Rolovich Terminated

[onceacat]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

[Lord Vigo]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

[onceacat]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

Yes, there hasn't been longitudinal data because there hasn't been time. But that has been the case with every single vaccine ever developed when they were initially mandated.

Obviously they didn't fire adults for not getting a polio vax. Because its a childhood illness. But they did prevent kids who weren't vaxxed from going to school. And the military has been dismissing soldier under less than honorable circumstances for vaccine refusal for at least 250 years...since before the US was even a country. So that's the parallel with adult vaccine mandates. There are plenty of other examples of circumstances where employers have required employees to get a vaccine as a job requirement over the last 125 years...and the Supreme Court has upheld government mandated vaccines on at least 2 occasions.

And, I'm not really sure that polio (a disease that killed 6,600 American kids every year) is less scary than a disease that has killed 700,000 Americans in the last year. So using the "polio is scarier" argument isn't really convincing. Although polio mostly impacted rich white people and covid mostly kills black and brown people, so maybe it is less scary...

Point being is that vaccine mandates are nothing new, and nothing out of line with 200 years of history. Creating a culture war over doing things the way they've been done since George Washington is just shocking to see.

[seataccat]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

There is also no studies on the long term consequences of contracing covid. They know those mRNA vacinnes are quite safe. Do the cost benefit analysis of the long term risks of the vaccine vs the long term risks of covid and there is a reason why every fricken doctor and research scientist recommends the vacinnes.

[91catAlum]

The problem with the covid vaccine mandate is that it doesn't account for those who have recovered from covid and thus have the same antibodies. Those people shouldn't be forced to take the vax, there's no scientific reason to do so.
The mandate is not about science, it's about politics.

And for the record, I am vaccinated and think it's a good idea for most adults. But I'm 100% against this anti-science mandate.

[Cledus]

I wonder if Boise State is wishing they would have went with Choate? Avalos is under some fire for his losing record and 3 straight home losses.

Their no balls AD went with the lazy pick because he didn’t have enough spine to stand behind picking an FCS coach. I knew Choate was the front runner after making past the first round of cuts. But Washington State might not be better than Texas.

[Lord Vigo]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

There is also no studies on the long term consequences of contracing covid. They know those mRNA vacinnes are quite safe. Do the cost benefit analysis of the long term risks of the vaccine vs the long term risks of covid and there is a reason why every fricken doctor and research scientist recommends the vacinnes.

I’m not anti-vaccine and if I had to guess, I’d say the vaccine is safe in the long term. I’m just saying it’s understandable why people would not want to take it so early in its implementation.

The biggest problem with vaccine advocates is that they generally treat pretty reasonable questions or hesitations as being idiotic and/or evil.

The strategy is… odd.

[Lord Vigo]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

Yes, there hasn't been longitudinal data because there hasn't been time. But that has been the case with every single vaccine ever developed when they were initially mandated.

Obviously they didn't fire adults for not getting a polio vax. Because its a childhood illness. But they did prevent kids who weren't vaxxed from going to school. And the military has been dismissing soldier under less than honorable circumstances for vaccine refusal for at least 250 years...since before the US was even a country. So that's the parallel with adult vaccine mandates. There are plenty of other examples of circumstances where employers have required employees to get a vaccine as a job requirement over the last 125 years...and the Supreme Court has upheld government mandated vaccines on at least 2 occasions.

And, I'm not really sure that polio (a disease that killed 6,600 American kids every year) is less scary than a disease that has killed 700,000 Americans in the last year. So using the "polio is scarier" argument isn't really convincing. Although polio mostly impacted rich white people and covid mostly kills black and brown people, so maybe it is less scary...

Point being is that vaccine mandates are nothing new, and nothing out of line with 200 years of history. Creating a culture war over doing things the way they've been done since George Washington is just shocking to see.

Your implication that I’m a racist has totally convinced me. I now agree with you because you’ve subtly accused me of not caring about the deaths of black and brown people.

Side note— what’s it like to be that prejudiced?

[catsrback76]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Well yes, there's the fact that we're working through a global pandemic that we've not seen in over 100 years...so, as you see there are real consequences to taking a personal stand and isolating yourself. You're free to do it, and free to live with the consequences. Oh, and it really isn't about "freedom"...that red herring has been fried every time you get into a car and drive with a license, or a plane with a passport...or pay your taxes... etc etc etc.

[onceacat]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

Ed Ogeron got fired for hitting on a boosters wife. So an employer requiring an employee to take the best tested vaccine in history to ensure that the coaching staff doesn't miss games due to a preventable illness seems like a far more reasonable firable offense.

[onceacat]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

Yes, there hasn't been longitudinal data because there hasn't been time. But that has been the case with every single vaccine ever developed when they were initially mandated.

Obviously they didn't fire adults for not getting a polio vax. Because its a childhood illness. But they did prevent kids who weren't vaxxed from going to school. And the military has been dismissing soldier under less than honorable circumstances for vaccine refusal for at least 250 years...since before the US was even a country. So that's the parallel with adult vaccine mandates. There are plenty of other examples of circumstances where employers have required employees to get a vaccine as a job requirement over the last 125 years...and the Supreme Court has upheld government mandated vaccines on at least 2 occasions.

And, I'm not really sure that polio (a disease that killed 6,600 American kids every year) is less scary than a disease that has killed 700,000 Americans in the last year. So using the "polio is scarier" argument isn't really convincing. Although polio mostly impacted rich white people and covid mostly kills black and brown people, so maybe it is less scary...

Point being is that vaccine mandates are nothing new, and nothing out of line with 200 years of history. Creating a culture war over doing things the way they've been done since George Washington is just shocking to see.

Your implication that I’m a racist has totally convinced me. I now agree with you because you’ve subtly accused me of not caring about the deaths of black and brown people.

Side note— what’s it like to be that prejudiced?

I didn't accuse you of being racist. I'm just grasping at what possible explanation there could be to say that a disease that killed 6,600 kids/year is somehow scarier than a disease that kills 100x that.

And I'm not a proponent of government mandates. But I also believe that employers get a bit of latitude in ensuring that their workplaces were safe. Which was a pretty centrist position until like, 15 minutes ago.

[Lord Vigo]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Well yes, there's the fact that we're working through a global pandemic that we've not seen in over 100 years...so, as you see there are real consequences to taking a personal stand and isolating yourself. You're free to do it, and free to live with the consequences. Oh, and it really isn't about "freedom"...that red herring has been fried every time you get into a car and drive with a license, or a plane with a passport...or pay your taxes... etc etc etc.

I think both sides oversimplify it and refuse to see the genuine merits of the other side’s perspective.

One side yells “freedom” and seems to think that settles it.

The other yells “social responsibility” and seems to think the same.

The reality is way messier. The vaccine is new, trust in institutions and the media are at an all time low, natural immunity may be more effective than vaccination, etc, etc.

Again— I am not opposed to the vaccine, or even the theory of vaccine mandates in principle. I’m just saying that hesitancy is understandable and there’s nothing convincing about either side caricaturing the other in reductionist terms.

[Lord Vigo]

I get both sides of the argument.

What I don’t get is when people equate mandates for these vaccines with long-standing vaccines that have decades long longitudinal studies demonstrating their safety.

Surely there’s a difference.

Because those previously mandated vaccines didn't have decades long longitudinal studies when they were mandated. Salk invented the polio vaccine in 1952 and it was tested in about 1.8 million kids over the next 3 years before it was mandated to attend elementary schools in 1955.

The Covid vaccine is the most tested vaccine in history.

Hey, if people don't want to get it, that's fine. But to think that people can refuse vaccination without suffering consequences (i.e. job termination, school expulsion, inability to travel) just ins't keeping with 200+ years of the American government mandating vaccines.

Right— but generally you didn’t have to mandate the polio vaccine because the disease was dramatically more terrifying than covid— especially in children, where covid is a negligible threat.

They also didn’t fire adults or propose to ban them from air travel for not getting the polio vax. So I’m not sure I see that as parallel the way you do.

Also— I understand it’s well tested. I’m not a conspiracy theorist. But there’s no longitudinal data because there hasn’t been time. I think even proponents of mandates should be able to acknowledge that.

Yes, there hasn't been longitudinal data because there hasn't been time. But that has been the case with every single vaccine ever developed when they were initially mandated.

Obviously they didn't fire adults for not getting a polio vax. Because its a childhood illness. But they did prevent kids who weren't vaxxed from going to school. And the military has been dismissing soldier under less than honorable circumstances for vaccine refusal for at least 250 years...since before the US was even a country. So that's the parallel with adult vaccine mandates. There are plenty of other examples of circumstances where employers have required employees to get a vaccine as a job requirement over the last 125 years...and the Supreme Court has upheld government mandated vaccines on at least 2 occasions.

And, I'm not really sure that polio (a disease that killed 6,600 American kids every year) is less scary than a disease that has killed 700,000 Americans in the last year. So using the "polio is scarier" argument isn't really convincing. Although polio mostly impacted rich white people and covid mostly kills black and brown people, so maybe it is less scary...

Point being is that vaccine mandates are nothing new, and nothing out of line with 200 years of history. Creating a culture war over doing things the way they've been done since George Washington is just shocking to see.

Your implication that I’m a racist has totally convinced me. I now agree with you because you’ve subtly accused me of not caring about the deaths of black and brown people.

Side note— what’s it like to be that prejudiced?

I didn't accuse you of being racist. I'm just grasping at what possible explanation there could be to say that a disease that killed 6,600 kids/year is somehow scarier than a disease that kills 100x that.

And I'm not a proponent of government mandates. But I also believe that employers get a bit of latitude in ensuring that their workplaces were safe. Which was a pretty centrist position until like, 15 minutes ago.

I see what you’re about. I don’t have any interest in talking with you further.

[TomCat88]

Washington State is an absolute death bed for coaches. Rolovich was on his way to getting canned this year. Choate should pass on it, but at $3 million a year, he won't. Rolovich has about a .500 record at WSU, so he hasn't done too bad actually. He'll probably get hired somewhere soon. He's 5-6 overall there. He was at Hawai'i previously. Had he stayed there, I assume he'd have been fired if he didn't get vaccinated as they had one of the strictest Covid rules in the nation initially. Not sure where they are with it now though, so maybe not.

[onceacat]

Washington State is an absolute death bed for coaches. Rolovich was on his way to getting canned this year. Choate should pass on it, but at $3 million a year, he won't. Rolovich has about a .500 record at WSU, so he hasn't done too bad actually. He'll probably get hired somewhere soon.

Where? It has to both 1) not have a vaccine mandate and 2) need to hire a middling Pac 12 coach that chose to quit rather than follow the rules.

Criterial 1) limits him to the Deep South & lower midwest. Criteria 2) limits him to bottom of the pack P5 schools and G5.

Its not like there are a ton of options for a guy in his position.

[TomCat88]

Washington State is an absolute death bed for coaches. Rolovich was on his way to getting canned this year. Choate should pass on it, but at $3 million a year, he won't. Rolovich has about a .500 record at WSU, so he hasn't done too bad actually. He'll probably get hired somewhere soon.

Where? It has to both 1) not have a vaccine mandate and 2) need to hire a middling Pac 12 coach that chose to quit rather than follow the rules.

Criterial 1) limits him to the Deep South & lower midwest. Criteria 2) limits him to bottom of the pack P5 schools and G5.

Its not like there are a ton of options for a guy in his position.

Where could he be hired? Liberty, BYU, TCU, Baylor, Notre Dame, any private school. I'm guessing some of them are anti-vax.

[MTnative]

It’s a sad day in America. Firing people because they are unvaccinated is ******. Freedoms are under attack and it’s absolutely nuts people are just falling in line with it. I’m glad he stood his ground and didn’t cave. That ****** of a state isn’t gonna have any cops to fight off the fruity liberals when they burn down their own towns and cities. It’s almost comical because states like Washington, Oregon, California are gonna eat themselves and they don’t even know it. What a bunch of sheep marching one by one to the cliff.

Bull spit. People are required to get vaccines all the time for their jobs. It’s a normal part of adulthood and has been for 200 years.

You should try serving in the military & then tell us about all the freedoms that are under attack because of the number of vaccines our men and women in uniform are required to take.

Grow up.

Rolovich quit on his players. They deserve better.

YGBSM.

If I had refused that smallpox vaccination when I went on active duty, would that have meant I "quit on my fellow airmen?"

Get out of here with that nonsense. You're preaching a completely false narrative.

Not sure what YGBSM means.

If you had refused the smallpox vaccine, you would have been discharged with other than honorable circumstances. And if it left your unit high and dry, like Rolovich quitting mid season, yes.

Your myopic view of the world, and leadership, is noted.

I personally know five people that have exemptions for that very vaccine. They're collecting retirement checks after 20 year careers.

[onceacat]

It’s a sad day in America. Firing people because they are unvaccinated is ******. Freedoms are under attack and it’s absolutely nuts people are just falling in line with it. I’m glad he stood his ground and didn’t cave. That ****** of a state isn’t gonna have any cops to fight off the fruity liberals when they burn down their own towns and cities. It’s almost comical because states like Washington, Oregon, California are gonna eat themselves and they don’t even know it. What a bunch of sheep marching one by one to the cliff.

Bull spit. People are required to get vaccines all the time for their jobs. It’s a normal part of adulthood and has been for 200 years.

You should try serving in the military & then tell us about all the freedoms that are under attack because of the number of vaccines our men and women in uniform are required to take.

Grow up.

Rolovich quit on his players. They deserve better.

YGBSM.

If I had refused that smallpox vaccination when I went on active duty, would that have meant I "quit on my fellow airmen?"

Get out of here with that nonsense. You're preaching a completely false narrative.

Not sure what YGBSM means.

If you had refused the smallpox vaccine, you would have been discharged with other than honorable circumstances. And if it left your unit high and dry, like Rolovich quitting mid season, yes.

Your myopic view of the world, and leadership, is noted.

I personally know five people that have exemptions for that very vaccine. They're collecting retirement checks after 20 year careers.

Of course there are exemptions for medical and religious reasons. Rolovich didn't meet those standards. Presumably, the 5 people you know did. Big difference.

[onceacat]

Washington State is an absolute death bed for coaches. Rolovich was on his way to getting canned this year. Choate should pass on it, but at $3 million a year, he won't. Rolovich has about a .500 record at WSU, so he hasn't done too bad actually. He'll probably get hired somewhere soon.

Where? It has to both 1) not have a vaccine mandate and 2) need to hire a middling Pac 12 coach that chose to quit rather than follow the rules.

Criterial 1) limits him to the Deep South & lower midwest. Criteria 2) limits him to bottom of the pack P5 schools and G5.

Its not like there are a ton of options for a guy in his position.

Where could he be hired? Liberty, BYU, TCU, Baylor, Notre Dame, any private school. I'm guessing some of them are anti-vax.

Setting aside the fact that its likely that any private institution that receives Federal funding will (rightly or wrongly) be subject to a mandate in the next few months...

Are any of those schools in the market for a new HC? Certainly not BYU or ND. He could also get hired in Utah or Texas, or any of the SEC schools. But I'm not sure there are a bunch of openings for a guy with Rolovich's resume. Certainly not a Big 12 oe Big 10 school that has conference title aspirations...

An HC with a losing record fired mid season from a middle of the pack team in the weakest P5 conference isn't exactly turning down offers.

[grizzh8r]

The problem with the covid vaccine mandate is that it doesn't account for those who have recovered from covid and thus have the same antibodies. Those people shouldn't be forced to take the vax, there's no scientific reason to do so.
The mandate is not about science, it's about politics.

And for the record, I am vaccinated and think it's a good idea for most adults. But I'm 100% against this anti-science mandate.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner!