FBS move-up handwriting on the wall!

[Camo_Cat]

So all you NIL experts, will the founders start to put clauses in agreements to claw back money if they skip Bowl games?

Good point. Was watching the DirecTV Holiday Bowl last night. Both teams - USC & Louisville - had a bunch of guys not playing because they entered the portal or had declared for the draft. Do boosters want their money going to athletes who won't even finish a full season with their team?

[AFCAT]

So all you NIL experts, will the founders start to put clauses in agreements to claw back money if they skip Bowl games?

Good point. Was watching the DirecTV Holiday Bowl last night. Both teams - USC & Louisville - had a bunch of guys not playing because they entered the portal or had declared for the draft. Do boosters want their money going to athletes who won't even finish a full season with their team?

Not a NIL expert but I would think being a member of the team would be a prerequisite for any payments. Claw back..no. Once paid, the money is gone.

[84CatGrad]

FBS is broken. If you have meaningless bowl games players and fans will skip them. The 12-team playoff will help but it will also make the other bowl games even more meaningless.

[onceacat]

How about those "mighty" Minnesota Gophers going 5-7 and having the honor of going to the "Quick Lane " bowl....and winning over the six win Bowling Green Falcons! ( I had to google to look up the mascot for BG.) What an honor! What an accomplishment! Enjoyed by dozens in the cavernous Ford Field Dome and hundreds more yawning in front of their TV sets at home. Just think how excited we would be for the Cats to play in such a bowl game!

And someday it could all be ours too. Yippeee. Just need a modest boost of institutional support first.

The Quick Lane Bowl had roughly the same attendance last year as the NDSU-UM Semifinal (double the attendance of the SDSU Albany Semi).

Viewership of these bowls is still double the viewership of the FCS games.

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/colleg ... v-ratings/

I guess I don't understand the "pointlessness" of games with far more interest than FCS football. (And I'm a fan of the FCS, I wish FBS would do a playoff too...)

So last year, a last game of the year between two universities with a combined enrollment nearly 20,000 more than UM+NDSU and with a combined alumni base nearly twice of UM+NDSU were able to almost equal the fans present at a second to last game of the year between UM and NDSU, though the bowl game was played in a stadium with nearly triple the attendance number. Neither team won any sort of championship by playing, and multiple players from both teams sat the game out. If that's not pointless, I don't know what is.

More people watch bowls because 1) bowls are all over big networks and lots of randos just bowl surf this time of year and 2) there's a strong correlation between being an FBS school and having a larger enrollment than many FCS schools. None of that negates the fact that all but the biggest bowls are truly meaningless, and only becoming more so.

On a Tuesday night?

I think everyone agrees, bowl games are meaningless except for the final 3.

And yet, more people still care about the Quickie Lube Bowl than an FCS championship game. Tells you something about the level at which we are playing.


BTW, NAIA fans REALLY care about their playoffs too. But ultimately, just like for FCS, there just arent that many fans who care.

More people don't care. You keep relating people who watch to those that care. They are not the same. Viewers will include casual sports fans that don't have anything else to watch. Primary shows are in re runs. College basketball slows during holidays. A lot of FBS have larger alumni base than FCS or lower so they will get more viewers that way as well. Will they really care if they win or lose?

News flash: Most Cat fans don't really care that much either. You keep relating people who watch Cat (or Griz) games to people who care.

Lots of people who care on this board. Off social media in the real world, its pretty different.

[onceacat]

FBS is broken. If you have meaningless bowl games players and fans will skip them. The 12-team playoff will help but it will also make the other bowl games even more meaningless.

Its hard for fans to get super excited about watching their ho-hum 6-6 or 7-5 team play in a bowl game. The bottom 30 or so games are entirely filler for ESPN.

Watching the Alamo Bowl right now...two Top 15 teams...probably 60k fans on a Thursday night. I'm guessing other games with good teams get a lot of people in the stands for the Peach or Cotton or whatever. The Rose Bowl is packed every season & gets massive views on TV, even when its not a playoff bowl.

News flash: nobody is excited about a post season game when your team isnt very good.

Liberty was FCS a decade ago, now they are going to play in the Fiesta Bowl against Oregon. I bet the place is packed. I think what people are really concerned about is that its a lot of fun to watch a great MSU team...and that maybe MSU isn't a great team if it transitions to FBS.

[Cataholic]

FBS is broken. If you have meaningless bowl games players and fans will skip them. The 12-team playoff will help but it will also make the other bowl games even more meaningless.

This gave me a new thought: How do you make the other bowl games (outside the 12 team BCS playoffs) more meaningful? Just looking at college basketball, they have the NIT. Can football create a different set of playoff games for other teams outside of the 12 team BCS? You could pursue good G5 teams and decent P5 teams at 6-5 or 7-4.

If a group of investors can create an XFL or USFL league, I am sure that a private group of investors could cobble together a nice playoff system that attracts decent viewership and good TV money that dwarfs the Famous Idaho Potato bowl proceeds.

[catsrback76]

FBS is broken. If you have meaningless bowl games players and fans will skip them. The 12-team playoff will help but it will also make the other bowl games even more meaningless.

Its hard for fans to get super excited about watching their ho-hum 6-6 or 7-5 team play in a bowl game. The bottom 30 or so games are entirely filler for ESPN.

Watching the Alamo Bowl right now...two Top 15 teams...probably 60k fans on a Thursday night. I'm guessing other games with good teams get a lot of people in the stands for the Peach or Cotton or whatever. The Rose Bowl is packed every season & gets massive views on TV, even when its not a playoff bowl.

News flash: nobody is excited about a post season game when your team isnt very good.

Liberty was FCS a decade ago, now they are going to play in the Fiesta Bowl against Oregon. I bet the place is packed. I think what people are really concerned about is that its a lot of fun to watch a great MSU team...and that maybe MSU isn't a great team if it transitions to FBS.

Yes, it’s pretty clear that the FBS bowl system has evolved and become diluted with every company sponsoring a “bowl” and the middle of the road teams getting into them. I remember the day when the Rose Bowl and the Sugar Bowl would be on tap to determine the national winner for the FBS. Now, bowls are all about money…the economic engines of college football don’t require championships they only require sacrificial lambs show up to play. I don’t like it anymore than I like the NIL system at work in college football…but it’s a current reality. I can rail against it, but money talks more than any other single factor. So, would I watch MSU football play in a bowl game that determines nothing other than an opportunity to watch them play again? Yes. Would it be better IF bowls mattered? Yes.

My OP was simply an observation that with the NIL in full throttle mode, and kids no longer playing for the love of the team or the school…the game is never going to be the way I want to see it played again…and it really doesn’t matter if it’s FCS or FBS…I think the Cats trajectory is upward into another flawed system.

[kennethnoisewater]

So all you NIL experts, will the founders start to put clauses in agreements to claw back money if they skip Bowl games?

I've been wondering this too. If I had a ton of money and wanted to give to NIL stuff, I'd put a clause in that offers incentives based on playing in a bowl game.

[onceacat]

FBS is broken. If you have meaningless bowl games players and fans will skip them. The 12-team playoff will help but it will also make the other bowl games even more meaningless.

Its hard for fans to get super excited about watching their ho-hum 6-6 or 7-5 team play in a bowl game. The bottom 30 or so games are entirely filler for ESPN.

Watching the Alamo Bowl right now...two Top 15 teams...probably 60k fans on a Thursday night. I'm guessing other games with good teams get a lot of people in the stands for the Peach or Cotton or whatever. The Rose Bowl is packed every season & gets massive views on TV, even when its not a playoff bowl.

News flash: nobody is excited about a post season game when your team isnt very good.

Liberty was FCS a decade ago, now they are going to play in the Fiesta Bowl against Oregon. I bet the place is packed. I think what people are really concerned about is that its a lot of fun to watch a great MSU team...and that maybe MSU isn't a great team if it transitions to FBS.

Yes, it’s pretty clear that the FBS bowl system has evolved and become diluted with every company sponsoring a “bowl” and the middle of the road teams getting into them. I remember the day when the Rose Bowl and the Sugar Bowl would be on tap to determine the national winner for the FBS. Now, bowls are all about money…the economic engines of college football don’t require championships they only require sacrificial lambs show up to play. I don’t like it anymore than I like the NIL system at work in college football…but it’s a current reality. I can rail against it, but money talks more than any other single factor. So, would I watch MSU football play in a bowl game that determines nothing other than an opportunity to watch them play again? Yes. Would it be better IF bowls mattered? Yes.

My OP was simply an observation that with the NIL in full throttle mode, and kids no longer playing for the love of the team or the school…the game is never going to be the way I want to see it played again…and it really doesn’t matter if it’s FCS or FBS…I think the Cats trajectory is upward into another flawed system.

Pretty much nailed it with that one.

[coloradocat]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

[AFCAT]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

Yeah, Pop Tarts are right up there with Necco Wafers, Candy Corn, and Peeps as the worst tasting foods in America. Well, I'll give you those brown sugar cinnamon ones, but the rest are a#@.

[catatac]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

Yeah, Pop Tarts are right up there with Necco Wafers, Candy Corn, and Peeps as the worst tasting foods in America. Well, I'll give you those brown sugar cinnamon ones, but the rest are a#@.

Candy Corn? Are you high? Those little beauties are Gooooooo, ood!

[allcat]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

Yeah, Pop Tarts are right up there with Necco Wafers, Candy Corn, and Peeps as the worst tasting foods in America. Well, I'll give you those brown sugar cinnamon ones, but the rest are a#@.

Candy Corn? Are you high? Those little beauties are Gooooooo, ood!

Have you ever eaten real food?

[catatac]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

Yeah, Pop Tarts are right up there with Necco Wafers, Candy Corn, and Peeps as the worst tasting foods in America. Well, I'll give you those brown sugar cinnamon ones, but the rest are a#@.

Candy Corn? Are you high? Those little beauties are Gooooooo, ood!

Have you ever eaten real food?

lol, yes! What next... I suppose people are gonna try to tell me Reese's suck.

[AFCAT]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

Yeah, Pop Tarts are right up there with Necco Wafers, Candy Corn, and Peeps as the worst tasting foods in America. Well, I'll give you those brown sugar cinnamon ones, but the rest are a#@.

Candy Corn? Are you high? Those little beauties are Gooooooo, ood!

I think being high is the only way I could ingest them.

[84CatGrad]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

I don't understand your argument. You're saying going to a meaningless bowl game featuring a 25' toaster and a cellophane junk food mascot is...............................a good thing?

[coloradocat]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

I don't understand your argument. You're saying going to a meaningless bowl game featuring a 25' toaster and a cellophane junk food mascot is...............................a good thing?

Are you not?

[84CatGrad]

To everyone against moving up, here's my counterpoint:

I don't understand your argument. You're saying going to a meaningless bowl game featuring a 25' toaster and a cellophane junk food mascot is...............................a good thing?

Are you not?

Only if I can get the pop tarts toasted. Then I'm all in.

[PapaG]

So all you NIL experts, will the founders start to put clauses in agreements to claw back money if they skip Bowl games?

Good point. Was watching the DirecTV Holiday Bowl last night. Both teams - USC & Louisville - had a bunch of guys not playing because they entered the portal or had declared for the draft. Do boosters want their money going to athletes who won't even finish a full season with their team?

NIL was an unknown market that I feel is massively inflated currently because it’s such a new thing and some people have money to burn. NFL and NBA teams used to whiff on massive rookie contracts prior to CBA limitations and that was after a track record in college and plenty of tape on players. Now, hundreds of thousands of NIL money is going to HS players with zero track record and tape mainly playing against much lesser players.

It seems the market will deflate as players underperform and the same 10-15 teams keep winning and competing for a legitimate shot at a championship.

[onceacat]

So all you NIL experts, will the founders start to put clauses in agreements to claw back money if they skip Bowl games?

Good point. Was watching the DirecTV Holiday Bowl last night. Both teams - USC & Louisville - had a bunch of guys not playing because they entered the portal or had declared for the draft. Do boosters want their money going to athletes who won't even finish a full season with their team?

NIL was an unknown market that I feel is massively inflated currently because it’s such a new thing and some people have money to burn. NFL and NBA teams used to whiff on massive rookie contracts prior to CBA limitations and that was after a track record in college and plenty of tape on players. Now, hundreds of thousands of NIL money is going to HS players with zero track record and tape mainly playing against much lesser players.

It seems the market will deflate as players underperform and the same 10-15 teams keep winning and competing for a legitimate shot at a championship.

I think this is pretty true. I also think it will change substantially when they move to a 12 team playoff. Would Marivn Harrison sit out if there was a championship on the line? Maybe, but I don't think so.

The other thing that is sort of interesting to me is that many (most?) of the big NIL deals are all for legacy players...Marvin Harrison Jr, Shadeur Sanders, Bronny James, Arch Manning...

LOTS of the NIL money is chasing the family name, not on-field performance.