Long Island

Discuss anything and everything relating to Bobcat Football here.

Moderators: kmax, SonomaCat, rtb

User avatar
Hawks86
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 9368
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 3:27 pm
Location: MT

Long Island

Post by Hawks86 » Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:59 pm





"I'm a Bobcat forever its in my soul..."

Image

User avatar
PapaG
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 6448
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2004 11:44 am
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Long Island

Post by PapaG » Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:31 pm

Kiss FCS football goodbye as we know it.

So what’s the next step? MSU and UM both have solid programs that will survive, along with NDSU (obviously), SDSU, and Illinois State. Weber State as well. Find six more programs like Wyoming, Boise State, Utah State, Fresno State, San Diego State, and Colorado State and form some sort of conference or division that compromises on football scholarships?

It’s time to start thinking forward for the future of Montana college football.


Greg K.

User avatar
coloradocat
BobcatNation Team Captain
Posts: 665
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:24 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by coloradocat » Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:37 pm

This was always just a matter of time. We were never going to play LIU after NY got hit hard. At least now it's official and we can hopefully finalize a deal with a replacement.



User avatar
CelticCat
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 10126
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:55 pm
Location: Mt Vernon, WA

Re: Long Island

Post by CelticCat » Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:38 pm

PapaG wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:31 pm
Kiss FCS football goodbye as we know it.

So what’s the next step? MSU and UM both have solid programs that will survive, along with NDSU (obviously), SDSU, and Illinois State. Weber State as well. Find six more programs like Wyoming, Boise State, Utah State, Fresno State, San Diego State, and Colorado State and form some sort of conference or division that compromises on football scholarships?

It’s time to start thinking forward for the future of Montana college football.
If the season is indeed toast, there very well could be reshuffling. Top tier FCS and the "G5" or whatever it's called may start banding together. There are going to be some programs who don't survive this.


R&R Cat Cast - the only Bobcat fan podcast - https://anchor.fm/rrcatcast
Twitter - https://twitter.com/rrcatcast

User avatar
coloradocat
BobcatNation Team Captain
Posts: 665
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:24 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by coloradocat » Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:01 pm

SDSU already had a bye in week 2 (weird) so they could replace the Utah game.

Both Illinois St and Northern Iowa had Big Ten games in week 1 so maybe one of them would replace LIU.

There are some Mountain West possibilities also after they lost Pac-12 games.



BleedingBLue
Member # Retired
Posts: 2969
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2015 1:00 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by BleedingBLue » Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:01 pm

CelticCat wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:38 pm
PapaG wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:31 pm
Kiss FCS football goodbye as we know it.

So what’s the next step? MSU and UM both have solid programs that will survive, along with NDSU (obviously), SDSU, and Illinois State. Weber State as well. Find six more programs like Wyoming, Boise State, Utah State, Fresno State, San Diego State, and Colorado State and form some sort of conference or division that compromises on football scholarships?

It’s time to start thinking forward for the future of Montana college football.
If the season is indeed toast, there very well could be reshuffling. Top tier FCS and the "G5" or whatever it's called may start banding together. There are going to be some programs who don't survive this.
Without a doubt. I've said a couple times I can see 75% of the BSC going bye bye for football. But perhaps the remainder of the BSC and MVFC can create a conference if FCS football remains a thing.



MSU01
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 4213
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2004 5:21 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by MSU01 » Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:31 pm

Virtually all FCS football programs do not turn a profit for their schools, so I'm not sure why we're assuming that the full or partial cancellation of this season would kill off a significant chunk of FCS football. I'd guess that the less popular sports are far more at risk, and that most schools will do all they can to save the football program.


Go Bobcats! 24-17 31-23 29-25 48-14

AFCAT
BobcatNation Hall of Famer
Posts: 3082
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:25 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by AFCAT » Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:06 pm

MSU01 wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:31 pm
Virtually all FCS football programs do not turn a profit for their schools, so I'm not sure why we're assuming that the full or partial cancellation of this season would kill off a significant chunk of FCS football. I'd guess that the less popular sports are far more at risk, and that most schools will do all they can to save the football program.
They would still have bills to pay; scholarships, coaches compensation, equipment, recruiting, etc. No revenue from tickets sales, tv contracts, student fees (certainly they would be decreased), donor contributions, sponsorships, etc., would be a huge hit to every program. Some programs may not be able to recover.


Help the Cats! Join the quarterback club!!
https://www.bobcatquarterbackclub.com
Want to pledge or donate to the Bobcat facilities plan?!
http://www.msuaf.org/msuathleticcomplex
Contact the Alumni Foundation at:
406-994-2092

User avatar
PapaG
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 6448
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2004 11:44 am
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Long Island

Post by PapaG » Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:15 pm

MSU01 wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:31 pm
Virtually all FCS football programs do not turn a profit for their schools, so I'm not sure why we're assuming that the full or partial cancellation of this season would kill off a significant chunk of FCS football. I'd guess that the less popular sports are far more at risk, and that most schools will do all they can to save the football program.
What you’re saying means many FCS programs will be better off without football and the 63 football scholarships plus 63ish women’s sport scholarships at those schools as mandated by Title IX. It’s better for those universities to just concentrate on academics instead of wasting money on sports’ scholarships that already are money losers.

Makes more sense to either cut football or drop down to D2 or D3 in the current NCAA structure.


Greg K.

MSU01
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 4213
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2004 5:21 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by MSU01 » Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:53 pm

AFCAT wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:06 pm
MSU01 wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:31 pm
Virtually all FCS football programs do not turn a profit for their schools, so I'm not sure why we're assuming that the full or partial cancellation of this season would kill off a significant chunk of FCS football. I'd guess that the less popular sports are far more at risk, and that most schools will do all they can to save the football program.
They would still have bills to pay; scholarships, coaches compensation, equipment, recruiting, etc. No revenue from tickets sales, tv contracts, student fees (certainly they would be decreased), donor contributions, sponsorships, etc., would be a huge hit to every program. Some programs may not be able to recover.
Of course there will be a decrease in revenue by not having a season, and there are fixed costs that a program will incur whether a season is played or not, but there are also variable costs that teams won't need to incur (travel costs for road games being a major one) if games aren't played. Also, what is the financial impact of cancelling other sports that bring in very little if any revenue? I haven't seen any real analysis of the financial impact of not having a season - a lot of guesswork but no actual numbers. The majority of FCS schools have far less of a revenue stream coming in than the likes of MSU, UM, NDSU, etc. No TV deals, a few thousand fans per game, presumably fewer private donations coming in.


Go Bobcats! 24-17 31-23 29-25 48-14

AFCAT
BobcatNation Hall of Famer
Posts: 3082
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:25 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by AFCAT » Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:23 pm

MSU01 wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:53 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:06 pm
MSU01 wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:31 pm
Virtually all FCS football programs do not turn a profit for their schools, so I'm not sure why we're assuming that the full or partial cancellation of this season would kill off a significant chunk of FCS football. I'd guess that the less popular sports are far more at risk, and that most schools will do all they can to save the football program.
They would still have bills to pay; scholarships, coaches compensation, equipment, recruiting, etc. No revenue from tickets sales, tv contracts, student fees (certainly they would be decreased), donor contributions, sponsorships, etc., would be a huge hit to every program. Some programs may not be able to recover.
Of course there will be a decrease in revenue by not having a season, and there are fixed costs that a program will incur whether a season is played or not, but there are also variable costs that teams won't need to incur (travel costs for road games being a major one) if games aren't played. Also, what is the financial impact of cancelling other sports that bring in very little if any revenue? I haven't seen any real analysis of the financial impact of not having a season - a lot of guesswork but no actual numbers. The majority of FCS schools have far less of a revenue stream coming in than the likes of MSU, UM, NDSU, etc. No TV deals, a few thousand fans per game, presumably fewer private donations coming in.
A lot of those FCS programs (including MSU) have to play money games to make up for deficits they have by not selling a lot of tickets or having other revenues streams. For example; Portland State had two big money games (Arizona and Oregon State) this year that guaranteed them upwards of a million dollars. Not having those games is a major impact for them. Big Sky schools do have small media revenue streams, including some money from TV rights (SWX. Root, maybe Pluto), although nothing like some FBS schools.

This FCS football graph is from 2018, but you can get an idea of where most of a schools expenses go. Travel expenses are relatively low at around 11% of a budget while scholarships, facilities/equipment, coaches compensation, and other administrative costs total around 78%. The amount saved by not traveling doesn't make up for the money spent on those other areas that must be paid every year. I'm sure some of the Big Sky schools living on the edge financially, i.e., Eastern Washington, Portland State, Idaho State, Northern Colorado, and others, will be seriously hurt by playing no games. Heck, EWU was in major trouble even before this Covid situation hit.

Image


Help the Cats! Join the quarterback club!!
https://www.bobcatquarterbackclub.com
Want to pledge or donate to the Bobcat facilities plan?!
http://www.msuaf.org/msuathleticcomplex
Contact the Alumni Foundation at:
406-994-2092

ButteCat
BobcatNation Redshirt
Posts: 89
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:29 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by ButteCat » Thu Jul 30, 2020 7:31 am

If the Big Sky cancels the season, I think we should have a best of 7 with the grizzlies. Of course it would probably be over in 4 games.



wapiti
BobcatNation Team Captain
Posts: 415
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:04 am

Re: Long Island

Post by wapiti » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:13 am

For these games where our opponent has cancelled the game, does that count as a forfeit by them? So we now get to mark a W in the win column.



User avatar
wbtfg
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 10125
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:52 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by wbtfg » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:40 am

wapiti wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:13 am
For these games where our opponent has cancelled the game, does that count as a forfeit by them? So we now get to mark a W in the win column.
Unfortunately I don't think so. If so, Portland State already has 2 wins against Pac-12 teams.

I also wonder how the contract buyouts work for these games. Will we receive our check from Utah? Does Long Island have to buyout due to canceling?



bobcat99
BobcatNation Hall of Famer
Posts: 3778
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2011 1:11 am

Re: Long Island

Post by bobcat99 » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:49 am

MSU01 wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:53 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:06 pm
MSU01 wrote:
Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:31 pm
Virtually all FCS football programs do not turn a profit for their schools, so I'm not sure why we're assuming that the full or partial cancellation of this season would kill off a significant chunk of FCS football. I'd guess that the less popular sports are far more at risk, and that most schools will do all they can to save the football program.
They would still have bills to pay; scholarships, coaches compensation, equipment, recruiting, etc. No revenue from tickets sales, tv contracts, student fees (certainly they would be decreased), donor contributions, sponsorships, etc., would be a huge hit to every program. Some programs may not be able to recover.
Of course there will be a decrease in revenue by not having a season, and there are fixed costs that a program will incur whether a season is played or not, but there are also variable costs that teams won't need to incur (travel costs for road games being a major one) if games aren't played. Also, what is the financial impact of cancelling other sports that bring in very little if any revenue? I haven't seen any real analysis of the financial impact of not having a season - a lot of guesswork but no actual numbers. The majority of FCS schools have far less of a revenue stream coming in than the likes of MSU, UM, NDSU, etc. No TV deals, a few thousand fans per game, presumably fewer private donations coming in.
It's not just a decrease in revenue. That's vastly understating the situation.

By and large across the NCAA, only two sports create revenue. Football, and men's basketball. Even then, not always. I don't think MSU's men's basketball team turns a profit.

So missing out on the Utah game, is a big friggin deal. For other schools, missing out on football is a big deal for the entire athletic department. They need football to stay afloat, otherwise, like Papa said, it makes more sense to drop football bc of Title 9. It would be nice to cancel other sports, but the scholarships gotta equal out. Still have to pay the scholarships.



User avatar
coloradocat
BobcatNation Team Captain
Posts: 665
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:24 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by coloradocat » Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:02 am

wbtfg wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:40 am
wapiti wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:13 am
For these games where our opponent has cancelled the game, does that count as a forfeit by them? So we now get to mark a W in the win column.
Unfortunately I don't think so. If so, Portland State already has 2 wins against Pac-12 teams.

I also wonder how the contract buyouts work for these games. Will we receive our check from Utah? Does Long Island have to buyout due to canceling?
I think this falls under the Act of God clause so the slate is wiped clean for any game impacted.



User avatar
wbtfg
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 10125
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:52 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by wbtfg » Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:27 am

coloradocat wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:02 am
wbtfg wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:40 am
wapiti wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:13 am
For these games where our opponent has cancelled the game, does that count as a forfeit by them? So we now get to mark a W in the win column.
Unfortunately I don't think so. If so, Portland State already has 2 wins against Pac-12 teams.

I also wonder how the contract buyouts work for these games. Will we receive our check from Utah? Does Long Island have to buyout due to canceling?
I think this falls under the Act of God clause so the slate is wiped clean for any game impacted.
I would imagine there will be legal decision that needs to be made. For example, it's not like Utah is canceling their entire season, they have just chosen to cancel non-conference games. If they cancel on us but still play games, I think it could be argued they should be required to pay the buyout.



btribby
BobcatNation Team Captain
Posts: 741
Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:49 pm
Location: Cody, WY

Re: Long Island

Post by btribby » Thu Jul 30, 2020 1:22 pm

When a Conference cancels a football season, why cant any of those schools within those conferences go out and schedule their own games?


When I Wake Up In The Morning I Piss Blue and Gold

Cataholic
Member # Retired
Posts: 2687
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2014 10:09 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by Cataholic » Thu Jul 30, 2020 5:10 pm

wbtfg wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:27 am
coloradocat wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:02 am
wbtfg wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:40 am
wapiti wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:13 am
For these games where our opponent has cancelled the game, does that count as a forfeit by them? So we now get to mark a W in the win column.
Unfortunately I don't think so. If so, Portland State already has 2 wins against Pac-12 teams.

I also wonder how the contract buyouts work for these games. Will we receive our check from Utah? Does Long Island have to buyout due to canceling?
I think this falls under the Act of God clause so the slate is wiped clean for any game impacted.
I would imagine there will be legal decision that needs to be made. For example, it's not like Utah is canceling their entire season, they have just chosen to cancel non-conference games. If they cancel on us but still play games, I think it could be argued they should be required to pay the buyout.
That is a really good argument. You could even argue that MSU plying in Utah had less of a health risk than the Utes playing a game in California.



User avatar
wbtfg
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 10125
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:52 pm

Re: Long Island

Post by wbtfg » Thu Jul 30, 2020 5:14 pm

Cataholic wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 5:10 pm
wbtfg wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:27 am
coloradocat wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:02 am
wbtfg wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:40 am
wapiti wrote:
Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:13 am
For these games where our opponent has cancelled the game, does that count as a forfeit by them? So we now get to mark a W in the win column.
Unfortunately I don't think so. If so, Portland State already has 2 wins against Pac-12 teams.

I also wonder how the contract buyouts work for these games. Will we receive our check from Utah? Does Long Island have to buyout due to canceling?
I think this falls under the Act of God clause so the slate is wiped clean for any game impacted.
I would imagine there will be legal decision that needs to be made. For example, it's not like Utah is canceling their entire season, they have just chosen to cancel non-conference games. If they cancel on us but still play games, I think it could be argued they should be required to pay the buyout.
That is a really good argument. You could even argue that MSU plying in Utah had less of a health risk than the Utes playing a game in California.
Without a doubt.



Post Reply