What If?

[iaafan]

Just FYI, NYC mayor told people that there was no reason to stop using public transportation, in early February. And the gal whose name escapes me now, the NYC public health official, told people to continue riding the subways and using public transportation, in February.

Who is more responsible for the massive outbreak in NYC - Trump, or these local officials? Even Pelosi was in San Fran in February encouraging people to "come down to chinatown, have dinner, its what we're doing"
Not to defend Trump, but it would make alot more sense for people to spread the blame around where its due, rather than just dump it all on Trump.

Yes, absolutely the NYC mayor should be blamed for what's happening in NYC if what he said caused people to get infected and die as should Pelosi and I'd love to have term limits to get rid of people that are in office too long like Pelosi. However, it looks like the SF mayor over road her bad advice as SF is one of the shining examples of how to handle the virus.

There's no "IF" about it. This is NYC Mayor DeBlasio on March 10:
“We want to encourage” New Yorkers going out, the mayor said during a Feb. 10 MSNBC broadcast.
“If you’re under 50 & you’re healthy, which is most NYers, there’s very little threat here. This disease, even if you were to get it, basically acts like a common cold or flu. And transmission is not that easy,” de Blasio said at the time.

Agreed on term limits.

Yep, he should be and is catching hell for that. Sorry for say IF. So should anyone that made similar comments. So if DeBlasio is most at fault for NYC as the mayor, who's the most at fault for the USA?

[91catAlum]

Just FYI, NYC mayor told people that there was no reason to stop using public transportation, in early February. And the gal whose name escapes me now, the NYC public health official, told people to continue riding the subways and using public transportation, in February.

Who is more responsible for the massive outbreak in NYC - Trump, or these local officials? Even Pelosi was in San Fran in February encouraging people to "come down to chinatown, have dinner, its what we're doing"
Not to defend Trump, but it would make alot more sense for people to spread the blame around where its due, rather than just dump it all on Trump.

Yes, absolutely the NYC mayor should be blamed for what's happening in NYC if what he said caused people to get infected and die as should Pelosi and I'd love to have term limits to get rid of people that are in office too long like Pelosi. However, it looks like the SF mayor over road her bad advice as SF is one of the shining examples of how to handle the virus.

There's no "IF" about it. This is NYC Mayor DeBlasio on March 10:
“We want to encourage” New Yorkers going out, the mayor said during a Feb. 10 MSNBC broadcast.
“If you’re under 50 & you’re healthy, which is most NYers, there’s very little threat here. This disease, even if you were to get it, basically acts like a common cold or flu. And transmission is not that easy,” de Blasio said at the time.

Agreed on term limits.

Yep, he should be catching hell for that. So should anyone that made similar comments. So if DeBlasio is most at fault for NYC as the mayor, who's the most at fault for the USA?

I didn't say either was MORE responsible, there's plenty of blame to go around. But the only person I've seen catching hell in this thread is Trump. So I'm throwing out a few other names, especially since NYC has been the hotspot in the country.

[Cataholic]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

[iaafan]

Just FYI, NYC mayor told people that there was no reason to stop using public transportation, in early February. And the gal whose name escapes me now, the NYC public health official, told people to continue riding the subways and using public transportation, in February.

Who is more responsible for the massive outbreak in NYC - Trump, or these local officials? Even Pelosi was in San Fran in February encouraging people to "come down to chinatown, have dinner, its what we're doing"
Not to defend Trump, but it would make alot more sense for people to spread the blame around where its due, rather than just dump it all on Trump.

Yes, absolutely the NYC mayor should be blamed for what's happening in NYC if what he said caused people to get infected and die as should Pelosi and I'd love to have term limits to get rid of people that are in office too long like Pelosi. However, it looks like the SF mayor over road her bad advice as SF is one of the shining examples of how to handle the virus.

There's no "IF" about it. This is NYC Mayor DeBlasio on March 10:
“We want to encourage” New Yorkers going out, the mayor said during a Feb. 10 MSNBC broadcast.
“If you’re under 50 & you’re healthy, which is most NYers, there’s very little threat here. This disease, even if you were to get it, basically acts like a common cold or flu. And transmission is not that easy,” de Blasio said at the time.

Agreed on term limits.

Yep, he should be catching hell for that. So should anyone that made similar comments. So if DeBlasio is most at fault for NYC as the mayor, who's the most at fault for the USA?

I didn't say either was MORE responsible, there's plenty of blame to go around. But the only person I've seen catching hell in this thread is Trump. So I'm throwing out a few other names, especially since NYC has been the hotspot in the country.

Fear not, there's a world outside this thread and in it even liberal publications like The Atlantic are bashing DeBlasio.

[ilovethecats]

That was the kind of response I was expecting the first time.

And you've played all this out before coming to your decision:

you'd run your school buses on days when the roads were deemed unsafe to drive because you feel that the students reward of education on those days outweighs the risk of driving them to school and your primary obligation to them is there schooling. You must then think school bus operators are wrong to shut down on these days. And if they did have accidents and students were killed and injured in those accidents, that you'd continue to support your decision to have the school buses running despite the conditions. It's then safe to assume that you'd be okay, since you own the bus company, with delivering the news to the parents of the deceased that it was your decision to run the buses and that you'll continue to do so since the death of that child is worth the additional education that the student received on those days that they would've missed.

Yes, in the scenario you lined up, I would be fine with all of those stipulations. Every hundred thousand trips or so if there was an accident that resulted in a death I would perform the hard task of telling the family. I would perform my duty of telling them as I'm sure every other business owner would be forced to do with the many more deaths their companies were responsible for.

However, who would be responsible for dealing with the many other unavoidable consequences that these families unable to work or go to school would endure. I saw in some states suicide rates have doubled. In addition to domestic abuse, people going without food, losing homes and jobs? I assume there would be a task force or something to handle these situations as well as deaths resulting from people being able to make a living?

If there was such a task force, fine with dealing with these consequences and deaths, I'd do my part as well. I assume that we'd all treat all of the deaths with the respect they deserve, and not pretend the deaths of those riding the bus were any more important than other deaths!

I think we're on the same page!

[iaafan]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

That's what NYC mayor and democrat Bill De Blasio thinks, too.

[AFCAT]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

Do you believe the death rate from the flu would be much higher if we didn't have vaccines and other protections from it?

[iaafan]

That was the kind of response I was expecting the first time.

And you've played all this out before coming to your decision:

you'd run your school buses on days when the roads were deemed unsafe to drive because you feel that the students reward of education on those days outweighs the risk of driving them to school and your primary obligation to them is there schooling. You must then think school bus operators are wrong to shut down on these days. And if they did have accidents and students were killed and injured in those accidents, that you'd continue to support your decision to have the school buses running despite the conditions. It's then safe to assume that you'd be okay, since you own the bus company, with delivering the news to the parents of the deceased that it was your decision to run the buses and that you'll continue to do so since the death of that child is worth the additional education that the student received on those days that they would've missed.

Yes, in the scenario you lined up, I would be fine with all of those stipulations. Every hundred thousand trips or so if there was an accident that resulted in a death I would perform the hard task of telling the family. I would perform my duty of telling them as I'm sure every other business owner would be forced to do with the many more deaths their companies were responsible for.

However, who would be responsible for dealing with the many other unavoidable consequences that these families unable to work or go to school would endure. I saw in some states suicide rates have doubled. In addition to domestic abuse, people going without food, losing homes and jobs? I assume there would be a task force or something to handle these situations as well as deaths resulting from people being able to make a living?

If there was such a task force, fine with dealing with these consequences and deaths, I'd do my part as well. I assume that we'd all treat all of the deaths with the respect they deserve, and not pretend the deaths of those riding the bus were any more important than other deaths!

I think we're on the same page!

Not on the same page

A tornado just swept through SE USA yesterday through a population of about 25 million people and killed only 19. That's less than one per million. Despite the weather service warning, based on your logic, there's no need to tell anyone to seek shelter, because it isn't very likely that they would be killed or injured and the amount of time they wasted taking shelter isn't worth the time and productivity.

Then there's wars. A very small percentage of people that go off to fight wars for the USA recently, even ones that are entered into on false rationale, die or are injured. So there's another decision, based on your logic, to make that doesn't involve the risk of life, since it's so small. The main issue is the hit to the economy.

[iaafan]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

Do you believe the death rate from the flu would be much higher if we didn't have vaccines and other protections from it?

This is the switch point for me. We've worked through how we're going to deal with the flu, pneumonia, cancer, HIV, etc. We haven't worked through how we're going to deal with coronavirus yet. Each of these things is its own separate issue. Once we do, it'll slide into the same school of thought as all those other things.

[AFCAT]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

Do you believe the death rate from the flu would be much higher if we didn't have vaccines and other protections from it?

This is the switch point for me. We've worked through how we're going to deal with the flu, pneumonia, cancer, HIV, etc. We haven't worked through how we're going to deal with coronavirus yet. Each of these things is its own separate issue. Once we do, it'll slide into the same school of thought as all those other things.

Bingo!

[seataccat]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

A typical flu season kills ~20,000 – 60,000 people in the U.S. out of 39-56 million infections per year. That is a 12 month season. Currently SARS-COV2 has killed 17,108 in ~ 6 weeks and infected 577,408. That is orders of magnitude worse than the seasonal flu, like 40 times worse. Now of course the death toll will probably not be the 7% that the total numbers are showing now. However this is a virus that nobody has ever seen and most epidemiologists are predicting 1%-2+% death rate. If you extrapolate that to the 39-56 million people that typically get the flu in a calendar year in the U.S. that is a freakin' scary number. You may be right that this will be just another seasonal flu that will blow over when the weather gets warm, but you are probably wrong. Pandemics do not behave the same way seasonal outbreaks do. For the National Academies’ report, researchers looked at the history of flu pandemics as an example. “There have been 10 influenza pandemics in the past 250-plus years — two started in the Northern Hemisphere winter, three in the spring, two in the summer and three in the fall,” the report said. “All had a peak second wave approximately six months after emergence of the virus in the human population, regardless of when the initial introduction occurred.”

[iaafan]

Boy, do I feel better now!

[91catAlum]

Just FYI, NYC mayor told people that there was no reason to stop using public transportation, in early February. And the gal whose name escapes me now, the NYC public health official, told people to continue riding the subways and using public transportation, in February.

Who is more responsible for the massive outbreak in NYC - Trump, or these local officials? Even Pelosi was in San Fran in February encouraging people to "come down to chinatown, have dinner, its what we're doing"
Not to defend Trump, but it would make alot more sense for people to spread the blame around where its due, rather than just dump it all on Trump.

Yes, absolutely the NYC mayor should be blamed for what's happening in NYC if what he said caused people to get infected and die as should Pelosi and I'd love to have term limits to get rid of people that are in office too long like Pelosi. However, it looks like the SF mayor over road her bad advice as SF is one of the shining examples of how to handle the virus.

There's no "IF" about it. This is NYC Mayor DeBlasio on March 10:
“We want to encourage” New Yorkers going out, the mayor said during a Feb. 10 MSNBC broadcast.
“If you’re under 50 & you’re healthy, which is most NYers, there’s very little threat here. This disease, even if you were to get it, basically acts like a common cold or flu. And transmission is not that easy,” de Blasio said at the time.

Agreed on term limits.

Yep, he should be catching hell for that. So should anyone that made similar comments. So if DeBlasio is most at fault for NYC as the mayor, who's the most at fault for the USA?

I didn't say either was MORE responsible, there's plenty of blame to go around. But the only person I've seen catching hell in this thread is Trump. So I'm throwing out a few other names, especially since NYC has been the hotspot in the country.

Fear not, there's a world outside this thread and in it even liberal publications like The Atlantic are bashing DeBlasio.

Good to know, thanks. I'll have to take your word for that... So far, in all the mainstream TV news programs I watch, I haven't heard one single "reporter" call out ANY democrat as having any part of the blame in this, outside of Fox News of course.
Not. One.

[Cataholic]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

Do you believe the death rate from the flu would be much higher if we didn't have vaccines and other protections from it?

Absolutely. And I mentioned above that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed. However, the economic impact to our country cannot be discounted. Small and large business will fail making vast numbers of people unemployed. Nest eggs of senior citizens are already down 20%. Banks will see foreclosures and loan defaults will threaten their viability.

Here are two simple questions: How many people do you know that have coronavirus? How many people do you know that are now unemployed or their business is at risk?

I don’t intend to discount the severity of this disease, but having huge sections of our population jobless, and senior citizens losing their investment portfolio, will create problems that must be taken into account.

[AFCAT]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

Do you believe the death rate from the flu would be much higher if we didn't have vaccines and other protections from it?

Absolutely. And I mentioned above that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed. However, the economic impact to our country cannot be discounted. Small and large business will fail making vast numbers of people unemployed. Nest eggs of senior citizens are already down 20%. Banks will see foreclosures and loan defaults will threaten their viability.

Here are two simple questions: How many people do you know that have coronavirus? How many people do you know that are now unemployed or their business is at risk?

I don’t intend to discount the severity of this disease, but having huge sections of our population jobless, and senior citizens losing their investment portfolio, will create problems that must be taken into account.

Nobody is discounting the economic issues or loss of wealth. Heck, I've lost plenty of money already and I don't want to lose more, but I'm not willing to sacrifice my life or my loved ones lives for the economy. The key is how do we mitigate loss of life from this virus and possibly overwhelming of our hospitals with getting the economy back up and running. I don't have that key, but we are doing what we can now with social distancing and when the true experts (not Jared and Ivanka) come up with a solution to the big problem, then I'm sure we will be fine. It will take time, for sure.

[Cataholic]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

A typical flu season kills ~20,000 – 60,000 people in the U.S. out of 39-56 million infections per year. That is a 12 month season. Currently SARS-COV2 has killed 17,108 in ~ 6 weeks and infected 577,408. That is orders of magnitude worse than the seasonal flu, like 40 times worse. Now of course the death toll will probably not be the 7% that the total numbers are showing now. However this is a virus that nobody has ever seen and most epidemiologists are predicting 1%-2+% death rate. If you extrapolate that to the 39-56 million people that typically get the flu in a calendar year in the U.S. that is a freakin' scary number. You may be right that this will be just another seasonal flu that will blow over when the weather gets warm, but you are probably wrong. Pandemics do not behave the same way seasonal outbreaks do. For the National Academies’ report, researchers looked at the history of flu pandemics as an example. “There have been 10 influenza pandemics in the past 250-plus years — two started in the Northern Hemisphere winter, three in the spring, two in the summer and three in the fall,” the report said. “All had a peak second wave approximately six months after emergence of the virus in the human population, regardless of when the initial introduction occurred.”

I agree with your numbers. I have stated that Covid19 is much more contagious. I have stated the tremendous importance of a treatment and vaccine. Social distancing is very important.

However, can you tell me that opening up Walmart is less dangerous than allowing a shopper to enter a Universal Athletic store? Did you know that Bob Wards is considered an essential business and open, while Universal Athletic cannot open? Would letting small businesses like UAS operate with some social distancing and cleaning guidelines be so bad? Is that worse than what we are doing right now?

Maybe there should be more accountability by each individual. I was in Walmart yesterday picking up some groceries. I noticed a couple shopping with a 2 or 3 month old infant. Couldn’t one of the parents stay home with that infant while the other shopped? It makes no sense.

[Rich K]

Exactly how many people are saved by the social distancing may not be determinable. But the mythical number of "jobs saved" during Odumbo's economic fiasco didn't stop people from citing it. Therefore, because of President Trump's policies, nearly 50 million American lives have been saved. He's a great President.

[Cataholic]

We had around 2,400 deaths at Pearl Harbor and nearly 3,000 on 9-11. Last Friday, the US lost 2,057 people to Covid-19 in a single day.

Ok, that's fine. But in fairness, and I want to be VERY clear I'm not downplaying the Corona. But why are these numbers any more shocking and more important than the numbers we see every day of every year for other things? Why is 2,057 Codid deaths worse or on par with what we saw on 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? But the thousands that die every single day of cancer, heart disease, accidents etc. just ho-hum par for the course? This is what I'm always failing to grasp. What makes the tiny percentage of Covid deaths we see way more important and way less worrisome than the deaths we see every day from something else? Even though the something else kills far more?

Ilovethecats is 100% correct. According to the CDC, the flu killed an estimated 60,000+ in 2018. We don’t shut down the nation in a bad flu season. I do believe that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed because this spreads so easily, but people should be allowed to make a living.

Do you believe the death rate from the flu would be much higher if we didn't have vaccines and other protections from it?

Absolutely. And I mentioned above that social distancing is critical until a cure or vaccine is developed. However, the economic impact to our country cannot be discounted. Small and large business will fail making vast numbers of people unemployed. Nest eggs of senior citizens are already down 20%. Banks will see foreclosures and loan defaults will threaten their viability.

Here are two simple questions: How many people do you know that have coronavirus? How many people do you know that are now unemployed or their business is at risk?

I don’t intend to discount the severity of this disease, but having huge sections of our population jobless, and senior citizens losing their investment portfolio, will create problems that must be taken into account.

Nobody is discounting the economic issues or loss of wealth. Heck, I've lost plenty of money already and I don't want to lose more, but I'm not willing to sacrifice my life or my loved ones lives for the economy. The key is how do we mitigate loss of life from this virus and possibly overwhelming of our hospitals with getting the economy back up and running. I don't have that key, but we are doing what we can now with social distancing and when the true experts come up with a solution to the big problem, then I'm sure we will be fine. It will take time, for sure.

Did you go to the store this week for groceries? Did you place your life or someone else’s life at risk by doing so? I had to get groceries. But I did not travel for work or I did not see my elderly parents over Easter. We are all doing our part. Can’t we do certain things safely without “sacrificing your life or a loved ones” as you stated above? Can’t others business operate at the same safety level of a Costco?

I don’t want to understate that the most important issue is developing a cure. However, depression level unemployment will destroy many many lives as well.

[ibleedblue]

Interesting conversation for sure.

I saw someone mention that the common flu is year-round, that is absolutely incorrect. The common flu is seasonal from about October typically through April. Many have compared COVID-19 to the flu saying it’s far far worse but right now we are really looking at mortality rates that will be well under 1%. Many infectious disease experts will tell you that a bad flu season will get close to that same number. The CDC reports mortality rate with flu much less at at about .01, but they also admit the number of cases of flu and the number of deaths is way, way under reported. That’s why you have far swinging estimates of flu death from anywhere from 30,000 up to 80,000 in a given year. They are just that, they are estimates because of how flu gets reported.

I also saw someone pointing to flu vaccine being critical. Unfortunately the uptake in the US on the vaccine is less than 50%. And they are always basically trying to guess what strain will come out so the flu vaccine is often only about 60% effective on a good year and sometimes only 20 to 30% effective on a bad one. I don’t think anyone should point to the fact that there’s a flu vaccine being an advantage in terms of comparison to coronavirus.

[technoCat]

Interesting conversation for sure.

I saw someone mention that the common flu is year-round, that is absolutely incorrect. The common flu is seasonal from about October typically through April. Many have compared COVID-19 to the flu saying it’s far far worse but right now we are really looking at mortality rates that will be well under 1%. Many infectious disease experts will tell you that a bad flu season will get close to that same number. The CDC reports mortality rate with flu much less at at about .01, but they also admit the number of cases of flu and the number of deaths is way, way under reported. That’s why you have far swinging estimates of flu death from anywhere from 30,000 up to 80,000 in a given year. They are just that, they are estimates because of how flu gets reported.

I also saw someone pointing to flu vaccine being critical. Unfortunately the uptake in the US on the vaccine is less than 50%. And they are always basically trying to guess what strain will come out so the flu vaccine is often only about 60% effective on a good year and sometimes only 20 to 30% effective on a bad one. I don’t think anyone should point to the fact that there’s a flu vaccine being an advantage in terms of comparison to coronavirus.

These are my thoughts as well. I would guess 90% of the people I know between the ages of 20 and 35 never got a flu shot. We also don't know the number of people in any given year that get a mild flu and its never reported. I don't remember ever getting the flu in my life and know I've never been to the doctor for it. Does that mean I've never got it or just never got it bad enough to report?...