MBB: Home game vs. Northern Colorado tonite

[longhorn_22]

We haven't even had a half decent big man since Big Nate.

Al Beye was way more than "half decent." I believe he was all-conference his senior year.
*He was 1st team all conference in 05-06.

[Ponycat]

i agree. who was our last really good big man? i agree i think mbunga is pretty tough, but he lacks some low-post moves, and let's face it....we don't give him the ball anyway. holmstadt? granted he had some great players around him like sprinks, but it just seems like our offense always went through him when he was here. so maybe that's what i'm asking. maybe not the last really good big man, but rather the last big man that was the focal point of our offense.

Al Beye.

Dmir Latovic (sp?) Best big man I think we've ever had, too bad for only one year.

The problem last night was our guard play. We had, I belive, 4 assists the whole game. The N. Colorado guards took our guards completely out of their game. You wont win many games in any league with only 4 assists in a game. No easy buckets to get us on a role and open up the three. We didn't appear to have any energy, missed some easy shots in the first half, and when it looked like we might make a run we'd give up an easy bucket on defense. Mbunga being in foul trouble hurt but more on the defensive side. When he was in we just couldn't or didn't get him the ball on offense. Howard, Rush and Bynum had some nice buckets but they had to create everything they got on there own and started pressing a bit in the second half, as the guard didn't create anything.

I also have to say the crowd was pathetic. I've seen more energy from a crowd at a women's city league game. I thought after beating Weber on the road, the kids could expect some excitement and support from the fans, but we may as well play all our game on the road if that is going to be what our home games are going to be like. The frickin crowd was louder at half time than they ever were in the game.

[Ponycat]

We haven't even had a half decent big man since Big Nate.

That is a pretty uninformed statement.

[longhorn_22]

i agree. who was our last really good big man? i agree i think mbunga is pretty tough, but he lacks some low-post moves, and let's face it....we don't give him the ball anyway. holmstadt? granted he had some great players around him like sprinks, but it just seems like our offense always went through him when he was here. so maybe that's what i'm asking. maybe not the last really good big man, but rather the last big man that was the focal point of our offense.

Al Beye.

Dmir Latovic (sp?) Best big man I think we've ever had, too bad for only one year.

The problem last night was our guard play. We had, I belive, 4 assists the whole game. The N. Colorado guards took our guards completely out of their game. You wont win many games in any league with only 4 assists in a game. No easy buckets to get us on a role and open up the three. We didn't appear to have any energy, missed some easy shots in the first half, and when it looked like we might make a run we'd give up an easy bucket on defense. Mbunga being in foul trouble hurt but more on the defensive side. When he was in we just couldn't or didn't get him the ball on offense. Howard, Rush and Bynum had some nice buckets but they had to create everything they got on there own and started pressing a bit in the second half, as the guard didn't create anything.

I also have to say the crowd was pathetic. I've seen more energy from a crowd at a women's city league game. I thought after beating Weber on the road, the kids could expect some excitement and support from the fans, but we may as well play all our game on the road if that is going to be what our home games are going to be like. The frickin crowd was louder at half time than they ever were in the game.

The crowd was pretty good until midway through the second half. When we would try and get it going the team would flop. They never recovered and neither did the crowd. There was nothing to really cheer for in the second half.

[SaltyCat]

Not uninformed at all. I've followed MSU basketball very closely since the late 80's. Maybe a little bit overstated, but in my opinion Holstadt was the last big man we had that if we needed a basket, all you had to do was get it him the ball.

I did forget about Damir, he was legit, but his numbers are nothing special. He averaged 11pts and 7.6rebs a game. Compare those to Nate's who averaged in the high teens in pts and over 7 boards a game over a four year career.

Here is a list of some of our other big guys since Nate was here:

Kyle Stirmlinger, Tom Duffy, Kenny Plummer, Rufus Nicholson, Bo Segeberg, Casey Reynolds, Ted Morris, Adrian Zamora, Calvin Ento, Marvin Moss, etc.

Obviously there are some solid players and great Bobcats on that list, but the point is none were truely dominant big men. But let's be honest, a player like that comes around a program about once every 20 years, so I don't expect one every year. Good big men are very tough to come by at this level.

Go Cats!

[John K]

Not uninformed at all. I've followed MSU basketball very closely since the late 80's. Maybe a little bit overstated, but in my opinion Holstadt was the last big man we had that if we needed a basket, all you had to do was get it him the ball.

I did forget about Damir, he was legit, but his numbers are nothing special. He averaged 11pts and 7.6rebs a game. Compare those to Nate's who averaged in the high teens in pts and over 7 boards a game over a four year career.

Here is a list of some of our other big guys since Nate was here:

Kyle Stirmlinger, Tom Duffy, Kenny Plummer, Rufus Nicholson, Bo Segeberg, Casey Reynolds, Ted Morris, Adrian Zamora, Calvin Ento, Marvin Moss, etc.

Obviously there are some solid players and great Bobcats on that list, but the point is none were truely dominant big men. But let's be honest, a player like that comes around a program about once every 20 years, so I don't expect one every year. Good big men are very tough to come by at this level.

Go Cats!

One obvious omission from that list (from everyone's lists in fact) is Damon Ollie, who played with Nate for one or two seasons. Before that, we had Lollis and Holmstadt as a tandem for a year or two as well. IMHO, one good (or at least decent) big man is not really adequate. The good teams that we had back in the mid to late 90's normally featured a couple of pretty good "bigs", and that is why were a pretty consistent BSC contender during that era.

[John K]

And one more comment...4 assists...are you kidding me??? I didn't watch the game or even listen to it on the radio, but that is pathetic. With only 18 total FG, I know that a team isn't going to accumulate a bunch of assists, but it should be more than 4. You don't need to be John Wooden to know that a team is not playing very effectively on offense, if they don't have more than 4 assists in a game. What has happened since the WSU game? It leads me to believe that maybe the issues are more mental/psychological than physical/talent?

[Helcat72]

And one more comment...4 assists...are you kidding me??? I didn't watch the game or even listen to it on the radio, but that is pathetic. With only 18 total FG, I know that a team isn't going to accumulate a bunch of assists, but it should be more than 4. You don't need to be John Wooden to know that a team is not playing very effectively on offense, if they don't have more than 4 assists in a game. What has happened since the WSU game? It leads me to believe that maybe the issues are more mental/psychological than physical/talent?

Leadership! when things aren't going quite right they are looking for someone to step up and lead them. Someone who can get them through the doldrums. Someone to speak up and show them the way..on the court! A Casey Durham type who's been around the corner. we have only one senior and he's a center and has been around for only a year...otherwise there is no one. Will Bynum was scoring in the first half...but he's a newcomer. I'm not sure they can come out of this slump if someon doesn't step up and show them the way! If one guy gets hot...then everyone starts to relax and the points come. Last night as soon as Bobby Howard missed his first three...you could feel their A$$holes tighten!

[Helcat72]

And one more comment...4 assists...are you kidding me??? I didn't watch the game or even listen to it on the radio, but that is pathetic. With only 18 total FG, I know that a team isn't going to accumulate a bunch of assists, but it should be more than 4. You don't need to be John Wooden to know that a team is not playing very effectively on offense, if they don't have more than 4 assists in a game. What has happened since the WSU game? It leads me to believe that maybe the issues are more mental/psychological than physical/talent?

Leadership! when things aren't going quite right they are looking for someone to step up and lead them. Someone who can get them through the doldrums. Someone to speak up and show them the way..on the court! A Casey Durham type who's been around the corner. we have only one senior and he's a center and has been around for only a year...otherwise there is no one. Will Bynum was scoring in the first half...but he's a newcomer. I'm not sure they can come out of this slump if someon doesn't step up and show them the way! If one guy gets hot...then everyone starts to relax and the points come. Last night as soon as Bobby Howard missed his first three...you could see their A$$holes tighten!

[whitetrashgriz]

We haven't even had a half decent big man since Big Nate.

Al Beye was way more than "half decent." I believe he was all-conference his senior year.
*He was 1st team all conference in 05-06.

trust me, this isn't an argument i wanna be in because as i said before, al was a good friend, and i was fortunate to spend a lot of time with him. and he was a good basketball player. but our offense didn't run through al. not even close. sure we'd lob him the ball sometimes. and often he could score. i agree he was way more than "half decent". but again, our offense didn't revolve around al like they did around nate. when we get a guy as versatile as nate was, with his scoring and passing ability, i think we'll be in business in this conference. until then, i think we're going to have a tough road, and making the playoffs won't be easy. mbunga is good, although it's clear our offense doesn't revolve around him.

[longhorn_22]

We haven't even had a half decent big man since Big Nate.

Al Beye was way more than "half decent." I believe he was all-conference his senior year.
*He was 1st team all conference in 05-06.

trust me, this isn't an argument i wanna be in because as i said before, al was a good friend, and i was fortunate to spend a lot of time with him. and he was a good basketball player. but our offense didn't run through al. not even close. sure we'd lob him the ball sometimes. and often he could score. i agree he was way more than "half decent". but again, our offense didn't revolve around al like they did around nate. when we get a guy as versatile as nate was, with his scoring and passing ability, i think we'll be in business in this conference. until then, i think we're going to have a tough road, and making the playoffs won't be easy. mbunga is good, although it's clear our offense doesn't revolve around him.

That's not the argument. I never said the offense ran through Al. I agree the offense went through other players at that time. It was stated that his offense was weak. I disagree. That's what I was saying.

[whitetrashgriz]

We haven't even had a half decent big man since Big Nate.

Al Beye was way more than "half decent." I believe he was all-conference his senior year.
*He was 1st team all conference in 05-06.

trust me, this isn't an argument i wanna be in because as i said before, al was a good friend, and i was fortunate to spend a lot of time with him. and he was a good basketball player. but our offense didn't run through al. not even close. sure we'd lob him the ball sometimes. and often he could score. i agree he was way more than "half decent". but again, our offense didn't revolve around al like they did around nate. when we get a guy as versatile as nate was, with his scoring and passing ability, i think we'll be in business in this conference. until then, i think we're going to have a tough road, and making the playoffs won't be easy. mbunga is good, although it's clear our offense doesn't revolve around him.

That's not the argument. I never said the offense ran through Al. I agree the offense went through other players at that time. It was stated that his offense was weak. I disagree. That's what I was saying.

whatever. i asked when the last time we had a great big man. then i clarified that what i was really asking was when was the last time we had a big man who was the focal point of our offense. i see that when you quoted my entire post you underlined my first question, but that didn't answer what i was asking. al was good. for a guy who had only been playing for about 6 or 7 years he was really good. but i never stated that his offense was weak. like i said, i'm not gonna get into a pissing match about how good of a player al was. especially seeing that he and i were friends, and nate and i never got along well so i can't justify getting into this any deeper. bottom line is nate was the best big man the cats have had in a long time.

[longhorn_22]

We haven't even had a half decent big man since Big Nate.

Al Beye was way more than "half decent." I believe he was all-conference his senior year.
*He was 1st team all conference in 05-06.

trust me, this isn't an argument i wanna be in because as i said before, al was a good friend, and i was fortunate to spend a lot of time with him. and he was a good basketball player. but our offense didn't run through al. not even close. sure we'd lob him the ball sometimes. and often he could score. i agree he was way more than "half decent". but again, our offense didn't revolve around al like they did around nate. when we get a guy as versatile as nate was, with his scoring and passing ability, i think we'll be in business in this conference. until then, i think we're going to have a tough road, and making the playoffs won't be easy. mbunga is good, although it's clear our offense doesn't revolve around him.

That's not the argument. I never said the offense ran through Al. I agree the offense went through other players at that time. It was stated that his offense was weak. I disagree. That's what I was saying.

whatever. i asked when the last time we had a great big man. then i clarified that what i was really asking was when was the last time we had a big man who was the focal point of our offense. i see that when you quoted my entire post you underlined my first question, but that didn't answer what i was asking. al was good. for a guy who had only been playing for about 6 or 7 years he was really good. but i never stated that his offense was weak. like i said, i'm not gonna get into a pissing match about how good of a player al was. especially seeing that he and i were friends, and nate and i never got along well so i can't justify getting into this any deeper. bottom line is nate was the best big man the cats have had in a long time.

Well I'm not in a pissing match nor did I think it was one in the first place. That is all.
/thread

[catsrback76]

Quadre Lollis was a man in the middle both offensively and defensively.

[94VegasCat]

Quadre Lollis was a man in the middle both offensively and defensively.

I'm drunk as heeeeeellllllll and I was gonna say the same damn thing. Quad, Nico, Kwesi those three were some ballers and Quadre was the MAN in the low post. Quick and powerful, but not very tall.

[longhorn_22]

Quadre Lollis was a man in the middle both offensively and defensively.

I'm drunk as heeeeeellllllll and I was gonna say the same damn thing. Quad, Nico, Kwesi those three were some ballers and Quadre was the MAN in the low post. Quick and powerful, but not very tall.

Lollis was a beast. I miss it.