The Bobcat Nation

So....all of the jumping up and down, all of that high-fiving, all of that hoopla the other day by the boys from Missoula....just so you can go out and have your head handed to you on a plate?? Really? Is that the best that UM could do to represent the Big Sky??

Actually, I'm not knocking UM. I'm really saying that we need a national division in basketball for "mid-majors" like the FCS in football. Let's face it, Big Sky teams are never going to go out and compete with LSU, Ohio State, Nebraska, Southern Cal, etc. in football. So why do we think it will ever be any different in basketball?

As it stands now, how much joy do you really get from winning the Big Sky when you know that all you are going to do is be cannon fodder for the "big guys" once the tournament begins?? One and done. Wow, what a reward for winning your conference!

Contrast that with the anticipation of going into the FCS playoffs, where you know that you genuinely have a chance to go all the way.

Sure, there is always a miracle that happens every now and then such as Appy State beating Michigan in football a few years ago. In fact, UNC-Asheville gave Syracuse a good scare in hoops today. But those games are extremely few and far between.

Why isn't there interest in such a "mid-major" national division in hoops??

And to only add more evidence to my argument, does anyone really think that the Idaho State women's basketball team will come within 20 points of their opponent? I guarantee you that they will get beat down unmercifully, just as the "mighty" Griz were today.

Better question might be why does a conference such as the West Coast, put 3 competitive teams into the tournament compared to the Big Sky's 1? What's different? WCC is composed of small schools except for BYU, yet manage to out-recruit and out coach teams from much bigger, more prestigious conferences. Why is that?

Catfanatic84 wrote:Better question might be why does a conference such as the West Coast, put 3 competitive teams into the tournament compared to the Big Sky's 1? What's different? WCC is composed of small schools except for BYU, yet manage to out-recruit and out coach teams from much bigger, more prestigious conferences. Why is that?

Well, MBB is THE bellcow sports programs at St. Mary's and Gonzaga, so these programs get the most funding and attention, as opposed to every school in the BSC or WAC.

In the other thread, the question has already been posed as to why we wouldn't just move down to D-II if we truly had no interest in trying to compete in Division I basketball at the highest level. What are your thoughts on that?

As to the idea of having a "mid-major" tournament ... do you really think that a new "mid-major" tournament would give anybody a woody more so than, say, the NIT or CBI or CIT tournaments that already exist?

It seems like there are already plenty of lower-tier Division 1 "championships" out there for basketball. If nobody gives a rat's arse about the ones that already exist (as it seems that everyone instead focuses on the NCAA big dance), what would be the logic in creating yet another?

If any team wanted to pass up a bid to the Big Dance so they could instead play in the NIT or CBI or CIT because they thought they'd have a better chance of winning a "championship" in those tournaments, I have no doubt that they would be allowed to do so. But none of them ever seem to want to do that, and I've never heard a single fan of any program advocate that their own team do that.

I suspect that if MSU boosters donated as much money to the basketball program as we do to the football program for boosts to coaches salaries, facilities, recruiting, etc., MSU would have a decent chance to become a regional power in basketball similar to Gonzaga (given a little luck in hiring a great up-and-coming coach). But we don't seem to care enough about basketball to make that happen (nor does any other fanbase in the BSC), so the results follow that. That said, the Griz were a good enough team to win a game or two in the NCAAs -- they just didn't play well and matched up against a team that played really well, so they got beat easily. That happens. But it's not really a singular event to get too worried about on its own. UM wasn't the problem with the BSC. UM and Weber held up the conference quite well. We just need about six other teams to rise to that same level.

As I predicted, the ISU women's team got bounced out. Only lost by 30 points. How exciting.

aucat wrote:As I predicted, the ISU women's team got bounced out. Only lost by 30 points. How exciting.

So you'd have them not play at all after they earned it? In the tournament every season there are multiple teams that go 0-1 from mid-major & small-school programs on both the men's and women's side. Heck, Duke went 0-1 this year. Yes, that win by Lehigh & Norfolk State on the men's side are the pinnacle of what mid-major or small schools attempt to do. You're basically stating what the other guy did - "let's not try for success because we haven't found it yet" OR "let's try and make it easier on the program and drop down because we can't win at the best of the best levels."

Well, to follow your logic, Montana State, UM, and the rest of the Big Sky should stop playing in the FCS and move on up to the BCS division, right?

Maybe you can explain the difference to me.

On the other hand, I do agree with the post which raises the question as to why the Big Sky is so pathetically weak in basketball. Today I watched a team called "FLorida Gulf Coast University" which was a community college only a few years ago that came within an eyelash of advancing in the NCAA.

aucat wrote:Well, to follow your logic, Montana State, UM, and the rest of the Big Sky should stop playing in the FCS and move on up to the BCS division, right?

A lot of people think exactly that.

All I can say is football and basketball are apples and oranges. In football an FCS school could play Alabama 1000 times and lose all 1000, in basketball...we'll you saw what Lehigh did to Duke (last year's national champ).

When 1-AA was formed there were very limited post season opportunities for small schools. Bowl games are about money first of all and most 1-AA teams don't have the fan base to attract a bowl offer no matter how good their record is. There are more bowl games now-a-days but a no name bowl game isn't much of a post season opportunity.

FCS football is about cost containment-thus 22 fewer scholarhips. Basketball has comparatively few scholarships so we all offer the same number of scholarships (somewhat levels the playing field). So how do you decide who is major and who is mid-major? There's no scholarship difference to make a distinction.

The NCAA is a member run organization. If it's members wanted a different post season structure they'd ask for it. Nobody is asking for FCS basketball. Nobody wants to be left out of the NCAA tournament money (even the lowly Big Sky gets a cut). FCS basketball won't happen unless the big schools figure out a way to kick the mid-majors out and too many mid majors have done too well in the tournament to make that a realistic option.

Stanford made the Bay Area proud last night, rocking the NIT field and bringing home their first NIT championship title since 1991. Palo Alto is rocking ... the flames from the riots on University Avenue probably won't be put out until the National Guard moves in. Stanford alums are going nuts -- this is big. Really big.

What did you guys think of that game last night? Did Stanford rock it or what? I'm sure Great Falls is abuzz, considering that one of their own (Huestis) will return home this summer not merely as a basketball player, but as a part of basketball royalty -- a national champion!

Let's get some chatter going about the game and, frankly, Stanford's entire storybook season. I'm not sure what the ratings were for that game, but they had to have set some records.

Basketball is much different than football when it comes to playing "up". We see it most every year in the NCAA tournament, a "Mid major" team like VCU, Gonzaga, or Ohio does the unthinkable and knocks off several of the big time programs. It's not unreasonable to think that eventually the Big Sky could be the next WCC. The WCC didn't become the conference it is overnight.. it took some big wins by 1 team, and gradually the conference as a whole became much better.

I personally hope they never go with a mid major tournament, and also hope they stop expanding the f'n NCAA tournament to try to make more room for .500 teams from the big conferences. One of the great things about the NCAA tournament is watching the mid majors show that they can indeed play basketball with the big boys.

I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

homeytennis wrote:I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

They beat UNC and came within a "whisker" of beating Allen Iverson's Georgetown team...

LTown Cat wrote:

homeytennis wrote:I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

They beat UNC and came within a "whisker" of beating Allen Iverson's Georgetown team...

We beat Michigan State and then lost by a whisker to Allen Iverson's Georgetown team in 95, then we beat North Carolina and then lost yet again by a whisker to Florida in overtime in 1999-00.

WSUWILDCAT wrote:

LTown Cat wrote:

homeytennis wrote:I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

They beat UNC and came within a "whisker" of beating Allen Iverson's Georgetown team...

We beat Michigan State and then lost by a whisker to Allen Iverson's Georgetown team in 95, then we beat North Carolina and then lost yet again by a whisker to Florida in overtime in 1999-00.

Actually, it was in the 1998-99 season (the 1999 tourney) when WSU beat UNC, then lost to Florida in OT.

Just saw this, NAU looking for their BBall Head Coach:
http://hr.nau.edu/node/2796&job_req=559120" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Edited: for verbage.
WBT:You are correct sir!
http://azdailysun.com/news/local/adras- ... cb20e.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ImagineSanta wrote:Just saw this, NAU fired their BBall Head Coach:
http://hr.nau.edu/node/2796&job_req=559120" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Didn't they fire him part way through the season, and then had the old dude who was the radio announcer come in and act as interim coach?

WSUWILDCAT wrote:

LTown Cat wrote:

homeytennis wrote:I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

They beat UNC and came within a "whisker" of beating Allen Iverson's Georgetown team...

We beat Michigan State and then lost by a whisker to Allen Iverson's Georgetown team in 95, then we beat North Carolina and then lost yet again by a whisker to Florida in overtime in 1999-00.

Gotcha--either way--heck of a 4-5 year spurt...

LTown Cat wrote:

WSUWILDCAT wrote:

LTown Cat wrote:

homeytennis wrote:I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

They beat UNC and came within a "whisker" of beating Allen Iverson's Georgetown team...

We beat Michigan State and then lost by a whisker to Allen Iverson's Georgetown team in 95, then we beat North Carolina and then lost yet again by a whisker to Florida in overtime in 1999-00.

Gotcha--either way--heck of a 4-5 year spurt...

Yeah...two tourney wins in a span of five years is very impressive, especially considering that all the other BSC teams combined have a grand total of exactly one tourney win in the past 30 years.

John K wrote:

LTown Cat wrote:

WSUWILDCAT wrote:

LTown Cat wrote:

homeytennis wrote:I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

They beat UNC and came within a "whisker" of beating Allen Iverson's Georgetown team...

We beat Michigan State and then lost by a whisker to Allen Iverson's Georgetown team in 95, then we beat North Carolina and then lost yet again by a whisker to Florida in overtime in 1999-00.

Gotcha--either way--heck of a 4-5 year spurt...

Yeah...two tourney wins in a span of five years is very impressive, especially considering that all the other BSC teams combined have a grand total of exactly one tourney win in the past 30 years.

And if I'm not mistaken that is UM over Nevada...hardly the caliber of program as Michigan State and North Carolina. Those are impressive wins! Also, taking Georgetown and Florida to the wire...

LTown Cat wrote:

John K wrote:

LTown Cat wrote:

WSUWILDCAT wrote:

LTown Cat wrote:

homeytennis wrote:I think it was 1999 or 2000 where Weber beat North Carolina in the first round and came within a whisker or beating Florida in the next game so it can be done. Montana beat a pretty good Nevada team when Krysko was the UM coach.

They beat UNC and came within a "whisker" of beating Allen Iverson's Georgetown team...

We beat Michigan State and then lost by a whisker to Allen Iverson's Georgetown team in 95, then we beat North Carolina and then lost yet again by a whisker to Florida in overtime in 1999-00.

Gotcha--either way--heck of a 4-5 year spurt...

Yeah...two tourney wins in a span of five years is very impressive, especially considering that all the other BSC teams combined have a grand total of exactly one tourney win in the past 30 years.

And if I'm not mistaken that is UM over Nevada...hardly the caliber of program as Michigan State and North Carolina. Those are impressive wins! Also, taking Georgetown and Florida to the wire...

That's correct...in 2006. I believe UM was seeded #12 that year, with Nevada being #5, which may be the highest that any BSC team has ever been seeded. And you're absolutely right...even though Nevada had some pretty good years back then, their program is not even close to being on the same level as UNC and MSU (the other one).