You are the Athletic Director

[mslacat]

After you did the "surprise" drug test, President Gamble would fire you for spending about $100K that you didn't have.

I have a box containing about 24 drug test kits less than 25 feet from me right now, that I would gladly volunteer. I know what it costs to do a employment drug test and $100,000 is off base. Maybe my suggestions were a bit harsh, but after the arrests we have had, it calls for extreme action. We have had enough of this .... drug use, drug selling, assault, and murder does it get worse! You will notice that I did say in my original post that yes I would have to talk to the University to make sure that we did do things properly, and I would involve all the appropriate entities, so I realise that I am a little naive about how this would work, but the idea is still the same. Test now! Find out "really" how bad the problem is, enough guessing, hold people accountable no more assuming IF I was the AD at this point I want to know what the the true extent of the problem is. I am a programmer (in the Architectural sense) by training I know you can not solve a problem with out know what the question or problem is. Some times you can sort of hand wave you way through a problem to solve a problem on the fly, but there comes a point sometimes when you have to pull back and realise the problem is too big to take it lightly. No guessing know the cold hard fact and only then come up with a solutions that will address the specific problem. That is where MSU is right now!

[bcats]

I would hope our governing body, the NCAA, testing requirements continue to be our guiding policy makers. Once more, the idea of holding student-athletes to a much higher standard than the general student body bothers me to the same extent that as an public school administrator I can randomly screen and discipline student athletes but not the general student body

Wonder what kind of weed-puffing-little-journalist-type-penal-envious-anti-sports group came up with this idea in the first place? Oh yeah, that's right! The same group that can't seem to get it through their heads that outside the 15-20 truly elite schools in the U.S. all the rest of them are nothing more than certification or licensing agencies similar to trade schools They're the same ones stating that sports management shouldn't be a viable degree or that certain colleges provide a real opportunity to go on to the next level and make millions (while all they get to do is write their weekly opinion pieces for 30-70k per year

Athletes should be held to a higher standard because the school is paying alot of them in the form of scholarships. If I was paying someone I would damn sure hold them to a higher standard. I would want to know I am not wasting my money.

Another reason is that athletes have a tendency to become the faces of the whole institution, and therefore need to be held to a higher standard.

If the athletes disagree with being held to a higher standard than it's simple, don't be a student athlete.

Then every damn scholarship gets to piss in the bottle too! That includes all the research fellowships, yada, yada...and everybody that derives a single penny from tax dollars as income!

That would be fine with me, but the tax dollars thing might be pushing it. I really don't see your argument, are you saying that the university should turn their backs or are you for testing everyone on campus.

My contention is that we also need to see our "heros" fail and show God, Country and everybody they're human and make mistakes. Simply because a kid screws up, don't destroy their entire life simply because they are athletes while Joe Blow College Student from the hall gets picked up after having a few too many or with weed and after they're released their life goes on as usual--with a slight blemish on their record the rest of their life. I used to take a great deal of glee in the Michael Ray Richardson story, but now I'm extremely happy that he's back in the game he was banned from and coaching Albany. I also know what happened to Willie Weeks back in the day could have been handled much better and a great life and future in the sport could have been saved.

Who knows? Perhaps I've been lucky for not having been caught for having more than a few when I was younger and didn't kill somebody else or obviously myself? I sure as hell ain't gonna sit here and throw the first stone.

I wouldn't have a problem with Fuller playing football and continueing his career somewhere else! Maybe after his possible prison time.

[RedCat]

I would hope our governing body, the NCAA, testing requirements continue to be our guiding policy makers. Once more, the idea of holding student-athletes to a much higher standard than the general student body bothers me to the same extent that as an public school administrator I can randomly screen and discipline student athletes but not the general student body

Wonder what kind of weed-puffing-little-journalist-type-penal-envious-anti-sports group came up with this idea in the first place? Oh yeah, that's right! The same group that can't seem to get it through their heads that outside the 15-20 truly elite schools in the U.S. all the rest of them are nothing more than certification or licensing agencies similar to trade schools They're the same ones stating that sports management shouldn't be a viable degree or that certain colleges provide a real opportunity to go on to the next level and make millions (while all they get to do is write their weekly opinion pieces for 30-70k per year

Athletes should be held to a higher standard because the school is paying alot of them in the form of scholarships. If I was paying someone I would damn sure hold them to a higher standard. I would want to know I am not wasting my money.

Another reason is that athletes have a tendency to become the faces of the whole institution, and therefore need to be held to a higher standard.

If the athletes disagree with being held to a higher standard than it's simple, don't be a student athlete.

Then every damn scholarship gets to piss in the bottle too! That includes all the research fellowships, yada, yada...and everybody that derives a single penny from tax dollars as income!

That would be fine with me, but the tax dollars thing might be pushing it. I really don't see your argument, are you saying that the university should turn their backs or are you for testing everyone on campus.

My contention is that we also need to see our "heros" fail and show God, Country and everybody they're human and make mistakes. Simply because a kid screws up, don't destroy their entire life simply because they are athletes while Joe Blow College Student from the hall gets picked up after having a few too many or with weed and after they're released their life goes on as usual--with a slight blemish on their record the rest of their life. I used to take a great deal of glee in the Michael Ray Richardson story, but now I'm extremely happy that he's back in the game he was banned from and coaching Albany. I also know what happened to Willie Weeks back in the day could have been handled much better and a great life and future in the sport could have been saved.

Who knows? Perhaps I've been lucky for not having been caught for having more than a few when I was younger and didn't kill somebody else or obviously myself? I sure as hell ain't gonna sit here and throw the first stone.

I think that by not holding people to a higher standard you set them up to fail. Playing sports is a privilege, not a right. If athletes know the rules and clearly violate them than they should be dealt with accordingly. I don't see how getting kicked off a sports team is going to ruin anybody's life unless they choose to let it. The best case scenario is that they will learn from their mistakes and improve themselves. A slap on the wrist doesn't help anything. I think the rules for getting kicked out of school probably are the same for all students whether they are athletes or not, and the reason people go to college is primarily for an education, not to play sports.

I'm not saying that I haven't knowingly done some things that I shouldn't, but I will say that when I've been caught I've accepted the punishments that have been dealt, and I'm probably a better person for it.

[SonomaCat]

Everything I thought of may well already be in place in one form or another, but these were some thoughts I had in terms of processes that might be helpful:

Recruiting

There needs to be some tracking of student-athletes that might be higher risks than others. This doesn’t mean that a kid is turned away because he made a mistake in the past (as that is stupid, and ultimately harmful for society), but the people in the athletic department need to know which students may need additional attention. Further, if a kid has a solid trend of bad behavior that signals that trouble may be highly likely down the road, that information needs to be available.

Process: For each recruit, it would be mandatory for the recruiting coach to talk to at least two people who know the student well or know of their recent history or lack thereof (coach and superintendent would probably be likely choices), and the coach would have to document his discussions with them, highlighting any problems they have had in the past (legal, grades, etc.) in addition to any positive comments about them. This process wouldn’t be perfect as coaches and superintendents may be inclined to paint a rosy picture, but if they know it is documented, they would be more likely to be honest as any omissions may affect their credibility down the road.

This documentation would put the recruiting coach on record validating their due diligence into the character of the recruit, and would serve as an incentive to be very open and honest with everyone in the athletic department about the kids they are bringing into the program, and would identify those that will need extra assistance.

A background check on all recruits would be nice, but I suspect that there isn’t much publicly available for minors or new-adults, so this is probably a non-starter.

On-going support

Perhaps a full-time staff person could be added whose sole purpose is to serve as a student-athlete mentor. A former athlete who has shown great responsibility and insight would be perfect. This person’s job would be to meet on a regular basis with every student athlete to discuss anything that seems relevant, including grades, trouble outside of school, playing time, study tips, professional guidance, etc., etc. Essentially, this person would be a confidante that the students could turn to if they needed help. This person MUST be completely independent from the rest of the athletic department … perhaps reporting directing to the dean of students or someone similar. This way, they are outside of the chain of command in the AD, which would allow them to be truly objective and committed to looking out for the best interest of the students … even if it meant advising them that they need to do something that the coaches would disagree with (like leave the team to get their own ****** together).

The students whose recruiting paperwork suggests that they might be higher risk would be given more mandatory meetings with the mentor than a student athlete who is low risk, is getting good grades, and hasn’t exhibited any concerning behavior.

Further, there could be a system by which student-athletes could anonymously submit information to this mentor about anything important … including abuse by coaches, other student-athletes doing things that need to be addressed (like running with a bad crowd or even selling drugs), or anything else along these lines. The mentor would then be able to independently contact the appropriate people to vet the information. In the case of tips about student-athletes doing things that may be bad decisions, the mentor would first and foremost bring the student-athlete in and talk to them about what they had heard, determine whether there was any validity to it, and then try to convince the student to straighten up. If that didn’t work, then the mentor could push the issue to whomever in the system could best deal with it (punishment, etc.), or even go to the authorities.

And in case some of you are hearing bells right now, yes, a lot of this mirrors corporate Sarbanes-Oxley control procedures … and the role of the mentor is essentially “internal audit.”

I think it is important to treat student-athletes like adults while still giving them the guidance they need when they need it. This experience should groom them to be the leaders of tomorrow, and not instead treat them like convicts who are presumed guilty of the crimes of others. And a large part of this is to create an environment where they have the resources available to get that guidance in confidence. And, in the rare cases when it is necessary, they need to have that guidance rammed down their throat a bit.

[Cat Grad]

One of the major problems that is easily rectified in Bozo is a lack of assistant coaches. Coach only had eight this year. Pretty hard to set up a viable mentoring program with that few mentors and this is compounded by virtue of the fact that our assistant coaches are still fairly young men themselves.

A decent program has seniors who take the young "pups" under their wing and serve a vitale mentoring role. Duke has a great program, but that Coach K is also a West Point product and served his mandatory five years on active duty and there really aren't that many college coaches who can effectively instill the military model.

What it comes down to one more time is the fact that we're doing a tremendous amount in spite of our extremely limited athletic budget. As a parent and educator, I believe since we brought these young men to Bozo after convincing their mommas we would take care of them and provide them guidance, we have a legal, moral and ethical responsibility to ensure we live up to our end of the bargain.

[tetoncat]

I agree that any violations should get an athlete kicked off of the team. Where I have a hard time with a lot of comments on here is that they be completely kicked out of school. If the player wants to stay and pay their own way why should they be forced out vs. any other student on campus. If they do kick them out then they need to do so for the same offenses to all students.

[BobCatFan]

I think a zero tolerance drug policy. If you are caught with drugs in your system you are gone from the team for good. It leaves the choice up to the student.

If a team member hears or knows about someone on the team doing drugs they need to be able to tell their coach. One person doing drugs is jeopardizing the whole team and should go. Harsh? Yes.

Full academic scholarship people should also lose their scholarships if they are caught doing/selling drugs.

It is really the student’s choice what they want to do with their lives but it is the university choice how they want to handle them.

These are good. I would hold the coaches responsible. Put it in their contracts. Only then will their recruititng practices change. Also provide some type of treatment opportunities for players who come forward on their own and admit they may have a problem.

No, I can not hold a coach responsible. They can not be with the kids 24/7. If the coach knew about it, then yes, but only in this case. It is like your English prof, and hold him responsible for all of his students doing stupid things.

[BobCatFan]

Then every damn scholarship gets to piss in the bottle too! That includes all the research fellowships, yada, yada...and everybody that derives a single penny from tax dollars as income!

I do not have a problem with this requirement. Does any disagree with this statement?

[BobCatFan]

.

Simply because a kid screws up, don't destroy their entire life simply because they are athletes while Joe Blow College Student from the hall gets picked up after having a few too many or with weed and after they're released their life goes on as usual--with a slight blemish on their record the rest of their life.
[/quote]

Since all players and students are 18 or older, they are not kids. They are young adults and they should face the actions of their mistakes. Today, everyone wants to say, oh forgive him because he is still a kid. Bull$hit They know the difference between right and wrong.

I do not see any issues with a tough school wide drug policy. If any student is caught, then kick them out of school for at least a year. Maybe this will give the student, the time to think about his future and his/her responsibilities and this would not destroy his/her life

[BobCatFan]

Everything I thought of may well already be in place in one form or another, but these were some thoughts I had in terms of processes that might be helpful:

Recruiting

There needs to be some tracking of student-athletes that might be higher risks than others. This doesn’t mean that a kid is turned away because he made a mistake in the past (as that is stupid, and ultimately harmful for society), but the people in the athletic department need to know which students may need additional attention. Further, if a kid has a solid trend of bad behavior that signals that trouble may be highly likely down the road, that information needs to be available.

Process: For each recruit, it would be mandatory for the recruiting coach to talk to at least two people who know the student well or know of their recent history or lack thereof (coach and superintendent would probably be likely choices), and the coach would have to document his discussions with them, highlighting any problems they have had in the past (legal, grades, etc.) in addition to any positive comments about them. This process wouldn’t be perfect as coaches and superintendents may be inclined to paint a rosy picture, but if they know it is documented, they would be more likely to be honest as any omissions may affect their credibility down the road.

This documentation would put the recruiting coach on record validating their due diligence into the character of the recruit, and would serve as an incentive to be very open and honest with everyone in the athletic department about the kids they are bringing into the program, and would identify those that will need extra assistance.

A background check on all recruits would be nice, but I suspect that there isn’t much publicly available for minors or new-adults, so this is probably a non-starter.

On-going support

Perhaps a full-time staff person could be added whose sole purpose is to serve as a student-athlete mentor. A former athlete who has shown great responsibility and insight would be perfect. This person’s job would be to meet on a regular basis with every student athlete to discuss anything that seems relevant, including grades, trouble outside of school, playing time, study tips, professional guidance, etc., etc. Essentially, this person would be a confidante that the students could turn to if they needed help. This person MUST be completely independent from the rest of the athletic department … perhaps reporting directing to the dean of students or someone similar. This way, they are outside of the chain of command in the AD, which would allow them to be truly objective and committed to looking out for the best interest of the students … even if it meant advising them that they need to do something that the coaches would disagree with (like leave the team to get their own ****** together).

The students whose recruiting paperwork suggests that they might be higher risk would be given more mandatory meetings with the mentor than a student athlete who is low risk, is getting good grades, and hasn’t exhibited any concerning behavior.

Further, there could be a system by which student-athletes could anonymously submit information to this mentor about anything important … including abuse by coaches, other student-athletes doing things that need to be addressed (like running with a bad crowd or even selling drugs), or anything else along these lines. The mentor would then be able to independently contact the appropriate people to vet the information. In the case of tips about student-athletes doing things that may be bad decisions, the mentor would first and foremost bring the student-athlete in and talk to them about what they had heard, determine whether there was any validity to it, and then try to convince the student to straighten up. If that didn’t work, then the mentor could push the issue to whomever in the system could best deal with it (punishment, etc.), or even go to the authorities.

And in case some of you are hearing bells right now, yes, a lot of this mirrors corporate Sarbanes-Oxley control procedures … and the role of the mentor is essentially “internal audit.”

I think it is important to treat student-athletes like adults while still giving them the guidance they need when they need it. This experience should groom them to be the leaders of tomorrow, and not instead treat them like convicts who are presumed guilty of the crimes of others. And a large part of this is to create an environment where they have the resources available to get that guidance in confidence. And, in the rare cases when it is necessary, they need to have that guidance rammed down their throat a bit.

That whole thing is BS.. Tell the young man or woman what the rules are and what his or hers responisbilites are to be in school and make sure they live up them.

[SonomaCat]

Then every damn scholarship gets to piss in the bottle too! That includes all the research fellowships, yada, yada...and everybody that derives a single penny from tax dollars as income!

I do not have a problem with this requirement. Does any disagree with this statement?

Yeah, I strongly disagree with that statement ... who gives a flying fig if some grad student smokes a doobie on his own time or if some valedictorian scholarship winner has a few beers in his dorm room? If he or she is not doing it while operating heavy equipment, I don't care ... and I certainly don't think taxpayer dollars should go towards invading the privacy of all of these people via administering urine tests on a regular basis.

If they do something that hurts other people, then punish them. Otherwise, you're just wasting time, money, and a little bit of our collective dignity.

[BobCatFan]

I agree that any violations should get an athlete kicked off of the team. Where I have a hard time with a lot of comments on here is that they be completely kicked out of school. If the player wants to stay and pay their own way why should they be forced out vs. any other student on campus. If they do kick them out then they need to do so for the same offenses to all students.

I agree with the all students statement.

[SonomaCat]

That whole thing is BS.. Tell the young man or woman what the rules are and what his or hers responisbilites are to be in school and make sure they live up them.

Gee ... can you answer the "how" part of the "make sure they live up [to] them?"

Or do you think we should just tell them the rules on day 1, and everything will work out just fine? FYI, I am pretty sure that much is already being done ... works great, doesn't it?

My point was to think of ways that the athletic department can make changes that would reduce these kinds of occurances. If you have some legitimate ideas, I'd love to hear them, but dismissing mine as B.S. tells me that you don't even understand what I posted.

[SonomaCat]

I agree that any violations should get an athlete kicked off of the team. Where I have a hard time with a lot of comments on here is that they be completely kicked out of school. If the player wants to stay and pay their own way why should they be forced out vs. any other student on campus. If they do kick them out then they need to do so for the same offenses to all students.

I agree with the all students statement.

So all students under the age of 21 who drink alcohol should be kicked out of school?

Again, I disagree.

[tetoncat]

That is not what my post said. It said for the same offenses. If a football player does not get kicked out for drinking then a student would not either. It a football player gets kicked off the team but not out of school, then I expect nothing else. But if a player gets kicked off the team and out of school for a particular offense, then I feel any student should also get kicked out of school for that SAME offense. hope that makes is clearer

[LTown Cat]

That is not what my post said. It said for the same offenses. If a football player does not get kicked out for drinking then a student would not either. It a football player gets kicked off the team but not out of school, then I expect nothing else. But if a player gets kicked off the team and out of school for a particular offense, then I feel any student should also get kicked out of school for that SAME offense. hope that makes is clearer

Absolutely not an even playing field for students vs. student athletes. There are laws which both must abide by. There are school rules which both must abide by. But, as an athlete you are held to a higher standard because you are in the public eye--not to mention expected to perform at your highest standard. Therefore, enter team rules. These go above and beyond what any standard student has. If a team rule says you lose your scholarship for drinking, then that is what happens. Does not mean a non-athletic scholarhip student loses his for drinking. It flat is not the same. This comes from a former college athlete. I expected to be held to a higher standard. You represent much more.

[bobcatbob]

It will be interesting to see what reccomendations come out of the consultants that were hired this past summer. Keep it in perspective that this recent thing is a result of things that happened back in the early summer. They have alreaady taken a lot of preventative steps. However, I do like Bay Arera Cat's suggestion of a mentor.

[tetoncat]

So how does a mentor help when several of the ones in trouble are former athletes. Do they only mentor if they are on schedule to graduate. If we just used upper classmen as suggested earlier how do we know they are not going to get out of school and do something wrong like has happened this year. Every one still places the blame on the university even though they are sometimes no longer students because they are former athletes. Now we could say Former Athlete and Mentor arrested and go into how the school allowed him to lead the younger players. Now wouldn't that be a fiasco.

[SonomaCat]

So how does a mentor help when several of the ones in trouble are former athletes. Do they only mentor if they are on schedule to graduate. If we just used upper classmen as suggested earlier how do we know they are not going to get out of school and do something wrong like has happened this year. Every one still places the blame on the university even though they are sometimes no longer students because they are former athletes. Now we could say Former Athlete and Mentor arrested and go into how the school allowed him to lead the younger players. Now wouldn't that be a fiasco.

I was assuming that you would probably go to some lengths to make sure that the mentor I was speaking of wasn't involved in illegal activity themselves. I assume for a hiring of that kind, it is reasonable to expect that the administration could identify and hire someone whose integrity was very, very high.

[Cat Grad]

So how does a mentor help when several of the ones in trouble are former athletes. Do they only mentor if they are on schedule to graduate. If we just used upper classmen as suggested earlier how do we know they are not going to get out of school and do something wrong like has happened this year. Every one still places the blame on the university even though they are sometimes no longer students because they are former athletes. Now we could say Former Athlete and Mentor arrested and go into how the school allowed him to lead the younger players. Now wouldn't that be a fiasco.

I was assuming that you would probably go to some lengths to make sure that the mentor I was speaking of wasn't involved in illegal activity themselves. I assume for a hiring of that kind, it is reasonable to expect that the administration could identify and hire someone whose integrity was very, very high.

The Duke mentoring program took kind of a hit when whoever was THE MAN last year tried to avoid the roadblock and wound up getting the DUI. Guess I don't follow basketball as much as some