Let's talk offense.

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Bear Spray II
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by Bear Spray II » Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:21 pm

TomCat88 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 7:56 am
Offense? There's not much to talk about. Neither team was very good on offense. UM had one good play. MSU had one good, meaningless drive, which was the most impressive scoring drive of the game. If that doesn't say it all right there.

MSU was either weak at QB, OL or OC. UM was okay at QB, but the rest of their offense was just as bad, even worse in some areas, than MSU's.

Just an all-around ugly, sloppy game. Neither team deserved to win, offensively.

Two of three TDs were just flukes. The other was at garbage time. One FG bounced over the crossbar, the others were set up by short drives with one being a negative yardage drive.
This. 2 outstanding defenses, there's is a little better than I thought. MT rushed for 56. 56 ain't gonna get it done in the playoffs. They passed for 237 - 74 on the first pass. Take away that 1 play and the fake field goal disaster & you have a 15 - 10 game, and the ugly one we expected. Don't get me wrong, UM's a good team & deserved the win, but it wasn't as bad as you may think. Our O line has to step it up. Our game plan has to adjust as well - we can't expect to go far in the playoffs running up the middle all day & hoping the D can keep the game in hand. We have to go out there and play to win, which starts with the OC designing a game plan to exploit the D & spread it out. My 10 cents,



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by Woodenshoe » Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm

I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by onceacat » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:17 pm

Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
Great long term plan. And one that our various staffs have been working on for decades. I think of all the badass dudes on the O-Line over the last 15 years...JP Flynn, Mike Person, Goedecke, Weidenaar, Brott, Kidd, Redd, Wood, Tui, Foster, Sampson, and more that I'm not recalling off the top of my head.

But in the meantime, in reality, we have to work with injuries, early graduations, transfers...

You play with the team you have, not the team you wish you had.



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by BleedingBLue » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:37 pm

coochorama42 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:01 pm
killinthegriz4 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:53 pm
Go with Rovig. Maybe McKay is better all around, but he is making too many mistakes and is like a deer in the headlights of pocket pressure. Put someone in there hungry and not gun shy.
You might have seen this happen had Bauman not been hurt. But what happens if you bench McKay for Rovig and Rovig gets hurt? McKay seems to play better when he is confident. And I believe Mellott might just be the future QB, but he clearly is not ready this year.
He's already got zero confidence so benching him won't make that any worse. But as coloradocat said, he can come back next year so it probably won't happen.



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by CARDIAC_CATS » Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:32 am

Also is it a smart idea for our QB to be wearing a hoodie where he can be yanked down from behind (and/or injured)? I thought that was really odd they would let him wear a hoodie out there. Plus, I think that would also affect your throwing motion some as well (head movement as it binds up). Maybe it isn't a big deal, but I just thought it was strange to change that up as it was NOT that cold out.



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Lord Vigo
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by Lord Vigo » Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:43 am

One thing that I don't think has been brought up is that part of the equation in pass pro is setting protections. McKay and/or Perkins weren't able to get things dialed in to prevent free rushers.



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by coloradocat » Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:58 am

CARDIAC_CATS wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:32 am
Also is it a smart idea for our QB to be wearing a hoodie where he can be yanked down from behind (and/or injured)? I thought that was really odd they would let him wear a hoodie out there. Plus, I think that would also affect your throwing motion some as well (head movement as it binds up). Maybe it isn't a big deal, but I just thought it was strange to change that up as it was NOT that cold out.
I prefer the Crown Royal bag over the hoodie.


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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by CARDIAC_CATS » Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:02 am

coloradocat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:58 am
CARDIAC_CATS wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:32 am
Also is it a smart idea for our QB to be wearing a hoodie where he can be yanked down from behind (and/or injured)? I thought that was really odd they would let him wear a hoodie out there. Plus, I think that would also affect your throwing motion some as well (head movement as it binds up). Maybe it isn't a big deal, but I just thought it was strange to change that up as it was NOT that cold out.
I prefer the Crown Royal bag over the hoodie.
Me too after that game :lol: :lol:



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by utucats » Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am

Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.


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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by Slackjaw » Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:15 am

utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.

Exactly. There's only so much an O-line can do when the defense sends all three backers every 3rd and 6 or greater. The fact that everybody knew that that was UM's MO on defense and we had nothing to counter it was a complete failure by the offensive coordinator and the offensive coordinator alone. That was quite possibly the poorest play calling/game planning I've ever witnessed. Any o-coordinator and QB worth a damn should be salivating at the opportunity that that kind of pressure presents. Instead, we were left with horrible play calls and a QB that was scared ******. The Griz would have been tore a new one again if Matt Miller was calling plays on Saturday.


If not this year?.........When?

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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by wbtfg » Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:16 am

utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.
I don't think the OC was ready for the blitz. Which boggles my mind considering that's what Montana does.



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by CelticCat » Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:43 am

Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:15 am
utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.

Exactly. There's only so much an O-line can do when the defense sends all three backers every 3rd and 6 or greater. The fact that everybody knew that that was UM's MO on defense and we had nothing to counter it was a complete failure by the offensive coordinator and the offensive coordinator alone. That was quite possibly the poorest play calling/game planning I've ever witnessed. Any o-coordinator and QB worth a damn should be salivating at the opportunity that that kind of pressure presents. Instead, we were left with horrible play calls and a QB that was scared ******. The Griz would have been tore a new one again if Matt Miller was calling plays on Saturday.
I won't argue, but Montana has done this to a lot more schools than just MSU this season. Let's give them some credit, if it was that easy Montana wouldn't be 9-2 with a win over Washington.


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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by Slackjaw » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:04 pm

CelticCat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:43 am
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:15 am
utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.

Exactly. There's only so much an O-line can do when the defense sends all three backers every 3rd and 6 or greater. The fact that everybody knew that that was UM's MO on defense and we had nothing to counter it was a complete failure by the offensive coordinator and the offensive coordinator alone. That was quite possibly the poorest play calling/game planning I've ever witnessed. Any o-coordinator and QB worth a damn should be salivating at the opportunity that that kind of pressure presents. Instead, we were left with horrible play calls and a QB that was scared ******. The Griz would have been tore a new one again if Matt Miller was calling plays on Saturday.
I won't argue, but Montana has done this to a lot more schools than just MSU this season. Let's give them some credit, if it was that easy Montana wouldn't be 9-2 with a win over Washington.
I'm not saying the score would have been the same as in 2019. What I am saying is we run for nearly the same type of yardage. For one possession we called plays similarly as the 2019 game and we marched right down the field. And then we never returned to those plays. If they are going to send so much pressure right up the middle of an offense, you have to hit the edge quickly and take advantage of the open field and one on ones you get. I implore everybody to watch the 2019 game and where we attacked them. Then watch the one successful series we had at the beginning of the game and compare that to how the rest of the game was called. It was completely crazy that we didn't come back to it. You have to get that type of defense moving horizontal to stop the vertical pressure prior to trying to run inside. You'll notice most inside runs in 2019 were combined with some sort of jet motion. You'll see lots of quick screens, reverses, jet sweeps, dual back runs to outside, lots of formations to get outside leverage.

This gameplan was a complete fail. Way to passive in the pass game, and completely wrong in the run game. O-coordinator needs to be demoted and given more time to learn considering we have other play callers on the coaching staff.


If not this year?.........When?

bobcatfan123
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by bobcatfan123 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:15 pm

Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:04 pm
CelticCat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:43 am
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:15 am
utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.

Exactly. There's only so much an O-line can do when the defense sends all three backers every 3rd and 6 or greater. The fact that everybody knew that that was UM's MO on defense and we had nothing to counter it was a complete failure by the offensive coordinator and the offensive coordinator alone. That was quite possibly the poorest play calling/game planning I've ever witnessed. Any o-coordinator and QB worth a damn should be salivating at the opportunity that that kind of pressure presents. Instead, we were left with horrible play calls and a QB that was scared ******. The Griz would have been tore a new one again if Matt Miller was calling plays on Saturday.
I won't argue, but Montana has done this to a lot more schools than just MSU this season. Let's give them some credit, if it was that easy Montana wouldn't be 9-2 with a win over Washington.
I'm not saying the score would have been the same as in 2019. What I am saying is we run for nearly the same type of yardage. For one possession we called plays similarly as the 2019 game and we marched right down the field. And then we never returned to those plays. If they are going to send so much pressure right up the middle of an offense, you have to hit the edge quickly and take advantage of the open field and one on ones you get. I implore everybody to watch the 2019 game and where we attacked them. Then watch the one successful series we had at the beginning of the game and compare that to how the rest of the game was called. It was completely crazy that we didn't come back to it. You have to get that type of defense moving horizontal to stop the vertical pressure prior to trying to run inside. You'll notice most inside runs in 2019 were combined with some sort of jet motion. You'll see lots of quick screens, reverses, jet sweeps, dual back runs to outside, lots of formations to get outside leverage.

This gameplan was a complete fail. Way to passive in the pass game, and completely wrong in the run game. O-coordinator needs to be demoted and given more time to learn considering we have other play callers on the coaching staff.
I agree with all you said. I wish Housewright the best as he seems like a good dude. However, he does not have the skill set needed to be competitive at this level yet. Choate had the resolve to make those tough changes when necessary ( Armstrong), I guess we will see how this shakes out.



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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by iaafan » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:44 pm

bobcatfan123 wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:15 pm
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:04 pm
CelticCat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:43 am
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:15 am
utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.

Exactly. There's only so much an O-line can do when the defense sends all three backers every 3rd and 6 or greater. The fact that everybody knew that that was UM's MO on defense and we had nothing to counter it was a complete failure by the offensive coordinator and the offensive coordinator alone. That was quite possibly the poorest play calling/game planning I've ever witnessed. Any o-coordinator and QB worth a damn should be salivating at the opportunity that that kind of pressure presents. Instead, we were left with horrible play calls and a QB that was scared ******. The Griz would have been tore a new one again if Matt Miller was calling plays on Saturday.
I won't argue, but Montana has done this to a lot more schools than just MSU this season. Let's give them some credit, if it was that easy Montana wouldn't be 9-2 with a win over Washington.
I'm not saying the score would have been the same as in 2019. What I am saying is we run for nearly the same type of yardage. For one possession we called plays similarly as the 2019 game and we marched right down the field. And then we never returned to those plays. If they are going to send so much pressure right up the middle of an offense, you have to hit the edge quickly and take advantage of the open field and one on ones you get. I implore everybody to watch the 2019 game and where we attacked them. Then watch the one successful series we had at the beginning of the game and compare that to how the rest of the game was called. It was completely crazy that we didn't come back to it. You have to get that type of defense moving horizontal to stop the vertical pressure prior to trying to run inside. You'll notice most inside runs in 2019 were combined with some sort of jet motion. You'll see lots of quick screens, reverses, jet sweeps, dual back runs to outside, lots of formations to get outside leverage.

This gameplan was a complete fail. Way to passive in the pass game, and completely wrong in the run game. O-coordinator needs to be demoted and given more time to learn considering we have other play callers on the coaching staff.
I agree with all you said. I wish Housewright the best as he seems like a good dude. However, he does not have the skill set needed to be competitive at this level yet. Choate had the resolve to make those tough changes when necessary ( Armstrong), I guess we will see how this shakes out.
Vigen was/is very upset with Housewright. He gave him the freedom to come up with a game plan and he basically did the exact opposite of what he should've done and by the time it was obvious it was too late to do anything about it. He completely dropped the ball, but the way the game went it may not have mattered. One big play on offense, one big play on defense and Bergen getting them in FG range three times with PRs might've been enough to beat us right there. That's 23 points.

What's done is done. At hand now is what to do about the offense in the coming two weeks. It's going to be difficult to revamp it much.
Mellott isn't ready to start...or is he?
Can Rovig be more productive than McKay?
Is Bauman still hurt and if not, is he an option?

The only think the coaches can do that is simple and that will be effective is get Troy Andersen on the offensive side of the ball. Mellott, Rovig and Bauman may not be an answer on offense, but Troy is and we have guys that can fill in for him. Danny U is a stud and he played very well whenever he was used. Is he Troy? No. But remember we didn't even have Troy at all in 2019 and beat UM, Albany and APU. It's worth a shot and I think it's the best shot we have.

Lineup McKay at QB with Ifanse directly behind him and Troy and Tommy flanking Ifanse. Split McKay out to WR and have Ifanse/Mellott/Andersen take direct snaps and run option with Mellott throwing the occasional pass. Once team start adjusting have McKay stay in position and chuck the ball out to McCutcheon, Patterson, TEs, etc. It seems very obvious to me that this, or something like it, is what needs to be injected into the offense. I don't think it would be that complicated to do with the bye week available. I'm sure I'll get run off the board for this, but it just seems like the best option.



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CelticCat
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by CelticCat » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:58 pm

iaafan wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:44 pm
bobcatfan123 wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:15 pm
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:04 pm
CelticCat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:43 am
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:15 am
utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.

Exactly. There's only so much an O-line can do when the defense sends all three backers every 3rd and 6 or greater. The fact that everybody knew that that was UM's MO on defense and we had nothing to counter it was a complete failure by the offensive coordinator and the offensive coordinator alone. That was quite possibly the poorest play calling/game planning I've ever witnessed. Any o-coordinator and QB worth a damn should be salivating at the opportunity that that kind of pressure presents. Instead, we were left with horrible play calls and a QB that was scared ******. The Griz would have been tore a new one again if Matt Miller was calling plays on Saturday.
I won't argue, but Montana has done this to a lot more schools than just MSU this season. Let's give them some credit, if it was that easy Montana wouldn't be 9-2 with a win over Washington.
I'm not saying the score would have been the same as in 2019. What I am saying is we run for nearly the same type of yardage. For one possession we called plays similarly as the 2019 game and we marched right down the field. And then we never returned to those plays. If they are going to send so much pressure right up the middle of an offense, you have to hit the edge quickly and take advantage of the open field and one on ones you get. I implore everybody to watch the 2019 game and where we attacked them. Then watch the one successful series we had at the beginning of the game and compare that to how the rest of the game was called. It was completely crazy that we didn't come back to it. You have to get that type of defense moving horizontal to stop the vertical pressure prior to trying to run inside. You'll notice most inside runs in 2019 were combined with some sort of jet motion. You'll see lots of quick screens, reverses, jet sweeps, dual back runs to outside, lots of formations to get outside leverage.

This gameplan was a complete fail. Way to passive in the pass game, and completely wrong in the run game. O-coordinator needs to be demoted and given more time to learn considering we have other play callers on the coaching staff.
I agree with all you said. I wish Housewright the best as he seems like a good dude. However, he does not have the skill set needed to be competitive at this level yet. Choate had the resolve to make those tough changes when necessary ( Armstrong), I guess we will see how this shakes out.
Vigen was/is very upset with Housewright. He gave him the freedom to come up with a game plan and he basically did the exact opposite of what he should've done and by the time it was obvious it was too late to do anything about it. He completely dropped the ball, but the way the game went it may not have mattered. One big play on offense, one big play on defense and Bergen getting them in FG range three times with PRs might've been enough to beat us right there. That's 23 points.

What's done is done. At hand now is what to do about the offense in the coming two weeks. It's going to be difficult to revamp it much.
Mellott isn't ready to start...or is he?
Can Rovig be more productive than McKay?
Is Bauman still hurt and if not, is he an option?

The only think the coaches can do that is simple and that will be effective is get Troy Andersen on the offensive side of the ball. Mellott, Rovig and Bauman may not be an answer on offense, but Troy is and we have guys that can fill in for him. Danny U is a stud and he played very well whenever he was used. Is he Troy? No. But remember we didn't even have Troy at all in 2019 and beat UM, Albany and APU. It's worth a shot and I think it's the best shot we have.

Lineup McKay at QB with Ifanse directly behind him and Troy and Tommy flanking Ifanse. Split McKay out to WR and have Ifanse/Mellott/Andersen take direct snaps and run option with Mellott throwing the occasional pass. Once team start adjusting have McKay stay in position and chuck the ball out to McCutcheon, Patterson, TEs, etc. It seems very obvious to me that this, or something like it, is what needs to be injected into the offense. I don't think it would be that complicated to do with the bye week available. I'm sure I'll get run off the board for this, but it just seems like the best option.
Just curious, how do you know Vigen's feelings on Housewright? I hope he's unhappy, and frankly I'd almost like to see Vigen be more involved here in the playoffs.


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Lord Vigo
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by Lord Vigo » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:31 pm

CelticCat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:58 pm
iaafan wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:44 pm
bobcatfan123 wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:15 pm
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:04 pm
CelticCat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:43 am
Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:15 am
utucats wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:05 am
Woodenshoe wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:34 pm
I think the core of the problem is really the office of line. We need big gnarly strong guys to protect the quarterback so he can do his job, and create some holes for the RB. I really hope vegan can go out and recruit those kinds of guys. And develop players like we see at ndsu.
O line needs to play better, no doubt. However, if you blitz like crazy the o line is going to get overwhelmed. It is the job of the OC and QB to call and execute plays that punish a defense for being that aggressive.

Exactly. There's only so much an O-line can do when the defense sends all three backers every 3rd and 6 or greater. The fact that everybody knew that that was UM's MO on defense and we had nothing to counter it was a complete failure by the offensive coordinator and the offensive coordinator alone. That was quite possibly the poorest play calling/game planning I've ever witnessed. Any o-coordinator and QB worth a damn should be salivating at the opportunity that that kind of pressure presents. Instead, we were left with horrible play calls and a QB that was scared ******. The Griz would have been tore a new one again if Matt Miller was calling plays on Saturday.
I won't argue, but Montana has done this to a lot more schools than just MSU this season. Let's give them some credit, if it was that easy Montana wouldn't be 9-2 with a win over Washington.
I'm not saying the score would have been the same as in 2019. What I am saying is we run for nearly the same type of yardage. For one possession we called plays similarly as the 2019 game and we marched right down the field. And then we never returned to those plays. If they are going to send so much pressure right up the middle of an offense, you have to hit the edge quickly and take advantage of the open field and one on ones you get. I implore everybody to watch the 2019 game and where we attacked them. Then watch the one successful series we had at the beginning of the game and compare that to how the rest of the game was called. It was completely crazy that we didn't come back to it. You have to get that type of defense moving horizontal to stop the vertical pressure prior to trying to run inside. You'll notice most inside runs in 2019 were combined with some sort of jet motion. You'll see lots of quick screens, reverses, jet sweeps, dual back runs to outside, lots of formations to get outside leverage.

This gameplan was a complete fail. Way to passive in the pass game, and completely wrong in the run game. O-coordinator needs to be demoted and given more time to learn considering we have other play callers on the coaching staff.
I agree with all you said. I wish Housewright the best as he seems like a good dude. However, he does not have the skill set needed to be competitive at this level yet. Choate had the resolve to make those tough changes when necessary ( Armstrong), I guess we will see how this shakes out.
Vigen was/is very upset with Housewright. He gave him the freedom to come up with a game plan and he basically did the exact opposite of what he should've done and by the time it was obvious it was too late to do anything about it. He completely dropped the ball, but the way the game went it may not have mattered. One big play on offense, one big play on defense and Bergen getting them in FG range three times with PRs might've been enough to beat us right there. That's 23 points.

What's done is done. At hand now is what to do about the offense in the coming two weeks. It's going to be difficult to revamp it much.
Mellott isn't ready to start...or is he?
Can Rovig be more productive than McKay?
Is Bauman still hurt and if not, is he an option?

The only think the coaches can do that is simple and that will be effective is get Troy Andersen on the offensive side of the ball. Mellott, Rovig and Bauman may not be an answer on offense, but Troy is and we have guys that can fill in for him. Danny U is a stud and he played very well whenever he was used. Is he Troy? No. But remember we didn't even have Troy at all in 2019 and beat UM, Albany and APU. It's worth a shot and I think it's the best shot we have.

Lineup McKay at QB with Ifanse directly behind him and Troy and Tommy flanking Ifanse. Split McKay out to WR and have Ifanse/Mellott/Andersen take direct snaps and run option with Mellott throwing the occasional pass. Once team start adjusting have McKay stay in position and chuck the ball out to McCutcheon, Patterson, TEs, etc. It seems very obvious to me that this, or something like it, is what needs to be injected into the offense. I don't think it would be that complicated to do with the bye week available. I'm sure I'll get run off the board for this, but it just seems like the best option.
Just curious, how do you know Vigen's feelings on Housewright? I hope he's unhappy, and frankly I'd almost like to see Vigen be more involved here in the playoffs.
The fact that Vigen has not taken over the OC duties as far as we know is a hint (though far from conclusive) that he supports Housewright and maybe puts more of the blame on the players. Because if he saw a way out of these offensive doldrums, wouldn’t it make sense for him to take the reigns? Though the season isn’t over, so maybe he will.



The MICKSTER
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by The MICKSTER » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:49 pm

As others have stated…..it’s hard to know what was the cause of the CATS’s offensive woes without knowing the game plan/prep for the week and the individual play calls. One thing that was obvious was the CATS didn’t seem to have a Plan B when whatever Plan A was wasn’t working. Some things that puzzled me….

Tommy Mellot ran the ball 7 times and passed 0. It seemed obvious to me that when TM was in, um was in single coverage and sent the house. If you can make it to the 2nd level your off to the races, but that didn’t happen. I looked up his season stats……he’s ran it 36 times and passed it 4 times (2 completions). That was likely about what Travis Jonsen did as well, but let’s face it, Tommy Mellot is a 6’ 195lb 20-year-old in his first season of FCS football. When TM is QB I think they should provide a few more pass plays for him so that when he is in, the defense can’t ‘sell out’ against the run.

Since none of us know what the ‘play calls’ were we don’t know that when McKay threw a ball that was way off the mark…..was that because the WR ran the wrong route, or was his pass just not on target possibly because he didn’t have a lot of time, or was he passing it to the wrong spot (i.e., route). We don’t know, but that to me is something that was more of an internal flaw that didn’t get fixed in the game. That needs to get fixed IMHO.

Offensive execution needs to improve, and it appears a large part of that is the play calling/game planning.

GET HEALTHY AND GO CATS!!!



bobcatfan123
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by bobcatfan123 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:20 pm

The MICKSTER wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:49 pm
As others have stated…..it’s hard to know what was the cause of the CATS’s offensive woes without knowing the game plan/prep for the week and the individual play calls. One thing that was obvious was the CATS didn’t seem to have a Plan B when whatever Plan A was wasn’t working. Some things that puzzled me….

Tommy Mellot ran the ball 7 times and passed 0. It seemed obvious to me that when TM was in, um was in single coverage and sent the house. If you can make it to the 2nd level your off to the races, but that didn’t happen. I looked up his season stats……he’s ran it 36 times and passed it 4 times (2 completions). That was likely about what Travis Jonsen did as well, but let’s face it, Tommy Mellot is a 6’ 195lb 20-year-old in his first season of FCS football. When TM is QB I think they should provide a few more pass plays for him so that when he is in, the defense can’t ‘sell out’ against the run.

Since none of us know what the ‘play calls’ were we don’t know that when McKay threw a ball that was way off the mark…..was that because the WR ran the wrong route, or was his pass just not on target possibly because he didn’t have a lot of time, or was he passing it to the wrong spot (i.e., route). We don’t know, but that to me is something that was more of an internal flaw that didn’t get fixed in the game. That needs to get fixed IMHO.

Offensive execution needs to improve, and it appears a large part of that is the play calling/game planning.

GET HEALTHY AND GO CATS!!!
Agree with you about not having Plan B. We had a mentality that we would run the ball and Griz took away our strength. Apparently our staff didn't think that would happen as plan B didn't exist. We are not built like NDSU this year and I think we could do a much better job of getting creative in our gameplan.

I don't think that Housewright did McKay any favors. But I do see Rovig having more confidence to lead an offense despite his limitations.
Last edited by bobcatfan123 on Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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BozoneCat
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Re: Let's talk offense.

Post by BozoneCat » Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:35 pm

Slackjaw wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:04 pm
I'm not saying the score would have been the same as in 2019. What I am saying is we run for nearly the same type of yardage. For one possession we called plays similarly as the 2019 game and we marched right down the field. And then we never returned to those plays. If they are going to send so much pressure right up the middle of an offense, you have to hit the edge quickly and take advantage of the open field and one on ones you get. I implore everybody to watch the 2019 game and where we attacked them. Then watch the one successful series we had at the beginning of the game and compare that to how the rest of the game was called. It was completely crazy that we didn't come back to it. You have to get that type of defense moving horizontal to stop the vertical pressure prior to trying to run inside. You'll notice most inside runs in 2019 were combined with some sort of jet motion. You'll see lots of quick screens, reverses, jet sweeps, dual back runs to outside, lots of formations to get outside leverage.

This gameplan was a complete fail. Way to passive in the pass game, and completely wrong in the run game. O-coordinator needs to be demoted and given more time to learn considering we have other play callers on the coaching staff.
I've had a weird feeling about the last 2 games. I thought it looked like we came out with a few new wrinkles and looked much better in our first few series against Idaho, and that 2nd possession against the griz. Then, we completely abandoned all of those wrinkles the rest of the game and went back to the uber-conservative predictable stuff that has had us scratching our heads for the latter half of this season. It's very puzzling. Maybe, what that says (at least to my untrained eye) is that our coaching staff has done a good job of setting a game plan during the week and coming up with a few things that have some potential, but as soon as we encounter any kind of adversity, the in-game ability to respond just isn't there. That has to fall on the OC, in my book. And that's probably just inexperience, maybe he'll learn and grow from it. But in the immediate future, we have to figure out something else to help get us through these doldrums.


GO CATS GO!!!

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