Do you want Durham fired?

BigSkyCat · Post by **BigSkyCat** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 9:48 pm

Cat Pride wrote:Mick is a nice guy, but he is a mediocre coach at best. His overall career record at MSU...231-198 that is 0.538 winning percentage. Over 16 years, that is the definition of average. People say, "well he is the winningest coach in Big Sky history." That is solely because he has stayed the longest. If anyone thinks some of the legends that coached in Missoula would have stayed 16 years wouldnt have won as many games as Mick is smoking the good stuff.

In 16 years he has taken the Cats to the dance one time. He's had multiple teams with the ability to go, but Mick hasnt gotten them over the hump. Mick runs zero offense... stand around, maybe send a cutter through the key, isolation, one-on-one stuff, hoist up a 3-pointer. The Cats are real tough to prepare for. Lets not even get into his substitution madness.

Micks a nice guy... runs a clean program... I just dont want him coaching here anymore. This is not because of the slow start this year either. It stems way back to not elevating the program after '96 when he had TWO franchise, program turnaround, building block freshmen to work with and Mick pissed that opportunity away. What should have been the start of a legacy turned into mild success (at best) in the Big Sky tourney.

Well, I am tired of it. Thanks for the years Mick, we appreciate it, we love you, you will go down as one of the all time greats... its just time for everyone to move on. Hell, the Griz fired their head coach for taking the Griz to the tourney after having beaten the Cats in Bozeman. I think we can part ways with Mick after 16 years of 0.538 winning percentage and one punched dance ticket.

Totally agree and would add that Mick cannot coach big men. It's make the three pointer win, miss the three and lose big. He should have been gone in the mid 90's.

PapaG · Post by **PapaG** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 10:05 pm

I'm beginning to think that if things don't turn around this season that the "Mick as an AD consultant" scenario will happen. Mick knows that the sentiment is that it is time to make a change unless things change dramatically once conference play begins. All the pieces are there this year for a conference title, and thus far the Bobcats are struggling to beat Carroll College. I know this team has talent; it is up to the staff to get them to play together.

anacondagriz · Post by **anacondagriz** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 10:08 pm

I have no opinion of Durham just a question. Do they Bobcats have a guy like the Griz have w/Krysko or Tinkle, who are moving up the coaching ranks & truly care about the program & will be willing to pour their heart, soul & expertise into making it better? Besides the W's I think the #1 thing that is changing in Missoula is the attitude about basketball, you can almost feel it that people are starting to get excited about hoops again. I think a lot of it has to do w/the fact that Krysko is a local make good story who has returned home & is trying his damndest to return the Griz to the glory days. I honestly don't think that even if Kennedy won a bunch of games w/the Griz that a lot of people would have come back. So is there a guy who can inspire the Bozeman community, because Durham obviously does not.

bozbobcat · Post by **bozbobcat** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:10 pm

I don't think there's a Krysko or a Tinkle in the program that would be ready to move up and certainly no one who has that passion for Bobcat basketball, except for maybe James Clark. I know that Mick's record isn't all that great, but I like his level-headed approach and he runs a relatively clean program. I think the Cats will pick up their play soon and start looking very good. I don't think getting rid of Durham is the solution and IMO, the athletic department is a little trigger-shy about pulling the plug on coaches after the women's basketball fiascos of recent years. And the basketball team would be a lot worse without him. So I'd say keep Durham.

BozoneCat · Post by **BozoneCat** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:15 pm

I think Mick could if he wanted to, but he has never once shown any interest in getting out there and actively promoting Bobcat basketball to the masses like Mike Kramer does for Bobcat football. Mick just has no interest in public promotion - which is too bad, because he is a local boy made good, and just as Krystko cares about UM, there is no doubt that Mick loves MSU just as much. Mick could raise a lot of money and interest in the basketball team if he set out to do it, but he just doesn't have that in his genes. He is a pretty quiet, private person - which probably makes him more of a sympathetic figure, because he is definitely a nice guy, and it is hard to get "mad" at someone like that, but it is probably not the best disposition to have as a Division I head coach.

I can't exactly think of anyone who would be able to come in and bring the program to the next level ala Krystko for the griz. The only former player I can think of who would be mentioned is Danny Sprinkle, but I am not sure he has the experience or credentials to get the job this early in his career. That said, he might be worth taking a chance. Otherwise, we might need to go outside the program for our next hire.

whitetrashgriz · Post by **whitetrashgriz** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:30 am

GOKATS wrote:I'm a huge fan and friend of Mick. I don't think this is the right time of the season to be discussing this, but here's some food for thought. No coach or team has really dominated the BSC the last 10 years.

1995-96- MSU
1996-97- NAU
1997-98- NAU
1998-99- WSU
1999-00- UM
2000-01- Northridge*
01-02- MSU
02-03- WSU
03-04- EWU
04-05- PSU

My point is that the BSC is D-I and the coaches have to recruit and try to put a team together that can compete against every other D-I program in the nation. It's a bit different than football in this respect.

Sure, it's looking a little shakey right now, but let them get thru finals, play some BB & see how the season shakes out. Makes absolutely no sense to be dissing the coach at this point in the season.

great post gokats. i get so frustrated at some of these posts because some people dont see the big picture. what team has dominated the big sky the last ten years? what team has won 3 titles or more? are all these teams terrible? should all these coaches get fired? or should we realize that a conference like the big sky is hard to recruite in? and for the most part...the luckiest coach wins. some people need to understand that we are not duke, or carolina, or any other major program. rght now, we have what we have to work with. and mick is doing just as good of a job as anyone. as sson as some coach in the big sky starts doing what mick has done, and consitently wins a lot of games, then i dont want to hear it. right now coach k at um looks great, but let me see him stick around for the long haul, recruite the big names, maintain a classy, winning program, and continue winning at the level he is at right now. WONT HAPPEN! and i love larry. i'm just tired of this talk.

CatGrad00 · Post by **CatGrad00** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:59 am

BozoneCat wrote: Sure, he's not an a$$hole like Pat Kennedy was at UM, but otherwise what's the difference? I'm sorry, but being a nice guy doesn't cut it at the Division I coaching level, even at Montana State. .

Maybe we can get Bobby Knight!

BozoneCat · Post by **BozoneCat** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:20 am

whitetrashgriz wrote:great post gokats. i get so frustrated at some of these posts because some people dont see the big picture. what team has dominated the big sky the last ten years? what team has won 3 titles or more? are all these teams terrible? should all these coaches get fired? or should we realize that a conference like the big sky is hard to recruite in? and for the most part...the luckiest coach wins. some people need to understand that we are not duke, or carolina, or any other major program. rght now, we have what we have to work with. and mick is doing just as good of a job as anyone. as sson as some coach in the big sky starts doing what mick has done, and consitently wins a lot of games, then i dont want to hear it. right now coach k at um looks great, but let me see him stick around for the long haul, recruite the big names, maintain a classy, winning program, and continue winning at the level he is at right now. WONT HAPPEN! and i love larry. i'm just tired of this talk.

See, to me, the fact that no team has dominated the Big Sky just tells me that the opportunity to do so is there. When you are in a league with as much coaching turnover as the Big Sky, a school that has a stable, long-standing coach should have a leg up on the competition. I think we all realize that MSU is not Duke or UNC, but that doesn't mean we can't expect to make the NCAA's more than once every 15+ years.

BozoneCat · Post by **BozoneCat** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:20 am

CatGrad00 wrote:
BozoneCat wrote: Sure, he's not an a$$hole like Pat Kennedy was at UM, but otherwise what's the difference? I'm sorry, but being a nice guy doesn't cut it at the Division I coaching level, even at Montana State. .
Maybe we can get Bobby Knight!

Ugh!

Ponycat · Post by **Ponycat** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:33 am

whitetrashgriz wrote:
GOKATS wrote:I'm a huge fan and friend of Mick. I don't think this is the right time of the season to be discussing this, but here's some food for thought. No coach or team has really dominated the BSC the last 10 years.

1995-96- MSU
1996-97- NAU
1997-98- NAU
1998-99- WSU
1999-00- UM
2000-01- Northridge*
01-02- MSU
02-03- WSU
03-04- EWU
04-05- PSU

My point is that the BSC is D-I and the coaches have to recruit and try to put a team together that can compete against every other D-I program in the nation. It's a bit different than football in this respect.

Sure, it's looking a little shakey right now, but let them get thru finals, play some BB & see how the season shakes out. Makes absolutely no sense to be dissing the coach at this point in the season.
great post gokats. i get so frustrated at some of these posts because some people dont see the big picture. what team has dominated the big sky the last ten years? what team has won 3 titles or more? are all these teams terrible? should all these coaches get fired? or should we realize that a conference like the big sky is hard to recruite in? and for the most part...the luckiest coach wins. some people need to understand that we are not duke, or carolina, or any other major program. rght now, we have what we have to work with. and mick is doing just as good of a job as anyone. as sson as some coach in the big sky starts doing what mick has done, and consitently wins a lot of games, then i dont want to hear it. right now coach k at um looks great, but let me see him stick around for the long haul, recruite the big names, maintain a classy, winning program, and continue winning at the level he is at right now. WONT HAPPEN! and i love larry. i'm just tired of this talk.

I think if you posted the tounament winners and the teams that played in the championship game you would see a big difference.

HelenaCat95 · Post by **HelenaCat95** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:33 am

CatGrad00 wrote:
BozoneCat wrote: Sure, he's not an a$$hole like Pat Kennedy was at UM, but otherwise what's the difference? I'm sorry, but being a nice guy doesn't cut it at the Division I coaching level, even at Montana State. .
Maybe we can get Bobby Knight!

Or Stan Van Gundy. The man with the best pornstachio since Dave Wannstedt.

alasax · Post by **alasax** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:48 am

The fact that we have a coach with the longevity Mick has speaks volumes. He has invested more into MSU basketball and this community than MOST other residents in their professions.
Be carfull what you wish for.
This board as a whole will always look to heal by cutting off the head.
Maybe we could find someone with absolutely no love for this town and will use any success as a springboard to a bigger program.
I have enjoyed the players and personalities this staff has brought in.
IMHO a great program doesn't HAVE to win a conference title every four years. That's just gravy. It is a sport supplied for entertainment. Not for egotistical power.
Enjoy the game.

Post by **rtb** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:12 am

anacondagriz wrote:Do they Bobcats have a guy like the Griz have w/Krysko or Tinkle, who are moving up the coaching ranks & truly care about the program & will be willing to pour their heart, soul & expertise into making it better?

Someone mentioned it earlier and I think Danny Sprinkle would be a great person for the job. We want someone young and dedicated to the Bobcat Program. If he does well enough to move up to a bigger school that's perfect!! We all know that Sprinkle cares about MSU so why not take a chance on him?

NoGriz · Post by **NoGriz** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:27 am

alasax wrote:IMHO a great program doesn't HAVE to win a conference title every four years. That's just gravy. It is a sport supplied for entertainment. Not for egotistical power.
Enjoy the game.

A great program? We're a mediocre basketball program at best. IMHO, given our facilities, quality of University, fan and booster support relative to our conference peers there is no reason for us to ever finish outside of the top 4 and we should win the title every 3-4 years. There is no other University in the country where the coach could have stuck around for 15 years with a .500 record, finishing in the bottom half of the league as many times as in the top half, a losing record against the biggest rival and declining attendance and fan support.

I know members like BAC and BareChest remember MSU basketball games in the early 90's and how much fun they used to be. We students arrived early, partied hard and cheered like hell. The conference games against Weber, Idaho and the Griz were absolutely crazy and we had awesome non-conference games against teams like Mississippi St, Texas Tech and Texas A&M. That excitement is gone. I'm a huge college basketball fan, watch 2-3 games per night on ESPN and have been a MSU season ticket holder since I graduated in '93. The last two years I've actually skipped some MSU home games because there's no excitement and I just get too mad and frustrated.

I have no personal beef with Mick and can't argue that he's a great guy. It is however, time for a change...after the season, of course.

Post by **rtb** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:39 am

NoGriz wrote:I know members like BAC and BareChest remember MSU basketball games in the early 90's and how much fun they used to be. We students arrived early, partied hard and cheered like hell. The conference games against Weber, Idaho and the Griz were absolutely crazy and we had awesome non-conference games against teams like Mississippi St, Texas Tech and Texas A&M. That excitement is gone.

I was 14 or 15 and my Dad and I made the trip down to Bozeman for the 1996 BSC Tourney. I remember the field house was a mad-house that night we won. The energy in the place was amazing. In the four years I was there 2000-2004 there was never a time when the energy approached anything close. It was sad to go to games and have 90% of the student section sitting like we were watching a chess match. I would love to see that level of excitement come back to basketball. It is happening to the west of us, we better catch up!!

longhorn_22 · Post by **longhorn_22** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:54 am

rtb wrote:
NoGriz wrote:I know members like BAC and BareChest remember MSU basketball games in the early 90's and how much fun they used to be. We students arrived early, partied hard and cheered like hell. The conference games against Weber, Idaho and the Griz were absolutely crazy and we had awesome non-conference games against teams like Mississippi St, Texas Tech and Texas A&M. That excitement is gone.
I was 14 or 15 and my Dad and I made the trip down to Bozeman for the 1996 BSC Tourney. I remember the field house was a mad-house that night we won. The energy in the place was amazing. In the four years I was there 2000-2004 there was never a time when the energy approached anything close. It was sad to go to games and have 90% of the student section sitting like we were watching a chess match. I would love to see that level of excitement come back to basketball. It is happening to the west of us, we better catch up!!

I agree. I stand at every game regardless. I get yelled at because everyone else wants to sit down and all that crap. I'm getting tired of it all. I have stood at every sporting event for my schools that I have ever gone too and I wish people here would do the same. Show some shool spirit for oue basketball team and stand up and yell.

On another note, who in the hell made the basketball schedule? I guess they thought it would be an exquisite idea to schedule eight home games in a row, seven of which no students will be attending because it is over the Christmas break. I am pissed because I won't be in town, and I know most of my friends are too. At least they scheduled the Cat/Griz game two days after we come back.

CatGrad00 · Post by **CatGrad00** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:55 am

wbtfg wrote:For the record, I think all of you know that I am a Durham supporter and would love to see him coaching at MSU until he decides to retire from the profession.

Then why would you post a question like this?

CatGrad00 · Post by **CatGrad00** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:58 am

bozbobcat wrote:. And the basketball team would be a lot worse without him. So I'd say keep Durham.

I second that!

CatGrad00 · Post by **CatGrad00** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 11:00 am

alasax wrote:The fact that we have a coach with the longevity Mick has speaks volumes. He has invested more into MSU basketball and this community than MOST other residents in their professions.
Be carfull what you wish for.
This board as a whole will always look to heal by cutting off the head.
Maybe we could find someone with absolutely no love for this town and will use any success as a springboard to a bigger program.
I have enjoyed the players and personalities this staff has brought in.
IMHO a great program doesn't HAVE to win a conference title every four years. That's just gravy. It is a sport supplied for entertainment. Not for egotistical power.
Enjoy the game.

Can you say Pat Kennedy?

Eastcoastgriz · Post by **Eastcoastgriz** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 11:44 am

What happened to our friend mslacat???? He always has good insight for both the cat and GRIZ bb program.