SHSU & JSU to Conf. USA

[Hawks86]

[TomCat88]

The FCS is getting watered down.

[91catAlum]

Maybe Idaho can go too since the Big Sky is beneath them.

[TomCat88]

Maybe Idaho can go too since the Big Sky is beneath them.

The Big Sky is beneath their band, I'll give them that. No offense Spirit of the West, you're above the BSC, too.

[catgrad05]

Sam Houston has an estimated student population of 21,697
Jacksonville state 7,020 (how or why are they moving up)
JMU (rumors to sun belt) 22,667

For comparison Montana State 16,766

UC Davis 40,031
Sac State 31,451
Northern Arizonia 28,718
Weber state 26,681
Portland State 26,012
Cal Poly 22,287
University of North Dakota 13,615
North Dakota State 13,173
Idaho State University 12,425
Eastern Washington 12,340
University of Northern Colorado 12,084
Southern Utah 11,224
Future community college of Missoula 10,962
Idaho 10,791

Mountain West schools
San Diego state 35,578
Colorado State 34,166
San Jose State 33,025
UNLV 31,142
Utah state 27,426
University of New Mexico 25,441
Fresno State 25,341
Boise State 24,103
Nevada 20,718
University of Wyoming 12,249


All from Wikipedia 2020 and 2019 fall numbers

Seems a school should at least be 20,000 for a respectable FBS conference

[Montanabob]

Sam Houston has an estimated student population of 21,697
Jacksonville state 7,020 (how or why are they moving up)
JMU (rumors to sun belt) 22,667

For comparison Montana State 16,766

UC Davis 40,031
Sac State 31,451
Northern Arizonia 28,718
Weber state 26,681
Portland State 26,012
Cal Poly 22,287
University of North Dakota 13,615
North Dakota State 13,173
Idaho State University 12,425
Eastern Washington 12,340
University of Northern Colorado 12,084
Southern Utah 11,224
Future community college of Missoula 10,962
Idaho 10,791

Mountain West schools
San Diego state 35,578
Colorado State 34,166
San Jose State 33,025
UNLV 31,142
Utah state 27,426
University of New Mexico 25,441
Fresno State 25,341
Boise State 24,103
Nevada 20,718
University of Wyoming 12,249


All from Wikipedia 2020 and 2019 fall numbers

Seems a school should at least be 20,000 for a respectable FBS conference

Not about attendance. All about money .

[kmax]

Sam Houston has an estimated student population of 21,697
Jacksonville state 7,020 (how or why are they moving up)
JMU (rumors to sun belt) 22,667

For comparison Montana State 16,766

UC Davis 40,031
Sac State 31,451
Northern Arizonia 28,718
Weber state 26,681
Portland State 26,012
Cal Poly 22,287
University of North Dakota 13,615
North Dakota State 13,173
Idaho State University 12,425
Eastern Washington 12,340
University of Northern Colorado 12,084
Southern Utah 11,224
Future community college of Missoula 10,962
Idaho 10,791

Mountain West schools
San Diego state 35,578
Colorado State 34,166
San Jose State 33,025
UNLV 31,142
Utah state 27,426
University of New Mexico 25,441
Fresno State 25,341
Boise State 24,103
Nevada 20,718
University of Wyoming 12,249


All from Wikipedia 2020 and 2019 fall numbers

Seems a school should at least be 20,000 for a respectable FBS conference

While many FBS schools are larger in enrollment not all are and not all successful schools are. It’s really more about the size of the athletic budget than it is the enrollment.

Schools in the current FBS top 25 that are approximately equal to or less than MSU enrollment:

Notre Dame
Wake Forest
Baylor
Coastal Carolina (recent FCS move up)
SMU

MSU doesn’t have the budget for it either, but I don’t think enrollment size is really a valid indicator.

[BelgradeBobcat]

A lot of the reasons NDSU hasn't moved are the same for Montana State and montana. First off you have to have an invite from an FBS conference. NDSU has never gotten an invite. I doubt MSU or um ever have either. In the video he talks about if NDSU was where Youngstown is they'd be in...yeah but the reason NDSU is so good is precisely because of their isolated location-and the fact that there are not many options for kids in that region that don't go to the Big 10.
Sam Houston might eventually do something in CUSA. Jacksonville State will never be heard from again. I see a lot of games from these G5 conferences such as CUSA, Sun Belt, MAC, etc. The one thing in common with almost all of those games...there's never anybody there. It's a black hole of nothing to play for and its boring. IMHO.

[catgrad05]

I think the size of the school matters because you will be at the same “level” of recruiting. Currently we get the border line FBS guys to come here because our campus is growing and we play for championships and playoffs, if we move to the Mountain West we would be one of the smaller schools and be competing for a conference championship and a bowl game. We would be more like SUU in terms of small school in the conference

[kmax]

I think the size of the school matters because you will be at the same “level” of recruiting. Currently we get the border line FBS guys to come here because our campus is growing and we play for championships and playoffs, if we move to the Mountain West we would be one of the smaller schools and be competing for a conference championship and a bowl game. We would be more like SUU in terms of small school in the conference

It really seems you are conflating the issue here. As noted many schools with similar or lower enrollment are doing well and can recruit very well. School size by number of students isn't a limiting factor in athletics success. Moving up also wouldn't change the fact that MSU is a growing campus. School size is a preference thing for recruits, much like the type of campus is a preference. Some recruits will like an urban campus, others will like a smaller college town atmosphere. Just like some will enjoy a huge campus and others will enjoy a smaller campus.

Now the other items you list, that are in no way related to school size, definitely would hurt MSU were it ever to think of moving up. No longer playing for championships and playoffs is huge. The getting the borderline FBS guys that want to come play for a winning program, also tough. Though the new transfer rules may somewhat begin to cancel out this advantage for the top FCS programs (or may not, yet to really be seen).

[catgrad05]

I think the size of the school matters because you will be at the same “level” of recruiting. Currently we get the border line FBS guys to come here because our campus is growing and we play for championships and playoffs, if we move to the Mountain West we would be one of the smaller schools and be competing for a conference championship and a bowl game. We would be more like SUU in terms of small school in the conference

It really seems you are conflating the issue here. As noted many schools with similar or lower enrollment are doing well and can recruit very well. School size by number of students isn't a limiting factor in athletics success. Moving up also wouldn't change the fact that MSU is a growing campus. School size is a preference thing for recruits, much like the type of campus is a preference. Some recruits will like an urban campus, others will like a smaller college town atmosphere. Just like some will enjoy a huge campus and others will enjoy a smaller campus.

Now the other items you list, that are in no way related to school size, definitely would hurt MSU were it ever to think of moving up. No longer playing for championships and playoffs is huge. The getting the borderline FBS guys that want to come play for a winning program, also tough. Though the new transfer rules may somewhat begin to cancel out this advantage for the top FCS programs (or may not, yet to really be seen).

I was thinking more of wanting to be with similar schools in a conference. Obviously you want to have similar academic goals but I just assumed similar size was important as well. But it is correct that success on the field is not 100% based on student population and athletes have different determining factors for their decisions

[GavinDonos]

Another thing to keep in mind is actual campus size. UC Davis has an on-campus student population of around 20k. The 40k number stems from online students and the UC online “cross-campus” system. The same concept applies to the other universities in the Big Sky that claim to have gigantic enrollments. While these online students still pay tuition and count as enrollees, they don’t contribute to the campus experience at all. They don’t go to basic campus events, let alone athletic events. They likely don’t bother keeping ties with the university after they’ve completed their online studies, either; both in a booster and endowment capacity.

NAU has an on campus pop of around 10k, even though they boast an enrollment of nearly 3x that number. Our campus experience and alumni engagement far exceeds schools like these.

We don’t have a ton of online / commuter students at MSU or UM. Nothing to feel inferior about.