How do Cats stack up against Griz

[GoldstoneCat]

Tom’s latest meandering thoughts aside, the only way he and OldJack are correct is that yes, MSU hasn’t seen an offense like UM’s simply because they haven’t yet played UM.

Oregon is a better offense by miles, so I’m really not understanding the “haven’t seen an offense like UM’s yet” unless you’re being literal in that the Gris are still to be played. In that case, congrats for stating the obvious.

Oregon’s offense is not only BETTER THAN Montana’s offense, but it’s also DIFFERENT THAN Montana’s offense. The Griz have the best offense in the Big Sky Conference and the Cats have seen nothing like it yet. That is the clear point I read in Tom’s statement. Some of you guys keep using the fact that Oregon boatraced the Cats as a nonsensical argument to try to dispute Tom’s statement.

As I said, that’s being literal. That’s not analysis, that’s a statement of fact. No duh they haven’t seen the Gris offense yet. Excellent insight, Jack. Never could have figured that one out without your wisdom.

Not only “haven’t seen the Griz offense yet,” but haven’t seen an offense like it. The Griz have the top offense in the BSC, as you know.

Can't wait to see it.

[BelligerentBobcat]

Multiple coaches that have played both Montana schools this year have pretty much said who they think is the better team if you pay attention. I’m sure they don’t know anything though

[85CatGrad]

I'm not buying this idea the Griz have the best offense in the Big Sky. We'll find out in about three weeks.

Exactly. It’s why the game is played.

[coloradocat]

Multiple coaches that have played both Montana schools this year have pretty much said who they think is the better team if you pay attention. I’m sure they don’t know anything though

They clearly made the mistake of watching the games and not just reading the box scores. If they had more time to study before interviews I'm sure they would get it right.

[catapult]

Tom’s latest meandering thoughts aside, the only way he and OldJack are correct is that yes, MSU hasn’t seen an offense like UM’s simply because they haven’t yet played UM.

Oregon is a better offense by miles, so I’m really not understanding the “haven’t seen an offense like UM’s yet” unless you’re being literal in that the Gris are still to be played. In that case, congrats for stating the obvious.

Oregon’s offense is not only BETTER THAN Montana’s offense, but it’s also DIFFERENT THAN Montana’s offense. The Griz have the best offense in the Big Sky Conference and the Cats have seen nothing like it yet. That is the clear point I read in Tom’s statement. Some of you guys keep using the fact that Oregon boatraced the Cats as a nonsensical argument to try to dispute Tom’s statement.

As I said, that’s being literal. That’s not analysis, that’s a statement of fact. No duh they haven’t seen the Gris offense yet. Excellent insight, Jack. Never could have figured that one out without your wisdom.

Not only “haven’t seen the Griz offense yet,” but haven’t seen an offense like it. The Griz have the top offense in the BSC, as you know.

Griz have the top offense in the conference? If you want to compare conference teams, you need to compare conference only stats. It’s the closest way to compare apples to apples. You might want to check them. Cats are number one in offense by a long shot (scoring and total yards), while the Griz are sitting 4th. Cats will have seen the number 2 (UC Davis) and number 3 (Idaho State) offenses before they face the mighty #4 offense in the conference.

[tetoncat]

Tom’s latest meandering thoughts aside, the only way he and OldJack are correct is that yes, MSU hasn’t seen an offense like UM’s simply because they haven’t yet played UM.

Oregon is a better offense by miles, so I’m really not understanding the “haven’t seen an offense like UM’s yet” unless you’re being literal in that the Gris are still to be played. In that case, congrats for stating the obvious.

Oregon’s offense is not only BETTER THAN Montana’s offense, but it’s also DIFFERENT THAN Montana’s offense. The Griz have the best offense in the Big Sky Conference and the Cats have seen nothing like it yet. That is the clear point I read in Tom’s statement. Some of you guys keep using the fact that Oregon boatraced the Cats as a nonsensical argument to try to dispute Tom’s statement.

As I said, that’s being literal. That’s not analysis, that’s a statement of fact. No duh they haven’t seen the Gris offense yet. Excellent insight, Jack. Never could have figured that one out without your wisdom.

Not only “haven’t seen the Griz offense yet,” but haven’t seen an offense like it. The Griz have the top offense in the BSC, as you know.

Griz have the top offense in the conference? If you want to compare conference teams, you need to compare conference only stats. It’s the closest way to compare apples to apples. You might want to check them. Cats are number one in offense by a long shot (scoring and total yards), while the Griz are sitting 4th. Cats will have seen the number 2 (UC Davis) and number 3 (Idaho State) offenses before they face the mighty #4 offense in the conference.

And they face the #1 every week in practice.

[Robert Martin]

You can’t take a lot of away from the early games, UND vs the Griz as well. New Players and Coaches. Here is an interesting Stat, as everything is talking about the UM offense. In conference Big Sky teams ranked by point differential during conference play:

MSU +173
UM +69
Davis +59
Sac +33
Idaho +8
NAU -21
Cal Poly -40
ISU -41
UNCU -42
EWU -58
Weber -58
PSU -72

Now look at the comparison of the their three common opponents

Category. Montana. Montana State
Points38.3 ppg 46.3 ppg
Total Offense. 438.3 YPG. 484.3 YPG
Rushing. 218.3 ypg 262.3 ypg
Passing. 220 ypg. 222 ypg
Takeaways.33/g. 1/g
Penalties. 15/135 yds. 14/115 yds
Points allowed. 17 ppg. 11.3 ppg

It is pretty clear who the better team is, and it isn’t even close when you look at the synergy of everything

The point differentials get even more interesting for our opponents if you remove their game against the Bobcats.

w/MSU <> w/o MSU
EWU: -58 <> -4
NAU: -21 <> 3
ISU: -41 <> -7
CP: -40 <> -23
UNCU: -42 <> 6

4 of the 5 teams would be practically even if they hadn't played the Bobcats. But they did and now their differential is very under water.

Funny how the "nuh uh" subjective opinions keep ignoring the actual numbers posted here. Both Sagarin and Massey ratings agree with the numbers and have the Cats ranked higher.

OldGriz isn’t paying attention. They dont have the best offense, nor the best defense. In practice the Cats get to play the best defense and offense.

[catatac]

Tom’s latest meandering thoughts aside, the only way he and OldJack are correct is that yes, MSU hasn’t seen an offense like UM’s simply because they haven’t yet played UM.

Oregon is a better offense by miles, so I’m really not understanding the “haven’t seen an offense like UM’s yet” unless you’re being literal in that the Gris are still to be played. In that case, congrats for stating the obvious.

Oregon’s offense is not only BETTER THAN Montana’s offense, but it’s also DIFFERENT THAN Montana’s offense. The Griz have the best offense in the Big Sky Conference and the Cats have seen nothing like it yet. That is the clear point I read in Tom’s statement. Some of you guys keep using the fact that Oregon boatraced the Cats as a nonsensical argument to try to dispute Tom’s statement.

As I said, that’s being literal. That’s not analysis, that’s a statement of fact. No duh they haven’t seen the Gris offense yet. Excellent insight, Jack. Never could have figured that one out without your wisdom.

Not only “haven’t seen the Griz offense yet,” but haven’t seen an offense like it. The Griz have the top offense in the BSC, as you know.

Griz have the top offense in the conference? If you want to compare conference teams, you need to compare conference only stats. It’s the closest way to compare apples to apples. You might want to check them. Cats are number one in offense by a long shot (scoring and total yards), while the Griz are sitting 4th. Cats will have seen the number 2 (UC Davis) and number 3 (Idaho State) offenses before they face the mighty #4 offense in the conference.

Ha ha ha. That's funny stuff, but hey look - Griz are good because Bobby told me so.

[KIX]

How do the Cats stack up against the Griz? Very well I'd say.
Don't think the gris offense has seen a defense like MSU's and the Cat's have played against better defenses than UM. Plain and simple.

Id say the only advantage UM has is the location of the game. We'll see if defense travels...

Griz just had 560 yards without hardly using Wortham. MSU hasn’t seen an offense like that.

I think the Griz offense is real nice. Although they did that today against a D that everyone of us but one person knew was bad. Still kudos for putting up numbers. They’re legit.

I say all that to ask the question; have the griz seen a defense like MSU’s?

MSU’s defense has allowed 75 points (9.37 per game) during regulation in eight games vs FCS opponents. UM (24.1) is allowing about 14 more ppg than MSU.

MSU’s defense is allowing 272.25 yards per game and 4.26 yards per play vs FCS opponents. UM is allowing 120 more ypg and nearly 1.5 more ypp than MSU.

Offensively, MSU is averaging 475.6 yards per game vs FCS opponents and 7.1 per play. Both of those numbers top UM, who a lot people consider the top offense in the BSC. The Griz have a slight edge in scoring. 40.6-38.8

Those are just stats. I’m not going to say who’s better but MSU is slightly outperforming UM offensively and by a significant margin defensively. That doesn’t mean they’ll win just that they’ve been playing statistically better.

Agree with this Tom. I think the griz offense is nice for sure. But I’ve been curious why the talk seems like they’re incredible? They’re nice. But what do they do so much better than the Cats?

I think their offense is incredible. I think MSU’s is just as, if not more, incredible.

Defensively, you can just watch MSU and be blown away. It’s pretty flawless. Even when teams score TDs before the fourth quarter it’s very difficult for them and it’s only happened three times in the last 7 games. Two of those (vs ISU and NAU) took about 10 plays to get the final 30 or so yards. In that span I think there’s only 1 or 2 TDs that didn’t have a 4th down conversion. It’s a lot of work to score on MSU’s defense.

I cannot, and will not, classify the dUMb offense as incredible. Any Offense looks great vs poor defensive teams, though.

[catapult]

Tom’s latest meandering thoughts aside, the only way he and OldJack are correct is that yes, MSU hasn’t seen an offense like UM’s simply because they haven’t yet played UM.

Oregon is a better offense by miles, so I’m really not understanding the “haven’t seen an offense like UM’s yet” unless you’re being literal in that the Gris are still to be played. In that case, congrats for stating the obvious.

Oregon’s offense is not only BETTER THAN Montana’s offense, but it’s also DIFFERENT THAN Montana’s offense. The Griz have the best offense in the Big Sky Conference and the Cats have seen nothing like it yet. That is the clear point I read in Tom’s statement. Some of you guys keep using the fact that Oregon boatraced the Cats as a nonsensical argument to try to dispute Tom’s statement.

As I said, that’s being literal. That’s not analysis, that’s a statement of fact. No duh they haven’t seen the Gris offense yet. Excellent insight, Jack. Never could have figured that one out without your wisdom.

Not only “haven’t seen the Griz offense yet,” but haven’t seen an offense like it. The Griz have the top offense in the BSC, as you know.

Griz have the top offense in the conference? If you want to compare conference teams, you need to compare conference only stats. It’s the closest way to compare apples to apples. You might want to check them. Cats are number one in offense by a long shot (scoring and total yards), while the Griz are sitting 4th. Cats will have seen the number 2 (UC Davis) and number 3 (Idaho State) offenses before they face the mighty #4 offense in the conference.

Ha ha ha. That's funny stuff, but hey look - Griz are good because Bobby told me so.

Ya…and don’t get me going on the QB comparison. Lamson’s efficiency rating is 196.0 while Ah Yat is 148.0….and Griz fans say Ah Yat is a front runner for the Walter Payton, that is embarrassing actually. Lamson is killing it and is getting better. He has a high ceiling and with Vigen’s ability to develop, watch out!

[The MICKSTER]

Using statistics that include OoC games essentially makes the comparison that the Oregon Ducks are the same as DII Central Washington. As Catprint & others have pointed out, the best way to compare teams/schedules is during conference play. Therefore, using ‘Conference Only Stats’ https://bigskyconf.com/stats.aspx?path= ... &conf=true is the best way to compare teams. Up to this point we have very comparable BSC schedules. Each team has 5 BSC games under their belt……

• MSU’s BSC games are; EWU, @NAU, ISU, @CP, @UNC….3 away games w/2 common opponents

• um’s BSC games are; UI, @ISU, CP, @SSU, @WSU….3 away games w/2 common opponents

After next week (11/8) we’ll each have another common opponent at home

Using BSC stats thru game 5…………..
Category……………………...MSU rank……….um rank
Scoring offense……………1st (46)………..…..2nd (40)-------MSU+6
Total Yardage offense….1st (513)…..………4th (454)------MSU+59
Rushing offense…………..2nd (270)………….4th (168)------MSU+102
Passing offense……………6th (242)…………..4th (286)------um+44
Scoring defense …………..1st (10)…………….3rd (26)-------MSU+16
Total Yardage defense….1st (282)…………..6th (402)-----MSU+120
Rushing defense…………..1st (72).……………2nd (110)-----MSU+38
Passing defense……………3rd (210)…………11th (292)-----MSU+82 um’s pass defense 2nd worst in BSC
MSU wins 7 of 8 categories

Regarding individuals……
Rushing yards per carry………A Jones 7.2, J Davis 7.0, M Wortham 6.3, E Gillman 5.4, J Lamson 4.4
MSU has the top 2 rushers in YPC……..Eli is 4th

Passing yards per game……Ah Yat 4th (264), Lamson 5th (235) just 29 YPG difference
Passing efficiency ……..Lamson 2nd (196). Ah Yat 4th (148) WOW! that's a huge difference
Passing Touchdowns ….Lamson 1st (13), Ah Yat 3rd (8)
Lamson vs Ah Yat…..Lamson has more passing TD’s and wins going away regarding efficiency. Ah Yat has 29 more YPG.

The BSC statistics for 5 conference games show that MSU is better at both Offense & Defense (especially defense). You could argue that um’s offense has a better ‘eye test’ than the CATS but the results don’t show that. I don’t think even the most rabid um fan would argue the defenses are comparable.
Will it be enough to overcome the ‘home field advantage’ that the home team in the Brawl has had over the past 5 encounters……..we’ll see.
GO CATS!!!

[Mtcatfan]

Yeah but but Old Griz “Player Rep” said………

[MTFootball]

Funny how the "nuh uh" subjective opinions keep ignoring the actual numbers posted here. Both Sagarin and Massey ratings agree with the numbers and have the Cats ranked higher.

Haha (“actual numbers”) … Sagarin (aka, NINTENDO) and Massey (aka, EA SPORTS) will always have their dedicated following.
[/quote]

Don’t let Jack(OldGriz) fool ya. He loves to use Sagarin and Massey if they support his point of view. In fact he’ll hypocritically argue any side of anything.

[TomCat88]

Funny how the "nuh uh" subjective opinions keep ignoring the actual numbers posted here. Both Sagarin and Massey ratings agree with the numbers and have the Cats ranked higher.

Haha (“actual numbers”) … Sagarin (aka, NINTENDO) and Massey (aka, EA SPORTS) will always have their dedicated following.

Don’t let Jack(OldGriz) fool ya. He loves to use Sagarin and Massey if they support his point of view. In fact he’ll hypocritically argue any side of anything.
[/quote]

That's smart on his part. He's doing what any lawyer would do, which is try to keep everyone (the jury) focused on his point. Framing the discussion on what the pollsters think works in his favor.

[MSU01]

Whoever "OldGriz" is, he's doing an absolutely masterful job of trolling here and way too many people are far too eager to take the bait to try and argue with him. I learned years ago with politics that there's no point wasting time arguing with or trying to convince someone of a different viewpoint when they're entrenched in their own beliefs and will never change their mind.

[The MICKSTER]

Funny how the "nuh uh" subjective opinions keep ignoring the actual numbers posted here. Both Sagarin and Massey ratings agree with the numbers and have the Cats ranked higher.

Haha (“actual numbers”) … Sagarin (aka, NINTENDO) and Massey (aka, EA SPORTS) will always have their dedicated following.

Don’t let Jack(OldGriz) fool ya. He loves to use Sagarin and Massey if they support his point of view. In fact he’ll hypocritically argue any side of anything.

That's smart on his part. He's doing what any lawyer would do, which is try to keep everyone (the jury) focused on his point. Framing the discussion on what the pollsters think works in his favor.
[/quote]
The 'committee' came out in mid October and ranked us 4th, behind NDSU, SDSU, Tarleton and ahead of um, which is the only poll that really matters. Nothing has occurred that would make the committee drop us below um. However, I can't imagine that we won't move up above both SDSU & Tarleton. However, if your talking the stats poll, then I believe that um will likely still be ahead of us. However, no matter which poll we're talking about, it doesn't really matter until Nov 23rd, because whomever wins the Brawl will be ranked most likely 2nd, 3rd at the worst. Whomever loses the Brawl will likely be ranked either 4th or 5th, but we'll see.

[TomCat88]

[TomCat88]

Funny how the "nuh uh" subjective opinions keep ignoring the actual numbers posted here. Both Sagarin and Massey ratings agree with the numbers and have the Cats ranked higher.

Haha (“actual numbers”) … Sagarin (aka, NINTENDO) and Massey (aka, EA SPORTS) will always have their dedicated following.

Don’t let Jack(OldGriz) fool ya. He loves to use Sagarin and Massey if they support his point of view. In fact he’ll hypocritically argue any side of anything.

That's smart on his part. He's doing what any lawyer would do, which is try to keep everyone (the jury) focused on his point. Framing the discussion on what the pollsters think works in his favor.

The 'committee' came out in mid October and ranked us 4th, behind NDSU, SDSU, Tarleton and ahead of um, which is the only poll that really matters. Nothing has occurred that would make the committee drop us below um. However, I can't imagine that we won't move up above both SDSU & Tarleton. However, if your talking the stats poll, then I believe that um will likely still be ahead of us. However, no matter which poll we're talking about, it doesn't really matter until Nov 23rd, because whomever wins the Brawl will be ranked most likely 2nd, 3rd at the worst. Whomever loses the Brawl will likely be ranked either 4th or 5th, but we'll see.
[/quote]

The "committee" and "pollsters" aren't the same thing. I don't consider the committee to be a poll. They're a selection committee and they work together to come to a conclusion on the makeup of the playoff field, seeding and matchups.

[The MICKSTER]

Funny how the "nuh uh" subjective opinions keep ignoring the actual numbers posted here. Both Sagarin and Massey ratings agree with the numbers and have the Cats ranked higher.

Haha (“actual numbers”) … Sagarin (aka, NINTENDO) and Massey (aka, EA SPORTS) will always have their dedicated following.

Don’t let Jack(OldGriz) fool ya. He loves to use Sagarin and Massey if they support his point of view. In fact he’ll hypocritically argue any side of anything.

That's smart on his part. He's doing what any lawyer would do, which is try to keep everyone (the jury) focused on his point. Framing the discussion on what the pollsters think works in his favor.

The 'committee' came out in mid October and ranked us 4th, behind NDSU, SDSU, Tarleton and ahead of um, which is the only poll that really matters. Nothing has occurred that would make the committee drop us below um. However, I can't imagine that we won't move up above both SDSU & Tarleton. However, if your talking the stats poll, then I believe that um will likely still be ahead of us. However, no matter which poll we're talking about, it doesn't really matter until Nov 23rd, because whomever wins the Brawl will be ranked most likely 2nd, 3rd at the worst. Whomever loses the Brawl will likely be ranked either 4th or 5th, but we'll see.

The "committee" and "pollsters" aren't the same thing. I don't consider the committee to be a poll. They're a selection committee and they work together to come to a conclusion on the makeup of the playoff field, seeding and matchups.

Good point.

[WalkOn79]

How do the Cats stack up against the Griz? Very well I'd say.
Don't think the gris offense has seen a defense like MSU's and the Cat's have played against better defenses than UM. Plain and simple.

Id say the only advantage UM has is the location of the game. We'll see if defense travels...

Griz just had 560 yards without hardly using Wortham. MSU hasn’t seen an offense like that.

Did I imagine playing Oregon?

Obviously, but Oregon is a top FBS team and that game is hard to use as a comparison because of the size and strength of their offensive line is completely different than UM. Plus, MSU was no match for that offense. UM’s offense isn’t comparable to Oregon or in other words msu hasn’t seen an offense like that.

In other words, MSU has already played an offense much better than UM’s.

Better and incomparable. MSU hasn’t seen an offense like UM’s. Lmk who’s offense has been like UM’s.

Idaho State? Went shot for shot with the Griz offense. We DESTROYED ISU.