Let's talk offense.

[GoldstoneCat]

I'm curious what folks think the answer is (and please don't give me fire the OC, not a thing that's going to happen right this minute). Yesterday i was convinced we needed a QB change, but thinking back through the game I'm not even sure that's justified. Mckay hasn't been great, don't get me wrong, but he was in 3rd and medium or longer way too much and had no time. He missed a couple quick throws where he had time too, definitely not making excuses for him. But i think we need a protection scheme change. It didn't seem like we gave enough help to some of our young o-linemen with keeping TEs in, etc on those longer yardage plays where it was a downfield shot regardless.
Another thing is, i know we've not been a big screen team, but that game was begging for some middle screens and we never did it. Our quick game is all outside, which makes it lower percentage when you have a QB who doesn't always execute great technique on those throws. I expect our run game will be fine as ifanse gets healthy but some scheme changes in the pass pro and pass game sure look in order.

[91catAlum]

I'm not sure the coaches trust McKay to throw over the middle. That's the only explanation for not doing so, really all season but especially against a heavy blitz team like the griz.

They finally started throwing to Snell on that final drive, but too little too late.

[jgrilley406]

The thing is too, we have to establish runs to the outside more often and especially early in the games. Like I’ve been saying since the start of conference play, we can’t just expect ifanse to win us games alone running the ball, we have to use our depth. The reason we’ve been so successful in years past is that we’ve had guys that would stretch the field on the outside, whether it was Murray, freshman Andersen at RB/then QB, Logan Jones, and multiple players on fly sweeps. Yes we had a better overall line in the past, but we would start out games stretching the field, and then come the second half wear them down with ifanse runs up the middle. It seems all we do is try and wear them down with just ifanse up the middle for the whole game.

[catsrback76]

I didn't get to watch the game so everything I say is from just the theoretical and from some experience. With a blitzing team it's feast or famine. When they blitz as frequently as the griz do, then you have to move the pocket, go misdirection with runs and quick passes, and focus on 2nd level passes. Long passes can work but often won't work because of the pressure, you take those on first downs.

Using the TE's are a must and the RB's in the passing game is also a must!

[GoldstoneCat]

The thing is too, we have to establish runs to the outside more often and especially early in the games. Like I’ve been saying since the start of conference play, we can’t just expect ifanse to win us games alone running the ball, we have to use our depth. The reason we’ve been so successful in years past is that we’ve had guys that would stretch the field on the outside, whether it was Murray, freshman Andersen at RB/then QB, Logan Jones, and multiple players on fly sweeps. Yes we had a better overall line in the past, but we would start out games stretching the field, and then come the second half wear them down with ifanse runs up the middle. It seems all we do is try and wear them down with just ifanse up the middle for the whole game.

I think they did establish outside against Idaho with the speed option. We ran it once yesterday and if Ifanse had made the first guy miss it was a huge play. I didn't initially think he looked hurt but i have to think he wasn't close to 100%. But yeah i agree more things for the d to look at always helps, as does getting them running sideways. That all has to be complemented by timely throws, of course, which we couldn't get yesterday.

[TomCat88]

Offense? There's not much to talk about. Neither team was very good on offense. UM had one good play. MSU had one good, meaningless drive, which was the most impressive scoring drive of the game. If that doesn't say it all right there.

MSU was either weak at QB, OL or OC. UM was okay at QB, but the rest of their offense was just as bad, even worse in some areas, than MSU's.

Just an all-around ugly, sloppy game. Neither team deserved to win, offensively.

Two of three TDs were just flukes. The other was at garbage time. One FG bounced over the crossbar, the others were set up by short drives with one being a negative yardage drive.

[jgrilley406]

Offense? There's not much to talk about. Neither team was very good on offense. UM had one good play. MSU had one good, meaningless drive, which was the most impressive scoring drive of the game. If that doesn't say it all right there.

MSU was either weak at QB, OL or OC. UM was okay at QB, but the rest of their offense was just as bad, even worse in some areas, than MSU's.

Just an all-around ugly, sloppy game. Neither team deserved to win, offensively.



Two of three TDs were just flukes. The other was at garbage time. One FG bounced over the crossbar, the others were set up by short drives with one being a negative yardage drive.

That’s what I said in another thread, just looking at how each teams offense not only played today but for majority of the season, neither team sadly enough will make it to the semi’s, like we did last year. Each teams defense is good enough too, but to expect to win games in the playoffs just by scoring FGs or assuming that your defense will shut them out, isn’t going to cut it. Especially since either UM or bobcats will more than likely being facing a scary SDSU team that is tough on both sides of the ball first.

[autocat]

Tucker….. he won the BRAWL last year and he has playoff experience, just needs to complete 10-12 passes per game for the remainder of the season and YES Tommy can continue his role offensively

[autocat]

Time flies, Tucker executed within the offensive game plan TWO years ago

[TomCat88]

It would be a great story if Rovig did get inserted at QB and got MSU rolling again. He's been counted out so many times. However, MSU also needs to revert back to its style of running and play-calling that it used under Matt Miller.

MSU is kind of to the point where it has to try something, because it's obviously up-and-down offensively. My only hesitance is that there may be good reason for why MSU struggled in some games and done well in some areas down the stretch.

Vigen was obviously frustrated yesterday, but he didn't elaborate. So it's really hard to say. I know he's constantly preached that the players have to trust each other, which usually means things like the QB isn't looking for certain players or that blockers are leaving their man to help someone else, etc. Maybe that's it? Very hard to say. Sometimes you get everyone lined out in practice, then some of the players go off script and it throws everything into a tizzy.

[Doc3kgt]

I'm not sure how to specifically diagnose the issues.. but I can say as an observer of every game that they are very predictable with play calling. Miller always mixed it up and twists and variations, he was creative. I don't see that this year. Too many runs up the middle. No short passing game, no TE involvement in the passing game (which you would think you'd want with a unsettled QB). When we do run the ball it is up the middle. Where is the misdirection? Where is all the window dressing that gets he opposing defense's heads spinning? Maybe we don't have the OL to pull that off anymore? I do know this much, bobcatnation can tolerate a loss in the Brawl...thinking you're going to win every single one isn't realistic (not saying we shouldn't think that though), but one thing bobcatnation won't tolerate is an ass kicking. We have to be at least competitive in these games, period. Coaches need to find a way to be put these guys in a position to be successful. The Griz aren't God's gift to football, they barely beat SUU at home.

[jgrilley406]

I'm not sure how to specifically diagnose the issues.. but I can say as an observer of every game that they are very predictable with play calling. Miller always mixed it up and twists and variations, he was creative. I don't see that this year. Too many runs up the middle. No short passing game, no TE involvement in the passing game (which you would think you'd want with a unsettled QB). When we do run the ball it is up the middle. Where is the misdirection? Where is all the window dressing that gets he opposing defense's heads spinning? Maybe we don't have the OL to pull that off anymore? I do know this much, bobcatnation can tolerate a loss in the Brawl...thinking you're going to win every single one isn't realistic (not saying we shouldn't think that though), but one thing bobcatnation won't tolerate is an ass kicking. We have to be at least competitive in these games, period. Coaches need to find a way to be put these guys in a position to be successful. The Griz aren't God's gift to football, they barely beat SUU at home.

Think that is what is so bad about how bad we lost by, we just gave them that feeling that they had when they beat UW. That they are the Grizzlies of the old and have made it as the team to beat now. Unless major changes happen for both offense’s, neither offense right now is good enough to get a team to the semi’s.

[bobcatfan123]

Quite frankly, it’s offensive

[Camo_Cat]

IMHO, it's a couple things. It starts with the O-line, just like every other offense in the nation. The late departure of Connor Wood forced our coaches to shuffle players around into positions that were not a natural fit for them, or positions where just haven't played. Lewis Kidd is the ideal example. He's been playing left tackle this year, a change from the right guard position he has always played. That's actually quite an adjustment, but Lewis is talented enough where I thought he could pull it off. But he's really struggled with the change. Throw in two freshmen starting on the line, and we frankly just don't have the experience or continuity that you really need, Take a peek at Ifanse's biggest runs or most successful rushing games. Many of those yards, he's picking up by himself. It's not like our o-line is blowing open gaping running holes, or even providing time in the pocket for McKay.

Because of these changes, I really believe it it has caused our coaches to call for plays that require simple, straight-forward blocking schemes. Just block the guy in front of you. There has been no complex pulling schemes, or the plays where the line doesn't just block straight up. Thats's why the blitzing attack of the griz caused too many problems. Any creative playcalling will have to involve the o-line blocking scheme to become more complex, and I just don't think the coaches are confident enough in our line play to change things up.

Lastly, we have completely abandoned the tight ends in offensive. And I think that's a direct result of mediocre o-line play, and our coaches feeling that we need them to be blocking instead of involved in the pass game. We ran some beautiful plays to the TEs early in the season, but the poor play of o-line has forced them to get back on the line to block.

[onceacat]

IMHO, it's a couple things. It starts with the O-line, just like every other offense in the nation. The late departure of Connor Wood forced our coaches to shuffle players around into positions that were not a natural fit for them, or positions where just haven't played. Lewis Kidd is the ideal example. He's been playing left tackle this year, a change from the right guard position he has always played. That's actually quite an adjustment, but Lewis is talented enough where I thought he could pull it off. But he's really struggled with the change. Throw in two freshmen starting on the line, and we frankly just don't have the experience or continuity that you really need, Take a peek at Ifanse's biggest runs or most successful rushing games. Many of those yards, he's picking up by himself. It's not like our o-line is blowing open gaping running holes, or even providing time in the pocket for McKay.

Because of these changes, I really believe it it has caused our coaches to call for plays that require simple, straight-forward blocking schemes. Just block the guy in front of you. There has been no complex pulling schemes, or the plays where the line doesn't just block straight up. Thats's why the blitzing attack of the griz caused too many problems. Any creative playcalling will have to involve the o-line blocking scheme to become more complex, and I just don't think the coaches are confident enough in our line play to change things up.

Lastly, we have completely abandoned the tight ends in offensive. And I think that's a direct result of mediocre o-line play, and our coaches feeling that we need them to be blocking instead of involved in the pass game. We ran some beautiful plays to the TEs early in the season, but the poor play of o-line has forced them to get back on the line to block.

I think all of that is fair analysis, and all pretty accurate.

What I’m trying to figure out is why haven’t the Cats adapted to do anything other than run directly into the strength of opposing defenses?

It’s not like Oline players out of HS don’t have experience with things like screens, draws, bootlegs, shovel passes, etc that you use when your Oline is overmatched.

[GoldstoneCat]

IMHO, it's a couple things. It starts with the O-line, just like every other offense in the nation. The late departure of Connor Wood forced our coaches to shuffle players around into positions that were not a natural fit for them, or positions where just haven't played. Lewis Kidd is the ideal example. He's been playing left tackle this year, a change from the right guard position he has always played. That's actually quite an adjustment, but Lewis is talented enough where I thought he could pull it off. But he's really struggled with the change. Throw in two freshmen starting on the line, and we frankly just don't have the experience or continuity that you really need, Take a peek at Ifanse's biggest runs or most successful rushing games. Many of those yards, he's picking up by himself. It's not like our o-line is blowing open gaping running holes, or even providing time in the pocket for McKay.

Because of these changes, I really believe it it has caused our coaches to call for plays that require simple, straight-forward blocking schemes. Just block the guy in front of you. There has been no complex pulling schemes, or the plays where the line doesn't just block straight up. Thats's why the blitzing attack of the griz caused too many problems. Any creative playcalling will have to involve the o-line blocking scheme to become more complex, and I just don't think the coaches are confident enough in our line play to change things up.

Lastly, we have completely abandoned the tight ends in offensive. And I think that's a direct result of mediocre o-line play, and our coaches feeling that we need them to be blocking instead of involved in the pass game. We ran some beautiful plays to the TEs early in the season, but the poor play of o-line has forced them to get back on the line to block.

Good post and a good reminder that it all starts up front, still, and that we probably aren't as good there as we thought we were. Creativity is needed to create open receivers when the scheme has to be simple, hopefully we get a bye (likely) and can self-scout our way to some better schemes.

[aucat]

It would be interesting to look at the game films UM's games against Sac State and EWU. Both of those teams whipped the Griz.
Hell, we couldn't even compete to make the game interesting.

[wbtfg]

It would be interesting to look at the game films UM's games against Sac State and EWU. Both of those teams whipped the Griz.
Hell, we couldn't even compete to make the game interesting.

Both those teams ran a lot of 2back sets. We ran more empty than I’ve seen all year. That was not a good strategy against UM’s blitzing LBs.

Also, continuing trends from the year. No qb rollouts, matt never keeps it, Tommy never hands it, no screen game, abandoned the TE. Very little fly sweep action. Hardly saw any RJ fitz.

[bobcatfan123]

It would be interesting to look at the game films UM's games against Sac State and EWU. Both of those teams whipped the Griz.
Hell, we couldn't even compete to make the game interesting.

Both those teams ran a lot of 2back sets. We ran more empty than I’ve seen all year. That was not a good strategy against UM’s blitzing LBs.

Also, continuing trends from the year. No qb rollouts, matt never keeps it, Tommy never hands it, no screen game, abandoned the TE. Very little fly sweep action. Hardly saw any RJ fitz.

Hard to even know what they were attempting as far as a gamelan. Apparently the game announcers also made comments about the puzzling offensive strategy

[wbtfg]

It would be interesting to look at the game films UM's games against Sac State and EWU. Both of those teams whipped the Griz.
Hell, we couldn't even compete to make the game interesting.

Both those teams ran a lot of 2back sets. We ran more empty than I’ve seen all year. That was not a good strategy against UM’s blitzing LBs.

Also, continuing trends from the year. No qb rollouts, matt never keeps it, Tommy never hands it, no screen game, abandoned the TE. Very little fly sweep action. Hardly saw any RJ fitz.

Hard to even know what they were attempting as far as a gamelan. Apparently the game announcers also made comments about the puzzling offensive strategy

Yep. They did.