covid checks on new stuff - like couches, TV’s, etc.
Yep, it's been a perfect storm. Inventory on vehicles, boats, electronics, liquor, etc. is all WAY down. Go try to buy a car right now and you'll be blown away at how little inventory they have. We looked into campers this summer and they had next to nothing.

But smaller things like furniture and electronics were definitely stimulus buys! Which I guess was the whole point. Crazy times.



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by RickRund » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:16 pm

catatac wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:05 pm
Cataholic wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:50 pm
Nancy Pelosi on left leaning CNN with Wolf Blitzer regarding Covid relief package. This has to hurt Democrats. It really is hard to understand how she became a leader of the Democratic Party. They should test her mental acuity.

She certainly comes off as looking like a scary crazy person, whereas Wolf comes off as calm and collected, wanting to figure out a plan to help people.
Heck, for nan that is just ice cream money...



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The Butcher
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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by The Butcher » Thu Oct 15, 2020 7:43 am

Cataholic wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:23 pm

I am pretty sure that states (and local jurisdictions) have requested the ability to make their decisions and policies regarding Covid. Can you imagine the pushback if Trump tried to implement a national policy? Heck, when businesses are being rioted, local leaders don’t want federal help and you think they would embrace a federal policy from Trump? And clearly, a Covid policy for New York would be significantly different than policy for Montana.
I would disagree with that. I sat on my school district's planning committee and there was extreme frustration from the superintendent and school board. They were given no direction from the state or federal departments of health. They were very upset that the experts (infectious disease doctors) were providing no guidance and they were left with the responsibility to make a plan that was based on their best judgement not medical advice. Trump even promised to rollout a return to school plan, but it never came to fruition. With no guidance from the federal government (who has a pandemic response team which I would suspect most states do not have), the return to school has gone pretty bad across the country.

Note- guidance not necessary mandate



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by Cataholic » Thu Oct 15, 2020 10:50 am

The Butcher wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 7:43 am
Cataholic wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:23 pm

I am pretty sure that states (and local jurisdictions) have requested the ability to make their decisions and policies regarding Covid. Can you imagine the pushback if Trump tried to implement a national policy? Heck, when businesses are being rioted, local leaders don’t want federal help and you think they would embrace a federal policy from Trump? And clearly, a Covid policy for New York would be significantly different than policy for Montana.
I would disagree with that. I sat on my school district's planning committee and there was extreme frustration from the superintendent and school board. They were given no direction from the state or federal departments of health. They were very upset that the experts (infectious disease doctors) were providing no guidance and they were left with the responsibility to make a plan that was based on their best judgement not medical advice. Trump even promised to rollout a return to school plan, but it never came to fruition. With no guidance from the federal government (who has a pandemic response team which I would suspect most states do not have), the return to school has gone pretty bad across the country.

Note- guidance not necessary mandate
That is a good point. It probably depends on where you live. But that is my point. You can’t unilaterally blame Trump for decisions that some states have requested. Look at the disaster in New York. And clearly a New York policy has to be different than a Montana policy.

And everyone’s approach has continued to evolve. How many people on this board alone regularly used Europe as the right model. Today, Europe’s undergoing a second wave that appears to be worse than anything we have seen.



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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by catatac » Thu Oct 15, 2020 12:35 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 10:50 am
The Butcher wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 7:43 am
Cataholic wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:23 pm

I am pretty sure that states (and local jurisdictions) have requested the ability to make their decisions and policies regarding Covid. Can you imagine the pushback if Trump tried to implement a national policy? Heck, when businesses are being rioted, local leaders don’t want federal help and you think they would embrace a federal policy from Trump? And clearly, a Covid policy for New York would be significantly different than policy for Montana.
I would disagree with that. I sat on my school district's planning committee and there was extreme frustration from the superintendent and school board. They were given no direction from the state or federal departments of health. They were very upset that the experts (infectious disease doctors) were providing no guidance and they were left with the responsibility to make a plan that was based on their best judgement not medical advice. Trump even promised to rollout a return to school plan, but it never came to fruition. With no guidance from the federal government (who has a pandemic response team which I would suspect most states do not have), the return to school has gone pretty bad across the country.

Note- guidance not necessary mandate
That is a good point. It probably depends on where you live. But that is my point. You can’t unilaterally blame Trump for decisions that some states have requested. Look at the disaster in New York. And clearly a New York policy has to be different than a Montana policy.

And everyone’s approach has continued to evolve. How many people on this board alone regularly used Europe as the right model. Today, Europe’s undergoing a second wave that appears to be worse than anything we have seen.
Oh but you are sadly mistaken my friend... just sit back and watch Butcher go to work. :lol:


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The Butcher
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Re: Cure worse than the problem?

Post by The Butcher » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:05 am

POTUS spreading more misinformation about COVID... Does anyone believe Trump about anything related to COVID anymore?

Fact check: Trump falsely claims that 85% of people who wear masks get coronavirus
From CNN's Daniel Dale

President Trump made a dramatic claim about Covid-19 during Thursday night’s town hall.

“Just the other day, they came out with a statement that 85% of the people that wear masks catch it,” Trump said.

It was a repeat of a similar claim he had made two times earlier in the day, citing the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention as the source for that number.

Facts First: Trump’s claim is false. A CDC study released in September, did not say that 85% of people who wear masks get infected with coronavirus. In fact, it did not even attempt to figure out what percentage of people who wear a mask get infected with the coronavirus.

Rather, the study looked at the behavior of 154 symptomatic people who had tested positive for the coronavirus in July around the country and 160 people who reported symptoms but tested negative in July.

The study found that, of those 154 people, 85% said they had worn a mask either “always” or “often” over the 14 days prior to the onset of their illness. That’s where the 85% figure comes from.

Of the 160 people in the study who had tested negative, however, 88.7% said they had worn a mask either “always” or “often.” So there’s really no difference between people who wore masks and those who didn’t.

And that’s not even the point here.

Trump was suggesting that the CDC found that 85% of all people who wear masks get coronavirus. But the CDC was just looking at the behavior of these 314 symptomatic people who sought out testing at 11 particular sites around the country in July.

Here’s how one of the co-authors, Christopher Lindsell, co-director of the Health Data Science Center at Vanderbilt University Medical Center, described the study’s data on masks:

“The data suggest that among a group of patients who are already showing symptoms that prompted them to get testing for the virus, there was no statistical evidence of a difference in mask wearing behavior between those who tested positive and those who tested negative,” Lindsell said in an email. “This is very different from the question of whether wearing masks prevents you becoming infected with the virus, and it is also different to the question of how many or what percentage of people who wear masks contract the virus. The study was not designed to answer these questions.”



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