Reminder regarding contact with recruits/parents

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ND0479
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Re: Reminder regarding contact with recruits/parents

Post by ND0479 » Sat Jan 15, 2022 6:12 pm

rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:32 pm
rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:25 pm
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:03 am
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:02 am
rivercat wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:32 pm
Then there's Texas A&M. Jimbo Fisher identified the recruits he wanted this year and the boosters contacted them and promised a rumored $30M, yes million, in NIL payments to the class over the course of their college careers.

It is the highest rated recruiting class ever. Go figure.

The system is broken.
That looks like bribery to me, WOW...
Do you view most job offers as bribery?
Just going off what the ncaa is supposed to not permit, that it may not be acceptable for us to comment to a recruit, that me posting GOOOOOO BOBCATS may be unacceptable and then having boosters what looks like offers of money... Just doesn't pass the smell test.

But it is the ncaa and big time football.
NIL has changed everything. It was approved with very little framework and we are seeing the results now. NIL at it's core concept is great for students athletes and fair. What it has become is a legal loophole that allows exactly what the NCAA tried to eliminate years ago. The money offered to recruit is not actually commensurate with the value of their name, image, and likeness; it is a simply money to come play for a team.

Maybe the NCAA was too chicken **** to actually come up with a framework and rules that allowed college athletes to profit from their actual market value. Or maybe they knew that the only way to see the way this would be bastardized was to allow it to happen and then try to address the problems.

The weirdest thing is that the paying of the athletes that is now occuring is not based on economic forces where the "employer" pays an "employee" based on an expected return. It is driven solely by ego of winning.
This only works if you think players weren’t being paid before the NIL, which I think we all know isn’t true. College football is big, big, business. The ROI is still quite high.
The ROI to the donors/boosters isn't anywhere proportional to the investment. It is ego driven, not based on ROI.
100%



BelligerentBobcat
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Posts: 957
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Re: Reminder regarding contact with recruits/parents

Post by BelligerentBobcat » Sun Jan 16, 2022 8:03 pm

rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:32 pm
rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:25 pm
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:03 am
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:02 am
rivercat wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:32 pm
Then there's Texas A&M. Jimbo Fisher identified the recruits he wanted this year and the boosters contacted them and promised a rumored $30M, yes million, in NIL payments to the class over the course of their college careers.

It is the highest rated recruiting class ever. Go figure.

The system is broken.
That looks like bribery to me, WOW...
Do you view most job offers as bribery?
Just going off what the ncaa is supposed to not permit, that it may not be acceptable for us to comment to a recruit, that me posting GOOOOOO BOBCATS may be unacceptable and then having boosters what looks like offers of money... Just doesn't pass the smell test.

But it is the ncaa and big time football.
NIL has changed everything. It was approved with very little framework and we are seeing the results now. NIL at it's core concept is great for students athletes and fair. What it has become is a legal loophole that allows exactly what the NCAA tried to eliminate years ago. The money offered to recruit is not actually commensurate with the value of their name, image, and likeness; it is a simply money to come play for a team.

Maybe the NCAA was too chicken **** to actually come up with a framework and rules that allowed college athletes to profit from their actual market value. Or maybe they knew that the only way to see the way this would be bastardized was to allow it to happen and then try to address the problems.

The weirdest thing is that the paying of the athletes that is now occuring is not based on economic forces where the "employer" pays an "employee" based on an expected return. It is driven solely by ego of winning.
This only works if you think players weren’t being paid before the NIL, which I think we all know isn’t true. College football is big, big, business. The ROI is still quite high.
The ROI to the donors/boosters isn't anywhere proportional to the investment. It is ego driven, not based on ROI.
I think it’s both. You’d be surprised, I think, on the ROI. I think the Bozeman City Commisionrt estimated that around $4-5 million extra was brought in from the semi final game. Being good at football brings a ton of business to Bozeman. It increases enrollment. The R Bar might not be able to directly ID the return for example, but if they had NIL deals that led to better players, that leads to better teams, it does pay off.

And remember, at these bigger schools, these “boosters” have been paying the players in one way or another for a long time. Just because it’s publicized now doesn’t mean they’re spending more money. And absolutely ego has a role. Alabama boosters aren’t going to let Auburn boosters beat them.



rivercat
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Re: Reminder regarding contact with recruits/parents

Post by rivercat » Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:11 pm

BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 8:03 pm
rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:32 pm
rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:25 pm
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:03 am
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:02 am
rivercat wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:32 pm
Then there's Texas A&M. Jimbo Fisher identified the recruits he wanted this year and the boosters contacted them and promised a rumored $30M, yes million, in NIL payments to the class over the course of their college careers.

It is the highest rated recruiting class ever. Go figure.

The system is broken.
That looks like bribery to me, WOW...
Do you view most job offers as bribery?
Just going off what the ncaa is supposed to not permit, that it may not be acceptable for us to comment to a recruit, that me posting GOOOOOO BOBCATS may be unacceptable and then having boosters what looks like offers of money... Just doesn't pass the smell test.

But it is the ncaa and big time football.
NIL has changed everything. It was approved with very little framework and we are seeing the results now. NIL at it's core concept is great for students athletes and fair. What it has become is a legal loophole that allows exactly what the NCAA tried to eliminate years ago. The money offered to recruit is not actually commensurate with the value of their name, image, and likeness; it is a simply money to come play for a team.

Maybe the NCAA was too chicken **** to actually come up with a framework and rules that allowed college athletes to profit from their actual market value. Or maybe they knew that the only way to see the way this would be bastardized was to allow it to happen and then try to address the problems.

The weirdest thing is that the paying of the athletes that is now occuring is not based on economic forces where the "employer" pays an "employee" based on an expected return. It is driven solely by ego of winning.
This only works if you think players weren’t being paid before the NIL, which I think we all know isn’t true. College football is big, big, business. The ROI is still quite high.
The ROI to the donors/boosters isn't anywhere proportional to the investment. It is ego driven, not based on ROI.
I think it’s both. You’d be surprised, I think, on the ROI. I think the Bozeman City Commisionrt estimated that around $4-5 million extra was brought in from the semi final game. Being good at football brings a ton of business to Bozeman. It increases enrollment. The R Bar might not be able to directly ID the return for example, but if they had NIL deals that led to better players, that leads to better teams, it does pay off.

And remember, at these bigger schools, these “boosters” have been paying the players in one way or another for a long time. Just because it’s publicized now doesn’t mean they’re spending more money. And absolutely ego has a role. Alabama boosters aren’t going to let Auburn boosters beat them.
Good points. I will bet my life the TA&M boosters spending $30M on this year's recruits will not see $30M return to themselves.

The money flow is not just more open now it is orders of magnitudes higher because it's "legal".

I think most reasonable people were at least moderately in favor of NIL. Why shouldn't these kids get a cut of the value their NIL was adding to merchandise. And if they could use their star power to get endorsement deals, good for them. I see that my concept of NIL at the big schools was incredibly naive. The market value of these kids NIL is nowhere near the money getting promised them.

The only way to justify the payment is to call it what it is, professional sports. Just say it, put salary caps like most sports have to deal with to make more teams competitive.

It will be interesting to see what the big NCAA constitution convention comes up with. Probably not.


"...get in 21 personnel and pound people and take their souls and have fun doing that..." coach Choate

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HelenaCat95
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Re: Reminder regarding contact with recruits/parents

Post by HelenaCat95 » Mon Jan 17, 2022 7:36 am

rivercat wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:11 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 8:03 pm
rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:32 pm
rivercat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:25 pm
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 12:08 pm
BelligerentBobcat wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:03 am
RickRund wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:02 am
rivercat wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:32 pm
Then there's Texas A&M. Jimbo Fisher identified the recruits he wanted this year and the boosters contacted them and promised a rumored $30M, yes million, in NIL payments to the class over the course of their college careers.

It is the highest rated recruiting class ever. Go figure.

The system is broken.
That looks like bribery to me, WOW...
Do you view most job offers as bribery?
Just going off what the ncaa is supposed to not permit, that it may not be acceptable for us to comment to a recruit, that me posting GOOOOOO BOBCATS may be unacceptable and then having boosters what looks like offers of money... Just doesn't pass the smell test.

But it is the ncaa and big time football.
NIL has changed everything. It was approved with very little framework and we are seeing the results now. NIL at it's core concept is great for students athletes and fair. What it has become is a legal loophole that allows exactly what the NCAA tried to eliminate years ago. The money offered to recruit is not actually commensurate with the value of their name, image, and likeness; it is a simply money to come play for a team.

Maybe the NCAA was too chicken **** to actually come up with a framework and rules that allowed college athletes to profit from their actual market value. Or maybe they knew that the only way to see the way this would be bastardized was to allow it to happen and then try to address the problems.

The weirdest thing is that the paying of the athletes that is now occuring is not based on economic forces where the "employer" pays an "employee" based on an expected return. It is driven solely by ego of winning.
This only works if you think players weren’t being paid before the NIL, which I think we all know isn’t true. College football is big, big, business. The ROI is still quite high.
The ROI to the donors/boosters isn't anywhere proportional to the investment. It is ego driven, not based on ROI.
I think it’s both. You’d be surprised, I think, on the ROI. I think the Bozeman City Commisionrt estimated that around $4-5 million extra was brought in from the semi final game. Being good at football brings a ton of business to Bozeman. It increases enrollment. The R Bar might not be able to directly ID the return for example, but if they had NIL deals that led to better players, that leads to better teams, it does pay off.

And remember, at these bigger schools, these “boosters” have been paying the players in one way or another for a long time. Just because it’s publicized now doesn’t mean they’re spending more money. And absolutely ego has a role. Alabama boosters aren’t going to let Auburn boosters beat them.
Good points. I will bet my life the TA&M boosters spending $30M on this year's recruits will not see $30M return to themselves.

The money flow is not just more open now it is orders of magnitudes higher because it's "legal".

I think most reasonable people were at least moderately in favor of NIL. Why shouldn't these kids get a cut of the value their NIL was adding to merchandise. And if they could use their star power to get endorsement deals, good for them. I see that my concept of NIL at the big schools was incredibly naive. The market value of these kids NIL is nowhere near the money getting promised them.

The only way to justify the payment is to call it what it is, professional sports. Just say it, put salary caps like most sports have to deal with to make more teams competitive.

It will be interesting to see what the big NCAA constitution convention comes up with. Probably not.
I agree that the Return on Investment is probably not there. However, assuming that many kids were being paid before (and I don't believe that it was as bad as we like to believe that it was.....at least recently), now those payments are legitimate business expenses on the balance sheet. Before, a business would have to slip a $100 handshake to a player using petty cash. Now it is a line item in the budget.



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kmax
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Re: Reminder regarding contact with recruits/parents

Post by kmax » Wed Feb 02, 2022 10:51 am

I'm just going to unpin this thread. Things have changed substantially in the many years since this was originally posted as others have noted. If I were to get some updated information from MSU compliance that they wanted us to post maybe I will put up something new but for now I don't think this serves the same purpose it did in the past.


“Arguing with anonymous strangers on the Internet is a sucker's game because they almost always turn out to be—or to be indistinguishable from—self-righteous sixteen-year-olds possessing infinite amounts of free time.” -- Neal Stephenson, Cryptonomicon

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