In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

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SonomaCat
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In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by SonomaCat » Mon May 18, 2009 2:23 pm

http://caffertyfile.blogs.cnn.com/2009/ ... nevitable/

I'm don't like the idea of reliving the Bush years for the next couple years with high-profile hearings and investigations, but I would like to see a low-key investigation/true-gathering commission that objectively gathers all of the information from that period and examines what went right and what went wrong. This might result in a document from which we can all learn (so we don't repeat those mistakes). I don't want to see show trials and grandstanding that is just intended to poke Republicans in the eyes with sticks, but I do want to see all Americans learning from mistakes that Republicans and Democrats make for the betterment of our country.

The Bush years just happened to be a time a whole lot of new challenges that we hadn't faced in the past (so previous administrations didn't have the opportunity to screw them up), and lots of mistakes were made as part of the learning curve.

We can either learn from those mistakes as a nation and move along the learning curve in a constructive manner or we can put on our partisan blinders and argue in mindless partisan terms and accomplish nothing.

I am hoping for the former.



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Bleedinbluengold
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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by Bleedinbluengold » Tue May 19, 2009 8:33 am

I disagree.

A) Politicos don't ever learn from mistakes.
B) America's attention span is not conducive to learning from such an investigation.
C) Any money spent on such an endeavor is too much.

A noble cause; however, an impractical and unnecessary excercise.


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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by Grizlaw » Tue May 19, 2009 9:56 am

Bleedinbluengold wrote:I disagree.

A) Politicos don't ever learn from mistakes.
B) America's attention span is not conducive to learning from such an investigation.
C) Any money spent on such an endeavor is too much.
From a practical standpoint, I agree with you. However, when I look at your list of reasons, it strikes me that (A) and (B) are both things that, in my view, constitute serious problems with our society, and (C) is only true because of (A) and (B). So the question is -- should we just accept the status quo (i.e., that we have become a country full of intellectually lazy people who are incapable of seeing shades or gray in anything or thinking about anything more complex than an angry soundbite), or should we try to change? If the latter, then how?


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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by Hell's Bells » Tue May 19, 2009 10:00 am

Grizlaw wrote:
Bleedinbluengold wrote:I disagree.

A) Politicos don't ever learn from mistakes.
B) America's attention span is not conducive to learning from such an investigation.
C) Any money spent on such an endeavor is too much.
From a practical standpoint, I agree with you. However, when I look at your list of reasons, it strikes me that (A) and (B) are both things that, in my view, constitute serious problems with our society, and (C) is only true because of (A) and (B). So the question is -- should we just accept the status quo (i.e., that we have become a country full of intellectually lazy people who are incapable of seeing shades or gray in anything or thinking about anything more complex than an angry soundbite), or should we try to change? If the latter, then how?
I dont think that we should accept the status quo - however any investigation will be overshadowed by whatever is on the sports page or a story about how some celebertard needs rehab. Anyways, I digress, lets think of this in simple terms:
Should we start the status quo that, no matter how "bad" they were, that former presidental administrations get investigated by the next president? I can see how this can be used as a political tool very easily and I dont like it at all.
I just say that we should let the experience of the last 16 years be our guide and not elect former southern govenors again :D


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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by Grizlaw » Tue May 19, 2009 10:10 am

Hell's Bells wrote: I dont think that we should accept the status quo - however any investigation will be overshadowed by whatever is on the sports page or a story about how some celebertard needs rehab. Anyways, I digress, lets think of this in simple terms:
Should we start the status quo that, no matter how "bad" they were, that former presidental administrations get investigated by the next president? I can see how this can be used as a political tool very easily and I dont like it at all.
Oh I agree with you; in our present context, I don't necessarily think this investigation will be productive. In our society, it most likely will turn very political (with the Democrats looking for any opportunity to highlight mistakes made by Republicans, and Republicans refusing to acknowledge that any mistakes were ever made, regardless of any evidence to the contrary).

I'm thinking a lot more broadly than this one investigation, though. I guess my point is -- yes, it is true that this investigation (in whatever form it happens) will probably be a colossal waste of money...but that's only true because of some pretty serious problems we have with our society. If we were a society that was capable of stepping back and taking an honest look at things (without every debate having to turn into a political pursefight between Dems and Republicans), then we'd be able to conduct an investigation of this kind and gain useful information from it. The fact that we can't do that is a serious problem, imo. I don't know what the answer is, but I'm just throwing it out there as an issue...


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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by Bleedinbluengold » Tue May 19, 2009 11:47 am

Grizlaw wrote:
Bleedinbluengold wrote:I disagree.

A) Politicos don't ever learn from mistakes.
B) America's attention span is not conducive to learning from such an investigation.
C) Any money spent on such an endeavor is too much.
From a practical standpoint, I agree with you. However, when I look at your list of reasons, it strikes me that (A) and (B) are both things that, in my view, constitute serious problems with our society, and (C) is only true because of (A) and (B). So the question is -- should we just accept the status quo (i.e., that we have become a country full of intellectually lazy people who are incapable of seeing shades or gray in anything or thinking about anything more complex than an angry soundbite), or should we try to change? If the latter, then how?
Yes, I think in general, America is intellectually lazy. It is nearly impossible to go into detail on the status quo and how to change the status quo on a message board. This topic is at least a 6 hour scotch-induced-mind-bend!!!


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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by SonomaCat » Tue May 19, 2009 12:21 pm

It's sad to say, but you guys are probably right ... expecting that level of high-minded objective self-review on the part of our country may well be expecting the impossible.



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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by ChiOCat » Tue May 19, 2009 2:24 pm

Well, maybe if Perez Hilton would talk about it on his blog.... :wink: :roll:


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Re: In retrospect, not surprising at all ... but still strange

Post by catamaran » Tue May 19, 2009 2:59 pm

There's no time; I think American Idol's coming to an end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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