Defensive Coordinator

Discuss anything and everything relating to Bobcat Football here.

Moderators: rtb, kmax, SonomaCat

User avatar
AFCAT
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 5231
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:25 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by AFCAT » Thu Jan 13, 2022 1:04 pm

BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:57 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:37 pm
Cledus wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:15 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:01 pm
superbobcat wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 1:56 pm
While I would like to see us promote from within house, I wonder if one year is enough for Coach Vigen to feel comfortable enough to promote Bobby Daily? Howe is a young guy and probably has a better overall grasp of the defense Coach Vigen wants to run. I believe if they are in house they may stay longer than one and done. I certainly don't blame Coach Banks for taking off, but consistency would be nice.
If they want long continuity, probably best to go off and hire some older dude that is tired of moving around and just wants to settle down. These young guys are almost always going to be looking to move up for the bigger bucks.
I prefer the younger guys. They're hungry and willing to do a lot to prove themselves that the boomers won't, or just don't have the energy for anymore. The boomers are just trading their time for a paycheck and trying to lock up some decent health insurance.
Cool. What are some examples that the younger guys are willing to do to prove themselves that the older guys won’t do?
Most 60-70 year old men probably aren’t going to be as aggressive on the recruiting trail. And let’s be honest, coaching in season takes a ton of time, and as you get older, it gets harder. There are always exceptions, but in a lot of ways, it’s a young(er) mans game. I know if I was in my 60’s, I wouldn’t want to spend 14 hours a day coaching, going over film, and trying to recruit. Not for the salary here.
If that’s your definition of an older coach, then okay, but I don’t think there are a lot of OCs and DCs working at those ages. I was thinking more of being over 40 as being older.


QB Club
https://www.msubqc.org
Want to pledge or donate to the Bobcat facilities plan?!
http://www.msuaf.org/msuathleticcomplex
"The players were rocking. The stadium was rocking. The griz couldn't handle it." Travis Jonsen

User avatar
Cledus
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 5058
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 3:18 pm
Location: Billings Heights

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by Cledus » Thu Jan 13, 2022 1:16 pm

AFCAT wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:37 pm
Cledus wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:15 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:01 pm
superbobcat wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 1:56 pm
While I would like to see us promote from within house, I wonder if one year is enough for Coach Vigen to feel comfortable enough to promote Bobby Daily? Howe is a young guy and probably has a better overall grasp of the defense Coach Vigen wants to run. I believe if they are in house they may stay longer than one and done. I certainly don't blame Coach Banks for taking off, but consistency would be nice.
If they want long continuity, probably best to go off and hire some older dude that is tired of moving around and just wants to settle down. These young guys are almost always going to be looking to move up for the bigger bucks.
I prefer the younger guys. They're hungry and willing to do a lot to prove themselves that the boomers won't, or just don't have the energy for anymore. The boomers are just trading their time for a paycheck and trying to lock up some decent health insurance.
Cool. What are some examples that the younger guys are willing to do to prove themselves that the older guys won’t do?
Work longer hours. Plus, younger people just have more energy to work longer hours. Spend more time away from home and family if means cashing in on that fat FBS money. These may be broad generalizations, but in my judgment they're more true than not.

If you disagree, maybe you could provide some examples of Stiegelmeier-age assistants rising through the ranks to lead major programs.

As retired military, you and I both know there's stuff you wouldn't do your last few years that you wouldn't have blinked at as a younger man.


UM is the university equivalent of Axe Body Spray and essential oils.

User avatar
AFCAT
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 5231
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:25 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by AFCAT » Thu Jan 13, 2022 2:05 pm

Cledus wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 1:16 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:37 pm
Cledus wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:15 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:01 pm
superbobcat wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 1:56 pm
While I would like to see us promote from within house, I wonder if one year is enough for Coach Vigen to feel comfortable enough to promote Bobby Daily? Howe is a young guy and probably has a better overall grasp of the defense Coach Vigen wants to run. I believe if they are in house they may stay longer than one and done. I certainly don't blame Coach Banks for taking off, but consistency would be nice.
If they want long continuity, probably best to go off and hire some older dude that is tired of moving around and just wants to settle down. These young guys are almost always going to be looking to move up for the bigger bucks.
I prefer the younger guys. They're hungry and willing to do a lot to prove themselves that the boomers won't, or just don't have the energy for anymore. The boomers are just trading their time for a paycheck and trying to lock up some decent health insurance.
Cool. What are some examples that the younger guys are willing to do to prove themselves that the older guys won’t do?
Work longer hours. Plus, younger people just have more energy to work longer hours. Spend more time away from home and family if means cashing in on that fat FBS money. These may be broad generalizations, but in my judgment they're more true than not.

If you disagree, maybe you could provide some examples of Stiegelmeier-age assistants rising through the ranks to lead major programs.

As retired military, you and I both know there's stuff you wouldn't do your last few years that you wouldn't have blinked at as a younger man.
How old is Kent Baer? He looks pretty old and is an FCS DC. What age is old and what age is young? Anyway, I thought we were conversing about OCs and DCs and what would be best for continuity, older versus younger guys, and how to get to that point where it works best for the program. Truth is, there is no correct answer. NDSU has a really young DC. Um has an older DC. MSU had a relatively experienced DC in his 30s. I do think that an older guy 35-45 would be better for continuity. My opinion.

Actually, as a military leader there wasn’t anything my troops did that I wasn’t willing to do or did, even the suck details. I didn’t do those things as much as they did, but I wanted them to see that nothing was beneath me.


QB Club
https://www.msubqc.org
Want to pledge or donate to the Bobcat facilities plan?!
http://www.msuaf.org/msuathleticcomplex
"The players were rocking. The stadium was rocking. The griz couldn't handle it." Travis Jonsen

justafan
BobcatNation Redshirt
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2021 8:44 am

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by justafan » Thu Jan 13, 2022 5:16 pm

bcats wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:59 pm
Ty Gregorak? It was a big surprise when Choate let him go. His defenses were always tough.
That would be great but unlikely. TG definitely had some fire.



User avatar
Bobcat4Ever
Member # Retired
Posts: 2074
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:26 pm
Location: Nevada

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by Bobcat4Ever » Thu Jan 13, 2022 5:57 pm

I think what folks are asking for is the middle ground. Freddie Banks was a first-time coordinator, but with excellent experience. I would have loved to have him stay for 3-4 more seasons. By then the players know the defense. One and done won’t hit big every year. Being able to keep someone good for 3-5 years reduces the risk. If Jay Norvell wouldn’t have gotten the Colorado St. job we might still have Freddie for a year or two. By then he’d have an assistant trained.



MTCat21
New Recruit
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2022 6:03 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by MTCat21 » Thu Jan 13, 2022 6:09 pm

You just described Bobby Daly!
AFCAT wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:46 pm
CelticCat wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:41 pm
If you have a young, up and coming coach who is an alumn those are your best bets for continuity IMO. Obviously you don't give a guy the job solely based on that but those guys typically stick around for a little longer at least as long as they are promoted.
I think you are right there, at least for a bit longer than a coach brought in from another program. Having ties to the state, area or region also helps with some continuity from younger guys.



catscat
1st Team All-BobcatNation
Posts: 1611
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:13 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by catscat » Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:17 pm

justafan wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 5:16 pm
bcats wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:59 pm
Ty Gregorak? It was a big surprise when Choate let him go. His defenses were always tough.
That would be great but unlikely. TG definitely had some fire.
I don't know about his" fire" but I had the same problem with Gregorak that Choate did. His defenses couldn't get off the field on third down. Mediocre offenses looked like NDSU converting 3 and 14, 3 and 9, etc. It was no surprise that Choate let him go. I will give you that under TG we had the best defense in the FCS on first and second down - unfortunately, teams get 4 downs to make 10 yds.



onceacat
Member # Retired
Posts: 2679
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2011 11:35 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by onceacat » Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:46 pm

catscat wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:17 pm
justafan wrote:
Thu Jan 13, 2022 5:16 pm
bcats wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:59 pm
Ty Gregorak? It was a big surprise when Choate let him go. His defenses were always tough.
That would be great but unlikely. TG definitely had some fire.
I don't know about his" fire" but I had the same problem with Gregorak that Choate did. His defenses couldn't get off the field on third down. Mediocre offenses looked like NDSU converting 3 and 14, 3 and 9, etc. It was no surprise that Choate let him go. I will give you that under TG we had the best defense in the FCS on first and second down - unfortunately, teams get 4 downs to make 10 yds.
I always wondered if that had anything to do with Choate moving the best defensive player to QB.



catscat
1st Team All-BobcatNation
Posts: 1611
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:13 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by catscat » Thu Jan 13, 2022 11:31 pm

Troy played both running back and linebacker in 2017 so I doubt that the move to QB in Gregorak's last season had anything to do with his 3rd down problem since the defense's third down performance was consistent when Troy wasn't on the team, played LB/RB, or QB. Glad I could clear that up for you.



User avatar
The Butcher
BobcatNation Hall of Famer
Posts: 3399
Joined: Thu Oct 26, 2006 8:51 am

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by The Butcher » Fri Jan 14, 2022 9:15 am

BLACKnBLUEnGOLD wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:53 pm
AFCAT wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:01 pm
If they want long continuity, probably best to go off and hire some older dude that is tired of moving around and just wants to settle down. These young guys are almost always going to be looking to move up for the bigger bucks.
Count me out on guys who just want to settle. Down that road lies complacence and stagnation. Give me younger guys who are on the way up, not old guys who are on the way down.
E.g. Rob Ash



User avatar
Montanabob
Member # Retired
Posts: 2291
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:29 pm
Location: Two Dot

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by Montanabob » Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:48 pm

Thank God b petrino is no longer available to be hired.


MSU fan.... U of I Graduate... They're Back

User avatar
AFCAT
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 5231
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:25 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by AFCAT » Fri Jan 14, 2022 2:05 pm

Montanabob wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:48 pm
Thank God b petrino is no longer available to be hired.
Do you mean Paul Petrino? He is headed to South Alabama as an analyst. That seems to be the unemployment job for fired coaches.


QB Club
https://www.msubqc.org
Want to pledge or donate to the Bobcat facilities plan?!
http://www.msuaf.org/msuathleticcomplex
"The players were rocking. The stadium was rocking. The griz couldn't handle it." Travis Jonsen

imacat
2nd Team All-BobcatNation
Posts: 1280
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 11:23 am

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by imacat » Fri Jan 14, 2022 2:35 pm

This article feeds into the discussion. It talks about Freddie bringing energy. It also says he was given the freedom to select his own defensive staff.

https://csurams.com/news/2022/1/13/foot ... -boss.aspx
Last edited by imacat on Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.



bobcatbob
1st Team All-BobcatNation
Posts: 1972
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 5:04 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by bobcatbob » Fri Jan 14, 2022 2:37 pm

Is there any indication when the new DC and DL coach will be announced? I would think they want them in place soon to start preparing for Spring.



User avatar
Hawks86
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 10102
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 3:27 pm
Location: MT

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by Hawks86 » Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:23 pm

bobcatbob wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 2:37 pm
Is there any indication when the new DC and DL coach will be announced? I would think they want them in place soon to start preparing for Spring.
As of now, it's DC,DB, and asst. DL.


"I'm a Bobcat forever its in my soul..."

User avatar
wbtfg
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 12108
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:52 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by wbtfg » Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:55 pm

Hawks86 wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:23 pm
bobcatbob wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 2:37 pm
Is there any indication when the new DC and DL coach will be announced? I would think they want them in place soon to start preparing for Spring.
As of now, it's DC,DB, and asst. DL.
Did we lose kyle too? Or are you counting Freddie as DC and DB?



User avatar
Hawks86
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 10102
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 3:27 pm
Location: MT

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by Hawks86 » Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:14 pm

wbtfg wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:55 pm
Did we lose kyle too? Or are you counting Freddie as DC and DB?
Image


"I'm a Bobcat forever its in my soul..."

User avatar
wbtfg
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 12108
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:52 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by wbtfg » Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:19 pm

Hawks86 wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:14 pm
wbtfg wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:55 pm
Did we lose kyle too? Or are you counting Freddie as DC and DB?
Image
:lol:



BraveBobcat
New Recruit
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:47 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by BraveBobcat » Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:30 am

Figuring on either Howe or Daly being promoted or Wyoming/NDSU Coaching Tree is MASSIVE in regards to the defensive side of the ball. Some names that come to mind that would have a Vigen connection and fairly realistic.....Grant Olson- LB's @ NDSU. Played @ NDSU and Grad Asst. at Wyo. Aaron Bohl LB's @ Wyo, Craig Bohl's son. Ton of guys over at Washington State that have connections with NDSU/WYO. Dickert, Ward, Cooper, Kaligis. Other connections include Scottie Hazelton @ Michigan State or Casey "Gus" Bradley, or Chris Klieman at K State. All know a guy, who knows another guy. None of those guys mentioned will be the DC but the Vigen connection tree is huge nonetheless. Who knows who the next DC will be and where he will be coming from. Coaching is small world.

One crazy name to throw out.....Mike Breske. That other school's DC at one point and NDSU DC when Vigen was OC. Daly worked under him at Idaho. Hazelton worked under Breske, Banks played for Hazelton...just sayin.

Other Bobcats with Defensive Coaching experience if we want to go there
1. Jody Owens
2. Roger Cooper
3. Clay Bignell



User avatar
wbtfg
Golden Bobcat
Posts: 12108
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:52 pm

Re: Defensive Coordinator

Post by wbtfg » Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:55 pm

BraveBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:30 am
Figuring on either Howe or Daly being promoted or Wyoming/NDSU Coaching Tree is MASSIVE in regards to the defensive side of the ball. Some names that come to mind that would have a Vigen connection and fairly realistic.....Grant Olson- LB's @ NDSU. Played @ NDSU and Grad Asst. at Wyo. Aaron Bohl LB's @ Wyo, Craig Bohl's son. Ton of guys over at Washington State that have connections with NDSU/WYO. Dickert, Ward, Cooper, Kaligis. Other connections include Scottie Hazelton @ Michigan State or Casey "Gus" Bradley, or Chris Klieman at K State. All know a guy, who knows another guy. None of those guys mentioned will be the DC but the Vigen connection tree is huge nonetheless. Who knows who the next DC will be and where he will be coming from. Coaching is small world.

One crazy name to throw out.....Mike Breske. That other school's DC at one point and NDSU DC when Vigen was OC. Daly worked under him at Idaho. Hazelton worked under Breske, Banks played for Hazelton...just sayin.

Other Bobcats with Defensive Coaching experience if we want to go there
1. Jody Owens
2. Roger Cooper
3. Clay Bignell
I’d like to see Bobby Daley as DC and Jody Owens come back to coach LBs.



Post Reply