Zac Crews…

[gtapp]

Sign the kid. No way this should stop him from playing for us. ESG-Go Cats Go.

You really don't think we lose players to the portal and some recruits if we let him play for the Cats? Maybe we won't but the only way we can find out is to take that risk. And how does the stud QB we just got a commitment from out of OK react?

[PHAT CAT]

Sign the kid. No way this should stop him from playing for us. ESG-Go Cats Go.

You really don't think we lose players to the portal and some recruits if we let him play for the Cats? Maybe we won't but the only way we can find out is to take that risk.

I sure don't. You can say something really stupid and still have a life. I take it, you've never listened to NWA, Snoop Dogg, Ice Cube or Tupac. How many times do you want to hang the kid, Gary? If you don't think he learned for his mistake. Then you're just part of the WOKE crowd, that I hate.

[Catsrgrood]

Sign the kid. No way this should stop him from playing for us. ESG-Go Cats Go.

You really don't think we lose players to the portal and some recruits if we let him play for the Cats? Maybe we won't but the only way we can find out is to take that risk.

I sure don't. You can say something really stupid and still have a life. I take it, you've never listened to NWA, Snoop Dogg, Ice Cube or Tupac. How many times do you want to hang the kid, Gary? If you don't think he learned for his mistake. Then you're just part of the WOKE crowd, that I hate.

I think you’re over-simplifying the whole situation just a bit. Luckily the decision is not yours. I would imagine there would be extensive conversations in the coaching staff, AD and the team itself before anything were to move forward, as it should be.
Everybody deserves a second chance, and I’m not against giving it to him, as long as the team approves it.

[gtapp]

Sign the kid. No way this should stop him from playing for us. ESG-Go Cats Go.

You really don't think we lose players to the portal and some recruits if we let him play for the Cats? Maybe we won't but the only way we can find out is to take that risk.

I sure don't. You can say something really stupid and still have a life. I take it, you've never listened to NWA, Snoop Dogg, Ice Cube or Tupac. How many times do you want to hang the kid, Gary? If you don't think he learned for his mistake. Then you're just part of the WOKE crowd, that I hate.

Man did you miss read my 2 posts. I think he deserves to be playing for whomever he wants to play for including both MT schools. MY point wasn't about that but rather how the team would react. Even if they take a team vote it will never be 100% so what happens then?

[PHAT CAT]

Sign the kid. No way this should stop him from playing for us. ESG-Go Cats Go.

You really don't think we lose players to the portal and some recruits if we let him play for the Cats? Maybe we won't but the only way we can find out is to take that risk.

I sure don't. You can say something really stupid and still have a life. I take it, you've never listened to NWA, Snoop Dogg, Ice Cube or Tupac. How many times do you want to hang the kid, Gary? If you don't think he learned for his mistake. Then you're just part of the WOKE crowd, that I hate.

I think you’re over-simplifying the whole situation just a bit. Luckily the decision is not yours. I would imagine there would be extensive conversations in the coaching staff, AD and the team itself before anything were to move forward, as it should be.
Everybody deserves a second chance, and I’m not against giving it to him, as long as the team approves it.

Yep, you're right. As it should be. I just don't think our team would toss the kid under the bus for being a dumb ass.

[gtapp]

Sign the kid. No way this should stop him from playing for us. ESG-Go Cats Go.

You really don't think we lose players to the portal and some recruits if we let him play for the Cats? Maybe we won't but the only way we can find out is to take that risk.

I sure don't. You can say something really stupid and still have a life. I take it, you've never listened to NWA, Snoop Dogg, Ice Cube or Tupac. How many times do you want to hang the kid, Gary? If you don't think he learned for his mistake. Then you're just part of the WOKE crowd, that I hate.

I think you’re over-simplifying the whole situation just a bit. Luckily the decision is not yours. I would imagine there would be extensive conversations in the coaching staff, AD and the team itself before anything were to move forward, as it should be.
Everybody deserves a second chance, and I’m not against giving it to him, as long as the team approves it.

Yep, you're right. As it should be. I just don't think our team would toss the kid under the bus for being a dumb ass.

The team as a whole probably not. But you can be assured that a percent (your guess is as good as mine) will not forgive him. Then what? Divided locker room? And what about boosters, donors, parents? If the Cats sign the kid (even as a PWO) I will stand up and cheer for him and hope everything turns out great for him but I really believe that not everyone will and you have to weigh that risk.

[coloradocat]

This seems like a slam dunk opportunity for the Cats. I think Vigen and his staff can have the necessary conversations with the team to explain why they think he deserves a chance and why people should be forgiven and have a chance to prove themselves if they are sincere. It can be a learning experience for everyone. The bigger question is if the leadership in the university has enough character to do the same rather than taking the easy way out and blocking him because they are too afraid of what people will say. If he doesn't end up joining the team I would bet it's because of people above Vigen, not below him.

[Helcat72]

He can't be so good that we make a big change in our culture to get him. We have passed on other good players and expect so in the future.

Chasing him would be just to get one up on the Griz, and we don't need to!
Perhaps a culture change is a little too far, but I meant to "steal" one of UM's recruits by extending our hand where nobody else has....

[PHAT CAT]

He can't be so good that we make a big change in our culture to get him. We have passed on other good players and expect so in the future.

Chasing him would be just to get one up on the Griz, and we don't need to!

Good God, that is so silly. I can tell, just how many of you have brothers as friends. And it not many. I'd like one dollar, for every time one of my fellas called me the N word. I'd be making it rain in Vegas right now. Now, I know this is totally different deal. But " Make a big change in our culture." You're the same group that want to cancel Dave Chappelle and Chris Rock. Wow!

[allcat]

Wherever he ends up, the coach has to involve the whole team. If he can't get the team to give him a break then a no go. Maybe offer a grey shirt and let him work out and earn his way back.

[PHAT CAT]

You bet. You have to talk with the squad and other coaches. Then ask them all to give up passwords so all the text they've sent in the past, can be read. How fast do you think, some tunes would change? You ever see a tilt-a-whirl on blast? Zac made a tasteless joke, with one of his friends. I think the kid has paid for it. But please! Anyone on here who's up for Sainthood, tell us now. I'll get Holy Rosary booked for ya. It should be a large crowd.

[Cataholic]

I have been super impressed with the culture started by Choate and then continued by Vigen. Accountability is a cornerstone as is character and family. I was super impressed with the Crews family and how they handled the situation. They exhibit the type of character that makes your organization stronger. I don’t think Crews should get an automatic pass, but we can give him the opportunity to earn a spot as a MEMBER of the team. To start with, there are 3 kids on the team from Missoula. One is from Sentinel. Start with them and what they know of Zach. Other incoming freshman will also know Zach through camps and social media. If enough vouch for him, let him lift and work out with the team in an unofficial capacity (if that is allowed). Make him earn their trust. The team leaders will be able to see if Zach will fit and become a member of the team.

[PHAT CAT]

I have been super impressed with the culture started by Choate and then continued by Vigen. Accountability is a cornerstone as is character and family. I was super impressed with the Crews family and how they handled the situation. They exhibit the type of character that makes your organization stronger. I don’t think Crews should get an automatic pass, but we can give him the opportunity to earn a spot as a MEMBER of the team. To start with, there are 3 kids on the team from Missoula. One is from Sentinel. Start with them and what they know of Zach. Other incoming freshman will also know Zach through camps and social media. If enough vouch for him, let him lift and work out with the team in an unofficial capacity (if that is allowed). Make him earn their trust. The team leaders will be able to see if Zach will fit and become a member of the team.

[cat-o-nine]

Phat Cat, I think you have made the best point in all of this. Must be a lot of sinless people out there who can throw these stones at a young man who used an "improper" word when he was a 17-year-old. I agree. Let's get the social media opened up from all of these holier-than-thou types - whether it be former or current Griz players, journalism students from that wreck of a mess to the west, or anyone else who wants to cast stones - even here on the Nation or in Bobcat athletics. Are they willing to show everything they have shared with friends, as a teenager or as an adult, they thought was out of the public realm? I don't know the Cruz family, but I have raised 4 children to adulthood. I can't imagine what that family has been put thru due to the use of one word by a 17-year-old, not even yet an adult, in a communication to a friend. One word over the short course of the kid's 17 years of life. There is a reason we, as a society and in law, distinguish between adolescence and adulthood and that expectations and laws differ when addressing actions of a minor vs. an adult. There is no basis for believing Mr. Cruz is a racist. This whole situation and the ongoing treatment of Mr. Cruz is shameful. To let this turn into what it has become is a travesty and is lunacy. Time to accept that Mr. Cruz has paid more than a just price for that one little word he used as an adolescent and has learned mightily from it. Accept his apology fully and move on. Let the young man play.

[Cataholic]

Phat Cat, I think you have made the best point in all of this. Must be a lot of sinless people out there who can throw these stones at a young man who used an "improper" word when he was a 17-year-old. I agree. Let's get the social media opened up from all of these holier-than-thou types - whether it be former or current Griz players, journalism students from that wreck of a mess to the west, or anyone else who wants to cast stones - even here on the Nation or in Bobcat athletics. Are they willing to show everything they have shared with friends, as a teenager or as an adult, they thought was out of the public realm? I don't know the Cruz family, but I have raised 4 children to adulthood. I can't imagine what that family has been put thru due to the use of one word by a 17-year-old, not even yet an adult, in a communication to a friend. One word over the short course of the kid's 17 years of life. There is a reason we, as a society and in law, distinguish between adolescence and adulthood and that expectations and laws differ when addressing actions of a minor vs. an adult. There is no basis for believing Mr. Cruz is a racist. This whole situation and the ongoing treatment of Mr. Cruz is shameful. To let this turn into what it has become is a travesty and is lunacy. Time to accept that Mr. Cruz has paid more than a just price for that one little word he used as an adolescent and has learned mightily from it. Accept his apology fully and move on. Let the young man play.

While I believe Crews deserves a second chance, your post seems to indicate that he apologized so it is time to move on. I don’t agree with that. The n word and the context with a gun was a dumb mistake made by a 17 year old, but that word is so derogatory to a whole race that a simple apology is not sufficient. It is a word that categorized a whole race as not human. To just say “let’s move on” is not being fair to black members of the team. As I stated earlier, give him a chance to prove what type of person he is.

[cat-o-nine]

First, please accept my apologies for misspelling his last name, Crews.
Cataholic, did you read the article in the College Athletics forum about this situation? If you did, what would you impose as a punishment that you would think was sufficient? That the young man would have his whole life turned upside down and be branded with a scarlet letter? Because it sounds like that is basically what has happened. And how long does he have to "prove what type of a person he is"? What does he have to accomplish, specifically, to meet your standard of sufficient proof?

[GoldstoneCat]

Phat Cat, I think you have made the best point in all of this. Must be a lot of sinless people out there who can throw these stones at a young man who used an "improper" word when he was a 17-year-old. I agree. Let's get the social media opened up from all of these holier-than-thou types - whether it be former or current Griz players, journalism students from that wreck of a mess to the west, or anyone else who wants to cast stones - even here on the Nation or in Bobcat athletics. Are they willing to show everything they have shared with friends, as a teenager or as an adult, they thought was out of the public realm? I don't know the Cruz family, but I have raised 4 children to adulthood. I can't imagine what that family has been put thru due to the use of one word by a 17-year-old, not even yet an adult, in a communication to a friend. One word over the short course of the kid's 17 years of life. There is a reason we, as a society and in law, distinguish between adolescence and adulthood and that expectations and laws differ when addressing actions of a minor vs. an adult. There is no basis for believing Mr. Cruz is a racist. This whole situation and the ongoing treatment of Mr. Cruz is shameful. To let this turn into what it has become is a travesty and is lunacy. Time to accept that Mr. Cruz has paid more than a just price for that one little word he used as an adolescent and has learned mightily from it. Accept his apology fully and move on. Let the young man play.

While I believe Crews deserves a second chance, your post seems to indicate that he apologized so it is time to move on. I don’t agree with that. The n word and the context with a gun was a dumb mistake made by a 17 year old, but that word is so derogatory to a whole race that a simple apology is not sufficient. It is a word that categorized a whole race as not human. To just say “let’s move on” is not being fair to black members of the team. As I stated earlier, give him a chance to prove what type of person he is.

I guess my thought would be this: why should we, Montana state university, our football team and the ecosystem around it, be the ones to give this kid his second chance? I've said dumb things, done dumb things, regrettable things, and depending who you ask I've mostly turned out fine. But is this kid worth the potential disruption of culture and team chemistry? Is he that good? It feels like the primary motivation behind it would be to get one over on UM, and i think that's a dumb reason. I'll happily support the kid and be glad to be proven wrong but it just smacks of "take that, Bobby" and the risk of it blowing up is not zero.

[TomCat88]

The process is coming along. A lot of what you’re taking about has come and gone. My hunch is that it will probably work out for Crews.

[tdub]

Phat Cat, I think you have made the best point in all of this. Must be a lot of sinless people out there who can throw these stones at a young man who used an "improper" word when he was a 17-year-old. I agree. Let's get the social media opened up from all of these holier-than-thou types - whether it be former or current Griz players, journalism students from that wreck of a mess to the west, or anyone else who wants to cast stones - even here on the Nation or in Bobcat athletics. Are they willing to show everything they have shared with friends, as a teenager or as an adult, they thought was out of the public realm? I don't know the Cruz family, but I have raised 4 children to adulthood. I can't imagine what that family has been put thru due to the use of one word by a 17-year-old, not even yet an adult, in a communication to a friend. One word over the short course of the kid's 17 years of life. There is a reason we, as a society and in law, distinguish between adolescence and adulthood and that expectations and laws differ when addressing actions of a minor vs. an adult. There is no basis for believing Mr. Cruz is a racist. This whole situation and the ongoing treatment of Mr. Cruz is shameful. To let this turn into what it has become is a travesty and is lunacy. Time to accept that Mr. Cruz has paid more than a just price for that one little word he used as an adolescent and has learned mightily from it. Accept his apology fully and move on. Let the young man play.

While I believe Crews deserves a second chance, your post seems to indicate that he apologized so it is time to move on. I don’t agree with that. The n word and the context with a gun was a dumb mistake made by a 17 year old, but that word is so derogatory to a whole race that a simple apology is not sufficient. It is a word that categorized a whole race as not human. To just say “let’s move on” is not being fair to black members of the team. As I stated earlier, give him a chance to prove what type of person he is.

I guess my thought would be this: why should we, Montana state university, our football team and the ecosystem around it, be the ones to give this kid his second chance? I've said dumb things, done dumb things, regrettable things, and depending who you ask I've mostly turned out fine. But is this kid worth the potential disruption of culture and team chemistry? Is he that good? It feels like the primary motivation behind it would be to get one over on UM, and i think that's a dumb reason. I'll happily support the kid and be glad to be proven wrong but it just smacks of "take that, Bobby" and the risk of it blowing up is not zero.

It is BECAUSE of the culture is why you give him the chance. If this was able to destroy the culture, then the culture really isn’t strong. A strong culture doesn’t avoid issues, it deals with them in a good way. You have an opportunity to strengthen the culture, not weaken it. This is a situation where you can have supreme confidence that this is a mistake that won’t be repeated. This is a situation where people that are against bringing him in are more worried about optics than reality. This reality is Zac is a good kid that will highly likely been good friends with his teammates of all different skin tones. And from all I gathered, odds are Zac will have a much more mature grasp of all of this than just about anyone. He lived it. He was forced to grow up quick, which isn’t a bad thing.

[RobertCats]

Phat Cat, I think you have made the best point in all of this. Must be a lot of sinless people out there who can throw these stones at a young man who used an "improper" word when he was a 17-year-old. I agree. Let's get the social media opened up from all of these holier-than-thou types - whether it be former or current Griz players, journalism students from that wreck of a mess to the west, or anyone else who wants to cast stones - even here on the Nation or in Bobcat athletics. Are they willing to show everything they have shared with friends, as a teenager or as an adult, they thought was out of the public realm? I don't know the Cruz family, but I have raised 4 children to adulthood. I can't imagine what that family has been put thru due to the use of one word by a 17-year-old, not even yet an adult, in a communication to a friend. One word over the short course of the kid's 17 years of life. There is a reason we, as a society and in law, distinguish between adolescence and adulthood and that expectations and laws differ when addressing actions of a minor vs. an adult. There is no basis for believing Mr. Cruz is a racist. This whole situation and the ongoing treatment of Mr. Cruz is shameful. To let this turn into what it has become is a travesty and is lunacy. Time to accept that Mr. Cruz has paid more than a just price for that one little word he used as an adolescent and has learned mightily from it. Accept his apology fully and move on. Let the young man play.

While I believe Crews deserves a second chance, your post seems to indicate that he apologized so it is time to move on. I don’t agree with that. The n word and the context with a gun was a dumb mistake made by a 17 year old, but that word is so derogatory to a whole race that a simple apology is not sufficient. It is a word that categorized a whole race as not human. To just say “let’s move on” is not being fair to black members of the team. As I stated earlier, give him a chance to prove what type of person he is.

I guess my thought would be this: why should we, Montana state university, our football team and the ecosystem around it, be the ones to give this kid his second chance? I've said dumb things, done dumb things, regrettable things, and depending who you ask I've mostly turned out fine. But is this kid worth the potential disruption of culture and team chemistry? Is he that good? It feels like the primary motivation behind it would be to get one over on UM, and i think that's a dumb reason. I'll happily support the kid and be glad to be proven wrong but it just smacks of "take that, Bobby" and the risk of it blowing up is not zero.

It is BECAUSE of the culture is why you give him the chance. If this was able to destroy the culture, then the culture really isn’t strong. A strong culture doesn’t avoid issues, it deals with them in a good way. You have an opportunity to strengthen the culture, not weaken it. This is a situation where you can have supreme confidence that this is a mistake that won’t be repeated. This is a situation where people that are against bringing him in are more worried about optics than reality. This reality is Zac is a good kid that will highly likely been good friends with his teammates of all different skin tones. And from all I gathered, odds are Zac will have a much more mature grasp of all of this than just about anyone. He lived it. He was forced to grow up quick, which isn’t a bad thing.

@tdub in midseason form with this post! Well said.