Destiny AGAIN???

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kmax
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Post by kmax » Tue Oct 19, 2004 11:11 am

jagur- Sorry, not mythical. From two different websites:

http://www.fact-index.com/n/na/naia_championships.html
The NAIA began sponsoring a college football championship playoff system in 1956. In 1970, football was divided into two divisions, Division I and Division II, with a championship gamed played in each division. In 1997, football was again consolidated into one division.

NAIA Consolidated Champions (1956-1969 and 1997-present)

* 1956 Montana State & St. Joseph’s (Indiana) (co-champions)
http://www.naia.org/football/championsh ... story.html
Football Championship History

YEAR SITE CHAMPION SCORE RUNNER-UP

1956 Little Rock Ark. Montana State/St. Joseph’s (Ind.) 0-0 (tie) -------------------


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Post by MSU01 » Tue Oct 19, 2004 11:15 am

Uh oh, not the champion vs. co-champion thing again!!!! ](*,)


Go Bobcats! 24-17 31-23 29-25 48-14

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Post by hokeyfine » Tue Oct 19, 2004 11:25 am

alright!!!! who pissed in jagur's corn flakes!!! he's still pissed the griz lost to ndsu in 1969 and 1970 for the national title.....oops, i forgot that because they were div 2 games, they weren't real.



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Post by jagur1 » Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:02 pm

Let us clear this up a bit. Since nobody really cares (MSU guys just want to point to the flag. blah blah blah.)

hokeyfine: No MSlacat stole my Mountain Dew he didn't piss in my flakes.
& I would count those Camela bowl games if the Griz had won.

kmax: Yes that is the BS line that you can look up on the internet. In 1956 3 teams went without a lose. One,MSU, got invited to play 1 lose St. Josephs of Ind. and tied them. So if OU and LSU tied 0-0 last year according to the NCAA they would have been co-champions at 10-1-1 and USC at 11-1 wouldn't have won a title. (I know no more ties in college FB) So you have 4 teams in 1956 saying they are the Champs: 2 10-0 teams, a 10-0-1 team and a 9-1-1 team. The best I will do is give the cats 1/2 or I'll just keep calling it a mythical NC. I don't know.

I'm done.


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Post by kmax » Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:30 pm

Jagur- Just understand that you saying things like MSU went to UAS and had a trophy made to call themselves Nat. Champs is ludicrous. To this day, MSU and St. Josephs are recognized by the sanctioning body that they were a part of as the national champs. That is like saying Southern should be the true 1995 I-AA champions because they only had one loss and won the Heritage bowl and the Grizzlies had two losses. If anything, it is the other two teams(whoever they are) that have made up that they are national champs. Just because you go undefeated doesn't mean you should be national champs, or for that matter playing for the national championship...if I remember right BYU proved that very well just a couple years ago.

I too am done and will ignore future postings from you on this as I have come to ignore Bronco's posts about treatment in Bozeman last year and others' stupid complaints about the "mountain lion" sound on the PA system. I am not going to waste any further energy trying to prove what you don't want to believe.


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Post by El_Gato » Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:34 pm

Simple way to solve the problem jag (my god you are a bitter, bitter man),

If the Fizz were the name on that web page with exactly the same circumstances, you know damn good & well you'd be claiming it!

Want proof? How's this?:

You guys (Griz backers) ALWAYS point out that you were CO-CHAMPIONS of the Big Sky Conference the last 2 years even though you LOST TO THE CATS and the CATS RECEIVED THE AUTOMATIC BERTH IN THE 1AA PLAYOFFS AS THE CONFERENCE CHAMPION.

So it's obvious that even you vaunted Grizzlies will claim any right you have to a title and therefore there is no doubt you'd be claiming that 3rd National Championship, just as we are.

Whitemeat, with guys like jag on your side, why do you still not understand or accept our loathing of the Griz?


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Post by Cat-theotherwhitemeat » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:24 pm

El_Gato wrote:Whitemeat, with guys like jag on your side, why do you still not understand or accept our loathing of the Griz?
1. Jag's a nice guy, I've met him. He's just trying to get under your skin and it looks like it's working.

2. I do accept the fact that you hate the Griz. I'll never try to change that.

3. And I guess I can understand why. Just remember, there is a thin line between love and hate. Life's too short to waste hating something, i.e. the Griz. When it's all said and done, the guys are still just college students working their tails off on the field in the name of getting an education.

It seriously doesn't bother me that most of you hate the Griz. I'll still root for the Cats when their not playing the Griz because they are from Montana with Montana kids playing. Hell, my best friend is a Cat fan and we tease each other all the time. We never take it too seriously though.


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Post by WYCAT » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:28 pm

CTOWM wrote:
It seriously doesn't bother me that most of you hate the Griz. I'll still root for the Cats when their not playing the Griz because they are from Montana with Montana kids playing. Hell, my best friend is a Cat fan and we tease each other all the time. We never take it too seriously though.
You are an anomaly CTOWM. A refreshing one but an anomaly nonetheless.



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Post by jagur1 » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:33 pm

Thanks meat (I like calling you meat) you just say that becouse we've seen the same people get beat up. :D You have to make the NAU game...


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Post by El_Gato » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:39 pm

Whitemeat,

It's all good fun; that's the real point I'm trying to make. "Hating" the Griz is simply entertainment and I don't believe MANY of us take it too far. I have a large number of Griz friends (insert your own joke about me having friends here...).

I have to admit, though, that one of the funniest things you've ever said was about it just being guys working their tails off to get an education. In some (I hope most) cases, that's true. But another thing that has always stuck in my craw has been the Griz willingness to take "less-than-desirable" people into their programs when it becomes PAINFULLY obvious that they are only there to help win games.

I'm not saying we haven't been guilty of the same crime (Joe O'Brien, are you listening?) but I am proud of the fact that student athletes at MSU have higher GPA's and graduation rates than at UM and yet we consistently fare WELL ABOVE the Griz in the Big Sky's All Sports Awards. I have always felt we place MORE emphasis on academics than do the Griz, and there is no evidence you can offer that can deny that claim. I often ask my Griz friends what they'd think of their school if you took away Griz football... Would you even know it was there?

Simple point: If the job of college athletics is to allow kids to compete & achieve a higher level of education, then MSU beats UM every day of the week, and not just on Saturdays in the fall.


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Post by jagur1 » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:45 pm

E.

God, help me. You generalize more than anyone. The sports award has been around for 2 years. Help, help me. To keep this simple what you said is unprovable at the best. For the last time MSU isn't an Ivy league school and neither is the U. And to put one down to make yourself feel better is just pathetic. E is there anything I can do to help mend your Ego.


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Post by Cat-theotherwhitemeat » Tue Oct 19, 2004 1:58 pm

WYCAT wrote:CTOWM wrote:
It seriously doesn't bother me that most of you hate the Griz. I'll still root for the Cats when their not playing the Griz because they are from Montana with Montana kids playing. Hell, my best friend is a Cat fan and we tease each other all the time. We never take it too seriously though.
You are an anomaly CTOWM. A refreshing one but an anomaly nonetheless.
Thanks WyCat, I've been called worse. :)
jagur1 wrote:Thanks meat (I like calling you meat) you just say that becouse we've seen the same people get beat up. You have to make the NAU game...
Yeah, he couldn't fight worth a sh!t, but he sure could drink! I'll be at the NAU game for sure. We'll have to meet up.


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Post by Cat-theotherwhitemeat » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:01 pm

jagur1 wrote:E.

God, help me. You generalize more than anyone. The sports award has been around for 2 years. Help, help me. To keep this simple what you said is unprovable at the best. For the last time MSU isn't an Ivy league school and neither is the U. And to put one down to make yourself feel better is just pathetic. E is there anything I can do to help mend your Ego.
Help me.....help you......Help ME.......HELP....YOU!!


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Post by Cat-theotherwhitemeat » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:05 pm

El,
I'm not going to get into the arguement of which school is better. It's a dead end argument. Both schools are good academically.


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Post by El_Gato » Wed Oct 20, 2004 5:40 pm

So, Meat & Jag,

You are both trying to tell me that the performance of student-athletes at the two schools is the same?

Would you please offer me some specific evidence because while the majority of the barbs in these postings is meant in good fun, this is actually a serious topic.

Fact: The average student-athlete at MSU is CLEARLY superior to those at UM in any academic category you wish to choose. To try and deny that is simply ignorant; article after article has been written over the years stating that the above-mentioned fact is true! Doubt me? Contact the BSC and ask them for the data they compile regarding academic performance at the various BSC schools.

Yes, the Griz have been very successful in football & girls BB over the past 15 years or so, but is that the ONLY way you measure "success" at UM? It appears so because your student-athlete's academic performances rank CONSISTENTLY near the bottom of the Big Sky and below-average compared to national statistics. If you like, I will start to compile the data & then we will all get to see how you Griz fans justify, rationalize, and/or "pooh-pooh" the FACTS. It will no doubt be painful & embarassing for you to face and attempt to deny the truth, but I trust it will make for some good laughs for the rest of us!

Peace.
Last edited by El_Gato on Wed Oct 20, 2004 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Post by Cat-theotherwhitemeat » Wed Oct 20, 2004 6:59 pm

El_Gato wrote:So, Meat & Jag,

You are both trying to tell me that the performance of student-athletes at the two schools is the same?

Fact: The average student-athlete at MSU is CLEARLY superior to those at UM in any academic category you wish to choose.
Law
Physical Therapy

NEXT!!!


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Post by BozoneCat » Wed Oct 20, 2004 7:04 pm

Cat-theotherwhitemeat wrote:Law
Physical Therapy

NEXT!!!
Please, PLEASE don't group us Physical Therapists in with the lawyers!!! :wink:


GO CATS GO!!!

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Post by Cat-theotherwhitemeat » Wed Oct 20, 2004 7:14 pm

El_Gato wrote:So, Meat & Jag,

You are both trying to tell me that the performance of student-athletes at the two schools is the same?
In all seriousness. I doubt, if averaged over several years, you would find much discrepancy betweent student-athletes and their academic numbers in the two schools. Also, if I were you I wouldn't bother spending any time trying to get the undisputed evidence to prove your point because; one, if I wanted to take the time, I could probably find some contradicting data to contradict your theory. And two, I don't really care. Both schools, believe it or not, are high quality schools with very good reputations....academically speaking of course. :)


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Post by VictorG » Wed Oct 20, 2004 7:19 pm

WYCAT wrote:CTOWM wrote:
It seriously doesn't bother me that most of you hate the Griz. I'll still root for the Cats when their not playing the Griz because they are from Montana with Montana kids playing. Hell, my best friend is a Cat fan and we tease each other all the time. We never take it too seriously though.
You are an anomaly CTOWM. A refreshing one but an anomaly nonetheless.
Not as much as you think! I've been known to root for the cats and some of my best friends are also cat fans! You should see some of the "pranks" that go on all year long!



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Post by El_Gato » Wed Oct 20, 2004 7:21 pm

Meat,

I'm not talking about the SCHOOLS, per se; I'm talking about the performance of our student-athletes. Trust me when I tell you that if you really start digging, you'll find there is a SIGNIFICANT difference in academic performance at the 2 schools.

If you don't care, then why bring up academics at all as you did earlier?

Just take your lumps as we do in football most times & admit that when it comes to academics, your school should be aspiring to achieve OUR level of achievement. Based on my & others here ability to be objective & admit where the Griz are & have been superior, I had hoped for better from you on this topic.


Grizzlies: 2-5 when it matters most

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