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Re: #41

Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 1:51 pm
by iaafan
Yup, everyone’s entitled to an opinion. That should always be made clear.

I just see Andersen as an “over the top” player. Lulay, Ioane and McGhee were all very good, but Andersen is just special. His raw athleticism, his versatility, his power, his accolades, pain tolerance and the numerous spectacular plays he’s made put him on that same level with Kollar, Stenerud, Haas and Holland. He’s a guy that if he’s from a larger town never ends up at MSU. The coaches conceded that his freshman year before he ever played in a game.

If he plays at MSU four games this season and then a full season in 2021, I can’t see how anyone would be able to think that Lulay, Ioane or McGhee are in his league. Andersen was a legend going into last season.

I think if you asked Sonny Holland he’d just laugh at you for asking. Same for the Jan, Don and Bill.

But that’s just my opinion. :)

Re: #41

Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:47 pm
by grizzh8r
iaafan wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 1:51 pm
Yup, everyone’s entitled to an opinion. That should always be made clear.

I just see Andersen as an “over the top” player. Lulay, Ioane and McGhee were all very good, but Andersen is just special. His raw athleticism, his versatility, his power, his accolades, pain tolerance and the numerous spectacular plays he’s made put him on that same level with Kollar, Stenerud, Haas and Holland. He’s a guy that if he’s from a larger town never ends up at MSU. The coaches conceded that his freshman year before he ever played in a game.

If he plays at MSU four games this season and then a full season in 2021, I can’t see how anyone would be able to think that Lulay, Ioane or McGhee are in his league. Andersen was a legend going into last season.

I think if you asked Sonny Holland he’d just laugh at you for asking. Same for the Jan, Don and Bill.

But that’s just my opinion. :)
I believe the word is "transcendent". I'm in my mid 30's and if I ever see another player suit up for the Cats as versatile and talented as Troy, I'll be very surprised and doubly blessed! If there's ever been a Bobcat that could be compared to the late, great Jim Thorpe, Troy is my vote. Some of you Golden Bobcats out there that have watched the Cats for a decade or two longer than I've been alive... What are your thoughts on this subject? I realize the game has changed quite a bit since the days of single crossbar facemasks, but has there been any player suit up for MSU that has accomplished as much and excelled at as many different positions as TA has in just 3 years? Genuinely want to know, I like history lessons.

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:58 am
by TomCat88
grizzh8r wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:47 pm
iaafan wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 1:51 pm
Yup, everyone’s entitled to an opinion. That should always be made clear.

I just see Andersen as an “over the top” player. Lulay, Ioane and McGhee were all very good, but Andersen is just special. His raw athleticism, his versatility, his power, his accolades, pain tolerance and the numerous spectacular plays he’s made put him on that same level with Kollar, Stenerud, Haas and Holland. He’s a guy that if he’s from a larger town never ends up at MSU. The coaches conceded that his freshman year before he ever played in a game.

If he plays at MSU four games this season and then a full season in 2021, I can’t see how anyone would be able to think that Lulay, Ioane or McGhee are in his league. Andersen was a legend going into last season.

I think if you asked Sonny Holland he’d just laugh at you for asking. Same for the Jan, Don and Bill.

But that’s just my opinion. :)
I believe the word is "transcendent". I'm in my mid 30's and if I ever see another player suit up for the Cats as versatile and talented as Troy, I'll be very surprised and doubly blessed! If there's ever been a Bobcat that could be compared to the late, great Jim Thorpe, Troy is my vote. Some of you Golden Bobcats out there that have watched the Cats for a decade or two longer than I've been alive... What are your thoughts on this subject? I realize the game has changed quite a bit since the days of single crossbar facemasks, but has there been any player suit up for MSU that has accomplished as much and excelled at as many different positions as TA has in just 3 years? Genuinely want to know, I like history lessons.
Transcendent is the word. I’ve been following MSU since the 70s. Lots of great players, but no one like Troy Andersen. That said, Bill Kollar is the best I’ve seen in a Bobcat uniform and he played his position better than Troy has played any of his positions, but he played defensive tackle. He didn’t really get much attention until his junior year and really didn’t explode onto the scene until the Senior Bowl and then made huge news being a first round pick. Troy is clearly the best all-around player I’ve seen and made news his first practice. McGhee is the only other player I’ve seen who you knew from day one was gonna be a special player, but not as certain as Andersen. Never saw Hass or Holland play.

Andersen just has that Michael Jordan, or more locally, Dave Dickinson quality. He captures the imagination. You go into the game wondering about what he might do almost as much as you wonder about how the team will do.

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:54 am
by HelenaCat
TomCat88 wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:58 am
grizzh8r wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:47 pm
iaafan wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 1:51 pm
Yup, everyone’s entitled to an opinion. That should always be made clear.

I just see Andersen as an “over the top” player. Lulay, Ioane and McGhee were all very good, but Andersen is just special. His raw athleticism, his versatility, his power, his accolades, pain tolerance and the numerous spectacular plays he’s made put him on that same level with Kollar, Stenerud, Haas and Holland. He’s a guy that if he’s from a larger town never ends up at MSU. The coaches conceded that his freshman year before he ever played in a game.

If he plays at MSU four games this season and then a full season in 2021, I can’t see how anyone would be able to think that Lulay, Ioane or McGhee are in his league. Andersen was a legend going into last season.

I think if you asked Sonny Holland he’d just laugh at you for asking. Same for the Jan, Don and Bill.

But that’s just my opinion. :)
I believe the word is "transcendent". I'm in my mid 30's and if I ever see another player suit up for the Cats as versatile and talented as Troy, I'll be very surprised and doubly blessed! If there's ever been a Bobcat that could be compared to the late, great Jim Thorpe, Troy is my vote. Some of you Golden Bobcats out there that have watched the Cats for a decade or two longer than I've been alive... What are your thoughts on this subject? I realize the game has changed quite a bit since the days of single crossbar facemasks, but has there been any player suit up for MSU that has accomplished as much and excelled at as many different positions as TA has in just 3 years? Genuinely want to know, I like history lessons.
Transcendent is the word. I’ve been following MSU since the 70s. Lots of great players, but no one like Troy Andersen. That said, Bill Kollar is the best I’ve seen in a Bobcat uniform and he played his position better than Troy has played any of his positions, but he played defensive tackle. He didn’t really get much attention until his junior year and really didn’t explode onto the scene until the Senior Bowl and then made huge news being a first round pick. Troy is clearly the best all-around player I’ve seen and made news his first practice. McGhee is the only other player I’ve seen who you knew from day one was gonna be a special player, but not as certain as Andersen. Never saw Hass or Holland play.

Andersen just has that Michael Jordan, or more locally, Dave Dickinson quality. He captures the imagination. You go into the game wondering about what he might do almost as much as you wonder about how the team will do.
Great summary Tom. I have been watching the Cats since the 60s, but was just a kid then. Don Hass was a great player, but not transcendent like Troy. I loved Travis Lulay because he was just a winner and leader. But again, not as special overall as Troy.

I still remember the first practice/scrimmage I made when Troy was freshman. He took a handoff and went around right end down the sideline. Both me and the guy next to me, who I did not know, turned to each other and we both said “Holy Sh**” at the same time. I certainly have never had that reaction over any other player at MSU.

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:18 am
by blueandgoldblitz
I'm obviously not going to speak for MSU here but in an interview with the CEO of the 49ers, he said that a lot of people are going away from retiring numbers because some teams are getting somewhat limited in what numbers current players can use. A lot of teams are going more towards a ring of honor rather than retiring a jersey number (think Bobcat Hall of Fame). I know the Bobcats have a lot fewer retired numbers than a lot of other teams, but they also have a lot more players fighting over those numbers than pro teams. Retired numbers seem to be becoming a thing of the past. This could be the current thinking of the higher ups at MSU...that there will never be any more numbers retired unless exceptional circumstances. Like a former bobcat doing phenomenal things in the NFL as well as at MSU. That's just my opinion. Take it for what it is.

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:49 am
by coloradocat
I definitely think the threshold for retiring a number should be very high but it should still be an available honor. It's a level higher than the Bobcat HoF and reserved for a once in a generation (or more) player. If Troy has another All-Conference / All-America / Cat-griz win season and climbs into the top 2-3 in the rushing/scoring records and gets drafted I think he could meet the threshold.

There have been a handful of really good players in the last 20 years that deserve to be in the Bobcat HoF but Troy is another level. When was the last time you got this excited when you saw that a particular player was on the field? Is he gonna score a 50 yard TD on this play? Is he gonna get a sack on this play?

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:27 pm
by mslacatfan
I can only go back to 2000 (when I started following the cats).

Since then, most would agree that the 4 best players we have seen come through the program, and on the potential list for retiring a number would be Ioane, Lulay, McGhee and now Troy.

How bout this- if u were able to create/start a college team, and had the option to “draft” one of those players, who would it be?

That would probably answer the question of who most deserves their number retired.

Hard to say who I would “draft” out of those 4 to start a team......... but my order would probably go Troy, McGhee, lulay, Ioane....

Troy is just too versatile, and he simply dominates any position u play him at. (Including qb)

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:42 pm
by catsrback76
HelenaCat wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:54 am
TomCat88 wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:58 am
grizzh8r wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:47 pm
iaafan wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 1:51 pm
Yup, everyone’s entitled to an opinion. That should always be made clear.

I just see Andersen as an “over the top” player. Lulay, Ioane and McGhee were all very good, but Andersen is just special. His raw athleticism, his versatility, his power, his accolades, pain tolerance and the numerous spectacular plays he’s made put him on that same level with Kollar, Stenerud, Haas and Holland. He’s a guy that if he’s from a larger town never ends up at MSU. The coaches conceded that his freshman year before he ever played in a game.

If he plays at MSU four games this season and then a full season in 2021, I can’t see how anyone would be able to think that Lulay, Ioane or McGhee are in his league. Andersen was a legend going into last season.

I think if you asked Sonny Holland he’d just laugh at you for asking. Same for the Jan, Don and Bill.

But that’s just my opinion. :)
I believe the word is "transcendent". I'm in my mid 30's and if I ever see another player suit up for the Cats as versatile and talented as Troy, I'll be very surprised and doubly blessed! If there's ever been a Bobcat that could be compared to the late, great Jim Thorpe, Troy is my vote. Some of you Golden Bobcats out there that have watched the Cats for a decade or two longer than I've been alive... What are your thoughts on this subject? I realize the game has changed quite a bit since the days of single crossbar facemasks, but has there been any player suit up for MSU that has accomplished as much and excelled at as many different positions as TA has in just 3 years? Genuinely want to know, I like history lessons.
Transcendent is the word. I’ve been following MSU since the 70s. Lots of great players, but no one like Troy Andersen. That said, Bill Kollar is the best I’ve seen in a Bobcat uniform and he played his position better than Troy has played any of his positions, but he played defensive tackle. He didn’t really get much attention until his junior year and really didn’t explode onto the scene until the Senior Bowl and then made huge news being a first round pick. Troy is clearly the best all-around player I’ve seen and made news his first practice. McGhee is the only other player I’ve seen who you knew from day one was gonna be a special player, but not as certain as Andersen. Never saw Hass or Holland play.

Andersen just has that Michael Jordan, or more locally, Dave Dickinson quality. He captures the imagination. You go into the game wondering about what he might do almost as much as you wonder about how the team will do.
Great summary Tom. I have been watching the Cats since the 60s, but was just a kid then. Don Hass was a great player, but not transcendent like Troy. I loved Travis Lulay because he was just a winner and leader. But again, not as special overall as Troy.

I still remember the first practice/scrimmage I made when Troy was freshman. He took a handoff and went around right end down the sideline. Both me and the guy next to me, who I did not know, turned to each other and we both said “Holy Sh**” at the same time. I certainly have never had that reaction over any other player at MSU.
I'm with Tom on Troy down through the years. I too began watching and attending games back in the 70's and though I would say McGhee and Lulay, and Bradley were all better QB's than Troy, and there are a list of talented LB's who through the years would be better than Troy, and many pure RB's also better than Troy... there is NO ONE, as a package of talent, heart, and ability that I've seen that is better than Troy in a Bobcat uniform.

On any given play, he can throw a TD, break a run for 75 yards for a TD, bring back a team from 22 down in a half to win a game, sack a QB, or run down a play from behind...BETTER than Troy Andersen! Simply put, he is the whole package, in a body with a heart to compete and win every single down better than Troy! IMO!

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 2:54 pm
by catatac
catsrback76 wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:42 pm
HelenaCat wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:54 am
TomCat88 wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:58 am
grizzh8r wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:47 pm
iaafan wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 1:51 pm
Yup, everyone’s entitled to an opinion. That should always be made clear.

I just see Andersen as an “over the top” player. Lulay, Ioane and McGhee were all very good, but Andersen is just special. His raw athleticism, his versatility, his power, his accolades, pain tolerance and the numerous spectacular plays he’s made put him on that same level with Kollar, Stenerud, Haas and Holland. He’s a guy that if he’s from a larger town never ends up at MSU. The coaches conceded that his freshman year before he ever played in a game.

If he plays at MSU four games this season and then a full season in 2021, I can’t see how anyone would be able to think that Lulay, Ioane or McGhee are in his league. Andersen was a legend going into last season.

I think if you asked Sonny Holland he’d just laugh at you for asking. Same for the Jan, Don and Bill.

But that’s just my opinion. :)
I believe the word is "transcendent". I'm in my mid 30's and if I ever see another player suit up for the Cats as versatile and talented as Troy, I'll be very surprised and doubly blessed! If there's ever been a Bobcat that could be compared to the late, great Jim Thorpe, Troy is my vote. Some of you Golden Bobcats out there that have watched the Cats for a decade or two longer than I've been alive... What are your thoughts on this subject? I realize the game has changed quite a bit since the days of single crossbar facemasks, but has there been any player suit up for MSU that has accomplished as much and excelled at as many different positions as TA has in just 3 years? Genuinely want to know, I like history lessons.
Transcendent is the word. I’ve been following MSU since the 70s. Lots of great players, but no one like Troy Andersen. That said, Bill Kollar is the best I’ve seen in a Bobcat uniform and he played his position better than Troy has played any of his positions, but he played defensive tackle. He didn’t really get much attention until his junior year and really didn’t explode onto the scene until the Senior Bowl and then made huge news being a first round pick. Troy is clearly the best all-around player I’ve seen and made news his first practice. McGhee is the only other player I’ve seen who you knew from day one was gonna be a special player, but not as certain as Andersen. Never saw Hass or Holland play.

Andersen just has that Michael Jordan, or more locally, Dave Dickinson quality. He captures the imagination. You go into the game wondering about what he might do almost as much as you wonder about how the team will do.
Great summary Tom. I have been watching the Cats since the 60s, but was just a kid then. Don Hass was a great player, but not transcendent like Troy. I loved Travis Lulay because he was just a winner and leader. But again, not as special overall as Troy.

I still remember the first practice/scrimmage I made when Troy was freshman. He took a handoff and went around right end down the sideline. Both me and the guy next to me, who I did not know, turned to each other and we both said “Holy Sh**” at the same time. I certainly have never had that reaction over any other player at MSU.
I'm with Tom on Troy down through the years. I too began watching and attending games back in the 70's and though I would say McGhee and Lulay, and Bradley were all better QB's than Troy, and there are a list of talented LB's who through the years would be better than Troy, and many pure RB's also better than Troy... there is NO ONE, as a package of talent, heart, and ability that I've seen that is better than Troy in a Bobcat uniform.

On any given play, he can throw a TD, break a run for 75 yards for a TD, bring back a team from 22 down in a half to win a game, sack a QB, or run down a play from behind...BETTER than Troy Andersen! Simply put, he is the whole package, in a body with a heart to compete and win every single down better than Troy! IMO!
I agree, and one thing we haven't seen yet (hope to) is what happens with he gets an INT, talk about a linebacker that would have a decent chance of taking an INT or fumble recovery to the house!

Re: #41

Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 3:03 pm
by Helcat72
They were thinking about retiring Ryan Johnson's number, but decided to retire his jersey instead.

I think his jersey would fit Askelson, but why would he want it...I would want a brand new one! Lol

Re: #41

Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:12 am
by blueandgoldblitz
mslacatfan wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:27 pm
I can only go back to 2000 (when I started following the cats).

Since then, most would agree that the 4 best players we have seen come through the program, and on the potential list for retiring a number would be Ioane, Lulay, McGhee and now Troy.

How bout this- if u were able to create/start a college team, and had the option to “draft” one of those players, who would it be?

That would probably answer the question of who most deserves their number retired.

Hard to say who I would “draft” out of those 4 to start a team......... but my order would probably go Troy, McGhee, lulay, Ioane....

Troy is just too versatile, and he simply dominates any position u play him at. (Including qb)
I love Troy. He's a great player and I love watching him play. That being said, in this era of passing stats and the offense having a leg up on the defense, I'd take McGhee. QB is the most important position on the field and McGhee is the best QB we've had in the last 40 years. That's just my opinion. Feel free to beat me to a pulp :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :lol:

Re: #41

Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:39 am
by grizzh8r
blueandgoldblitz wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:12 am
mslacatfan wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:27 pm
I can only go back to 2000 (when I started following the cats).

Since then, most would agree that the 4 best players we have seen come through the program, and on the potential list for retiring a number would be Ioane, Lulay, McGhee and now Troy.

How bout this- if u were able to create/start a college team, and had the option to “draft” one of those players, who would it be?

That would probably answer the question of who most deserves their number retired.

Hard to say who I would “draft” out of those 4 to start a team......... but my order would probably go Troy, McGhee, lulay, Ioane....

Troy is just too versatile, and he simply dominates any position u play him at. (Including qb)
I love Troy. He's a great player and I love watching him play. That being said, in this era of passing stats and the offense having a leg up on the defense, I'd take McGhee. QB is the most important position on the field and McGhee is the best QB we've had in the last 40 years. That's just my opinion. Feel free to beat me to a pulp :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :lol:
Agreed, DM was the best QB I've ever seen play for the Cats. This coming from a guy that was in the same freshman class as Lulay and enjoyed the heck out of his 4 seasons at MSU!

Also, thanks to you more seasoned Bobcat fans for the responses, been a really good discussion.