Time to think about the Dakotas

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theblackgecko
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Post by theblackgecko » Sun Jul 25, 2004 3:40 pm

Back to expansion:
WYOBISONMAN wrote:UND is totally driven by hockey and the hockey interests want the other sports to stay D2. If UND were to make the move it will be a ways into the future, not in the near term.
I was reading about the frozen four when I read an atricle that the DII/DIII schools (UND, Colorado College) were shut out from the frozen four money due to their lower division status. While the NCAA lets schools play DI hockey, it does not give them the respect they deserve. While they get money for travel expenses, they don't get to split the television revenue.
I wonder if UND won't go DI for exactly that reason, additional money for hockey.



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89rabbit
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Post by 89rabbit » Mon Jul 26, 2004 8:17 am

Moving past D-I Hockey and how the lower Division schools are payed. . . what did everyone think about President Gambles statements?


89rabbit wrote:More news from the Big Sky. Here are excerpts from Chris Solari's story from today's Sioux Falls Argus Leader:

http://www.argusleader.com/sports/Satur ... cle2.shtml

Door to Big Sky still open for Jacks
Chris Solari
Argus Leader

published: 7/24/2004

School presidents to discuss expansion at Aug. 9 meeting

South Dakota State is back in the sights of the Big Sky Conference.

When the league held its preseason football meeting Monday in Flagstaff, Ariz., Big Sky Commissioner Doug Fullerton said the Aug. 9 conference presidents' meeting will focus on expansion, specifically mentioning four schools including SDSU. . . .

Those words are a distinct reverse in course from what the the Big Sky's presidents said in February 2003, the last time they met to talk about expansion. SDSU and North Dakota State jointly approached the Big Sky about membership last year, at which time Montana State President Geoffrey Gamble arranged that meeting.

Afterward, Gamble said, "The door isn't completely closed." But he also admitted that the idea of additional travel into the Dakotas made some of the league's top brass leery, and the leaders told SDSU and NDSU to look elsewhere for conference affiliation in their ascent to Division I.

"From my perspective, the Dakota schools have always been in the packages I've been interested in," Gamble said Friday.

"Part of what I hoped is that my colleagues would get to the point where they wanted to discuss expansion, and that's the point we're at now."

The Aug. 9 meeting is scheduled for 10 a.m. MDT in Salt Lake City. Dusty Clements, assistant commissioner for the Big Sky, said that it should last a few hours.

"It certainly would say that we're on their radar screen," SDSU athletic director Fred Oien said.

That radar didn't pick up SDSU last year for one major reason - geography. At that time, the Big Sky presidents felt the increased travel costs involved with adding the two Dakota schools made them unlikely targets for expansion. The presidents felt then that if expansion happened, it would be to the west.

Travel distance is certainly a topic that Gamble and his comrades will again discuss heavily this time. He said that SDSU President Peggy Miller and her NDSU counterpart Joseph Chapman have been working to allay some of those concerns.

"My perception is that my colleagues are more interested in seriously looking into expansion now than they were eight or nine months ago," Gamble said. . . .

One of the many rumors surrounding the Big Sky was that the conference was targeting former member Idaho for expansion if the Vandals returned to I-AA from I-A. Idaho recently accepted membership into the Western Athletic Conference, a league which plays I-A football.

Another rumor is that the entire league could potentially leave the Division I-AA football ranks for the big-time of I-A. The Big Sky presidents will also likely touch on that in Salt Lake City, Clements said.

"I think that will be discussed because (the presidents) will all be in a room at the same time, and that doesn't happen that often," Clements said.

Gamble said he doesn't expect the Big Sky to ask any schools to join at that time, but he admits that if six of the league's eight presidents vote yes that they could extend a membership offer that day. That is the required number of votes to make such a decision. . . .

The presidents of the Mid-Continent Conference, the other league mentioned as a potential home for SDSU, met earlier this month and said they would continue to look at expansion. . . .


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89rabbit
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Post by 89rabbit » Sun Aug 08, 2004 11:59 pm

Highlights from the Sioux Falls Argus Leader:

http://www.argusleader.com/sports/Mondayarticle1.shtml

SDSU waiting to hear about Big Sky's plans
Chris Solari
Argus Leader

published: 8/9/2004

Conference presidents meet today with expansion on the table and Jackrabbits on their minds

Depending on who you ask, today's meeting of Big Sky Conference presidents could be another instance of ongoing discussions about expansion or the league could be ready to pounce.

"I think this is going to be a meeting in which we are going to focus sharply and narrowly on the issues of either fishing or cutting bait," said George Dennison, the president of the University of Montana. "We'll probably be doing some fishing."

Four fish are on the hook, according to conference commissioner Doug Fullerton: South Dakota State, North Dakota State, Northern Colorado and Southern Utah.

Though SDSU will have no direct input into the meeting, it's the outcome that the Jackrabbits are interested in.

"We do know the presidents are meeting, and hopefully we can get some feedback from them on which way they're going to move in their conference," SDSU Athletic Director Fred Oien said.

Today's meeting is scheduled for 10 a.m. MDT in Salt Lake City.

"Our expansion discussion is an ongoing one," Fullerton said. "The most I would see coming out of this is a request for me to do more due diligence, to find out more about some schools. That would be the best I could see. I don't think we're ready to expand tomorrow."

SDSU and NDSU approached the Big Sky in February 2003 about joining the league, when SDSU was just exploring the idea of moving to Division I. At that time, travel distance was a primary concern of the presidents, and they told the two Dakota schools to continue their conference search elsewhere.

Since then, Idaho - considered one of the Big Sky's prime targets if it happened to drop from Division I-A to I-AA in football - joined the Western Athletic Conference.

One of the main reasons the league is looking at adding members is to retain automatic berths in NCAA tournaments, especially the financially lucrative men's basketball event. Conferences must have seven members to get an automatic bid, and the Big Sky currently has eight.

"We thought it was important, or at least some people thought it was important, to let things settle out (with other conferences) before we went ahead," Dennison said. "It's always been clear we could use one to three more members to hedge against that lower limit to qualify for tournaments, basketball specifically." . . .

Their is still a possibility that the Big Sky could move from I-AA in football to I-A en masse, Fullerton said. He sees that move being the only reason for the Big Sky to think about expanding to 12 teams. At that point, the league could split into two divisions and have a conference title game to earn a top bowl bid. Teams in I-AA earn their spots in a 16-team playoff. . . .

The Big Sky presidents have maintained all along that the academic profile of both SDSU and NDSU fits the league. The added costs of travel to Brookings and Fargo have been major questions, though Fullerton admits that it's neither easy to get to Flagstaff nor inexpensive to fly to Bozeman, Mont.

"The landscape has changed, and that pushed the presidents a bit," Fullerton said. "Some people on the fence may be slipping into another column right now."

Until then, the folks in Brookings continue to do what they have for months - with both the Big Sky and the Mid-Continent Conference.

Said Oien: "We're anxiously awaiting feedback of which way they decide to go."


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WYOBISONMAN
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Post by WYOBISONMAN » Mon Aug 09, 2004 2:49 am

There are a couple of interesting threads on Bisonville discussing this:

http://www.bisonville.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=d1

According to a radio show last week that featured interviews with Fullerton, Jon Kasper of the Missoulian and NDSU AD Gene Taylor it seems most the support for adding the Dakotas is (according to Kasper) coming from Montana, Montana State and Idaho State. Should be interesting to see what comes of the meeting today in Salt Lake City.

And lastly......

A great article in the Billings Gazette by Sports Editor Fritz Neighbor. Very, very, supportive of adding NDSU to the Big Sky.....


http://www.billingsgazette.com/index.ph ... ighbor.inc
Last edited by WYOBISONMAN on Mon Aug 09, 2004 3:19 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Post by velochat » Mon Aug 09, 2004 1:20 pm

Good summary of expansion possibilities:

http://i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=58890



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89rabbit
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Post by 89rabbit » Mon Aug 09, 2004 2:01 pm

I posted this on AGS, but I thought I would point out again that although Brookings, SD is a "college town", SDSU is located less then an hour drive for more then 350,000 South Dakotans.
Last edited by 89rabbit on Mon Aug 09, 2004 2:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Post by velochat » Mon Aug 09, 2004 2:21 pm

One thing that takes more analysis and is more important is air service. For example, on commercial air, I imagine one would have to fly to Minneapolis, Denver, or Salt Lake en route to Fargo or Sioux Falls from Bozeman. UNC would probably have the big edge in the respect that Denver is a lot more accessible. Most Big Sky schools can fly there non-stop. Salt Lake is also veryaccessible.

I don't take any position on who should join the conference, but the time and dollars of travel is a complicated question.



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Post by 89rabbit » Mon Aug 09, 2004 4:06 pm

Can't speak for Fargo, but Sioux Falls is Serviced by United, American, Northwest, Delta, and Allegiant. Sioux Falls is also working very hard to get America West into town. The Airport Admin. seems very optimistic that they will get that deal done before the end of summer. So as it stands right now Sioux Falls has direct flights from Denver, Minneapolis, Las Vegas, Cincinnati, and probably Phoenix

Brookings also has an Airport that has scheduled commuter service, currently it is being provided by United Express out of Minneapolis. However, the US DOT has approved a move that will allow a new airline to fly from Omaha, NE to Brookings. Mesa Airlines has agreements with America West, United, and US Airways (not sure what name will be painted on the tail). That is all the airport info I have that would effect SDSU.

Of course one thing to keep in mind is that UNC has no travel partner. With NDSU and SDSU you fly to Fargo or Sioux Falls/Brookings and then you can bus the short distance to the other for another game (190 miles between NDSU and SDSU). I know it dosen't matter for football but it would for most other sports.
Last edited by 89rabbit on Mon Aug 09, 2004 4:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.


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Post by kmax » Mon Aug 09, 2004 4:45 pm

Looks like nothing big was decided other than to formally go forward with investigating expansion. I hope SDSU and NDSU put togethor a good package and have a good showing in the spring.

Big Sky Presidents Discuss League Expansion


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Post by 89rabbit » Mon Aug 09, 2004 11:45 pm

More news from the BSC Presidents meetings.

http://www.argusleader.com/sports/Tuesdayarticle1.shtml

Big Sky looking at expansion
Chris Solari
Argus Leader

published: 8/10/2004

SDSU will submit official letter of interest

The Big Sky Conference presidents meeting Monday in Salt Lake City gave South Dakota State officials the responses they were looking for.

Yes, the league is strongly considering expansion. And, yes, the Brookings university is a potential target. . . .

"Who knows whether we'll add any schools or three schools. But we established a timeline," Big Sky Commissioner Doug Fullerton said. "We owe it to the schools that are out there, and to the Big Sky for future stability."

The announcement continues the Jackrabbits' search for a new conference affiliation as they move to Division I.

Fullerton made calls late Monday afternoon to schools which had already expressed an interest in joining the conference, including SDSU.

"I don't think there are any surprises," said Fred Oien, SDSU's athletic director. "It's really good stuff. We've always said they're a very good conference. We'd be proud to be a member of that conference, should it all work out."

The next step is for those schools which are interested in membership to submit an official letter of interest to the league. Fullerton expected those to be due by Oct. 1.

The Big Sky's presidents also more clearly defined the criteria upon which prospective schools will be judged. Candidates which have already expressed interest in membership - such as SDSU, North Dakota State, Northern Colorado and Southern Utah - will receive questionnaires on topics such as:

• Academic quality

• Athletic competitiveness

• Commitment to gender equity

• Commitment to student-athlete success

• Geography with regards to travel distance and time away from school for athletes.

"I think we feel good about what we accomplished today," said Eastern Washington President Stephen Jordan.

Prospective members must also support all 13 of the league's core sports. Of the four mentioned suitors, only SDSU offers all 13 of those sports.

Fullerton added that the two components which could carry greater weight are geography and academics.

"They are a little bit of trump cards," he said. "You could be the greatest school in the world. But if you're in Miami, Florida, we wouldn't take you."

Upon the return of letters of interest and questionnaires, the Big Sky presidents are expected to meet again in November. At that time, Fullerton said, officials from interested schools may be asked to attend and make their sales pitch for inclusion.

Campus visits by Big Sky officials will be scheduled for early in 2005 for schools which are still under consideration for an invitation. A final decision on expansion is expected by April 2005.

"We want to move the process along pretty quickly now," said Geoffrey Gamble, Montana State's president. Gamble took part in the discussion via teleconference due to a canceled flight. . . .

Fullerton said having an odd number of schools in the league benefits football scheduling, while an even number is good for basketball.

"If we have an opportunity to get one institution that matches up to the criteria, we'll take one," he said. "If it's none, it's none. If it's three, it's there." . . .


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Post by 89rabbit » Tue Aug 10, 2004 9:54 pm

velochat wrote:One thing that takes more analysis and is more important is air service. For example, on commercial air, I imagine one would have to fly to Minneapolis, Denver, or Salt Lake en route to Fargo or Sioux Falls from Bozeman. UNC would probably have the big edge in the respect that Denver is a lot more accessible. Most Big Sky schools can fly there non-stop. Salt Lake is also veryaccessible.

I don't take any position on who should join the conference, but the time and dollars of travel is a complicated question.
Sioux Falls may still be your best choice more Airlines and more flights. However, this could be good news for teams and fans that want to fly into Brookings. Looks like Mesa is about ready to go. Here are highlights from the Argus story.

http://www.argusleader.com/news/Mondayarticle3.shtml

Airports to offer Omaha flights
Staff and wire reports


published: 8/9/2004

Mesa Air Group will serve Huron, Brookings

Twice-daily flights from Huron and Brookings to Omaha will begin Sept. 1, offering eastern South Dakotans a gateway to fly almost anywhere in the country.

"We're getting calls from all over eastern South Dakota about this," said Huron airport manager Larry Cooper. "Omaha is an extremely popular place to fly out of."

Mesa Air Group is replacing Great Lakes Aviation, which has operated Huron-to-Minneapolis flights for 10 years.

Cooper said increased competition, long connection layovers and the high costs of outbound Minneapolis flights led to the switch.

The switch to Omaha will save passengers $100 to $200 per ticket, he estimated.

Mesa's flights will be timed to meet outbound connections in Omaha, allowing residents to fly out in the morning, conduct business and return the same day. Under the old arrangement, Cooper said, passengers on morning flights from Huron often missed morning departures from Minneapolis. . . .

Phoenix-based Mesa carried more than a million passengers during July . . .


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