MBB vs UM

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joecat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by joecat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:31 pm

mslacatfan wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:58 am
Im a big fan of zeke quinlan. I think this guy has a very bright future
He plays with a fire.



thefrank1
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by thefrank1 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:35 pm

He has amazing speed and quickness.



joecat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by joecat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:38 pm

StatedImprovement wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:57 pm
duelalumnicat wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:51 pm
The Cats played hard, and they could have easily won. But they looked tired in the second half. And sometimes they appeared to be unnecessarily distracted by Coach Fish who spent a lot of time tonight yelling and calling players out during timeouts. I feel bad for his assistants.
It would be interesting to watch the Cats play for a coach who doesn't spend half the game belittling his own players....
#-o
Then next year should be "interesting".



autocat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by autocat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:04 pm

When you are getting your education paid for and on athletic scholarship, you should be able to taking some belittling :coffee:



Ilikecats
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by Ilikecats » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:37 pm

Not really!



MSmith1968
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by MSmith1968 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:13 pm

This is big boy basketball, you have to be able to be yelled-grow a backbone and leave mommy and daddy at the door! The game was not lost by Fish yelling at players, however I do believe he was out coached in the last 2-3 minutes. Should have taken a time out which he admits but why in the hell was Lassi even taking that shot. He states in the paper, "we do not take those shots" It does not matter if he takes a floater! Hall and Frey are your best shooters no more needs to be said. Hall has a great first half- UM adjusted in the second half on him, as Hall is capable of getting his own shot- being face guarded and than Frey and Hall get doubled, you may want to run some offense that gets your best shooters open. Zeke Quinlan did step up but he still looks lost at times on defense. We also did not attack the basket and this game was lost at the free throw line. It was a good game and we are right there. Seem to drop the ball in the last 3 minutes of these close games. Fish keeps harping-"players learn from it"- the head coach needs to learn from it! He is getting out coached.



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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by Common Cat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:28 pm

joecat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:31 pm
mslacatfan wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:58 am
Im a big fan of zeke quinlan. I think this guy has a very bright future
He plays with a fire.
I read this three times and it still read, "he plays with fire" haha.


@rfoley77

joecat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by joecat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:46 pm

autocat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:04 pm
When you are getting your education paid for and on athletic scholarship, you should be able to taking some belittling :coffee:
i bet you don't show up to your job willing to be called a motherf****r. that's what these guys have, a job, and they deserve to be treated like any other employee. don't comeback with "they can play somewhere else" because the ncaa does not allow them to do so without major penalty. even though they are tough enough to play through the belittling it still has to wear down their enthusiasm and wanting to play for the guy.
Last edited by joecat on Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:27 am, edited 1 time in total.



rosco_cat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by rosco_cat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:58 pm

Playing college basketball isn't a job or in any way similar.



MSmith1968
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by MSmith1968 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:51 pm

joecat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:46 pm
autocat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:04 pm
When you are getting your education paid for and on athletic scholarship, you should be able to taking some belittling :coffee:
i bet you don't show up to your job willing to be called a motherf****r each day. that's what these guys have, a job, and they deserve to be treated like any other employee. don't comeback with "they can play somewhere else" because the ncaa does not allow them to do so without major penalty. even though they are tough enough to play through the belittling it still has to wear down their enthusiasm and wanting to play for the guy.
By your post, I am guessing your very close to a player. My suggestion would be if it "really" that bad than the players need to report him.



MSmith1968
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by MSmith1968 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:55 pm

rosco_cat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:58 pm
Playing college basketball isn't a job or in any way similar.
Apparently you never played Division 1 sports. It is a job! If you do not report to practice, games or whatever the school ask of you, they take your scholarship. For some players, this is the only way to get their education paid for just as job is the only way to pay your bills. You have to be organized in your classes, homework, practice, games, travel, etc. just like you do at a job and life!



rosco_cat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by rosco_cat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 7:01 pm

A typical job is 8-10 hours daily. D-1 basketball isn't even similar. Trust me, I know how it works.
I can tell you that its possible to practice and play, travel, and do everything that's part of basketball, go to school, and still have a real part time job! Believe it or not!!



mslacat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by mslacat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 8:26 pm

It is soooooo interesting that since becoming a huge Montana State basketball fan 1980, I can remember those Sundays when we came up short in a Cat?Griz game played the previous night. Sunday and possibly into Monday I would just be in a piss poor mood. Wives and kids would leave me alone, might not take a shower until Sunday night. I would be just a sad excuse of a human being to be around. I have found out this year, when you expect something the let down is not as bad as when you had hope. I think this is how apathy comes into being!



joecat
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by joecat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 9:08 pm

MSmith1968 wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:51 pm
joecat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:46 pm
autocat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:04 pm
When you are getting your education paid for and on athletic scholarship, you should be able to taking some belittling :coffee:
i bet you don't show up to your job willing to be called a motherf****r each day. that's what these guys have, a job, and they deserve to be treated like any other employee. don't comeback with "they can play somewhere else" because the ncaa does not allow them to do so without major penalty. even though they are tough enough to play through the belittling it still has to wear down their enthusiasm and wanting to play for the guy.
By your post, I am guessing your very close to a player. My suggestion would be if it "really" that bad than the players need to report him.
By your post, I am guessing you've never sat very close to the bench. My suggestion would be you try it. Not close, just seen enough Bobby Knight in Big10 and know that style is tired.



phantom
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by phantom » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:56 am

joecat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 9:08 pm
MSmith1968 wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:51 pm
joecat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:46 pm
autocat wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:04 pm
When you are getting your education paid for and on athletic scholarship, you should be able to taking some belittling :coffee:
i bet you don't show up to your job willing to be called a motherf****r each day. that's what these guys have, a job, and they deserve to be treated like any other employee. don't comeback with "they can play somewhere else" because the ncaa does not allow them to do so without major penalty. even though they are tough enough to play through the belittling it still has to wear down their enthusiasm and wanting to play for the guy.
By your post, I am guessing your very close to a player. My suggestion would be if it "really" that bad than the players need to report him.
By your post, I am guessing you've never sat very close to the bench. My suggestion would be you try it. Not close, just seen enough Bobby Knight in Big10 and know that style is tired.
Reading your posts, it's pretty obvious what your axe is to grind. It's hard for parents and people close to watch kids not play as much as they would like them to play. It's hard to watch your son get pushed and corrected, often times harshly. It's an extremely difficult transition from high school basketball where players often get by as being the most talented and don't get pushed. All of the sudden in college, players have competition, the game moves very fast that first year. You have to be exact on what you do defensively and being a step away gets you yelled at and taken out of the game. Offensively, you're playing in a system that is new and the defense is much better. You are going to make mistakes and coaches are going to be unhappy and they are going to yell at you. As opposed to high school or prep school, the scouting reports are much more detailed and you may defend screens differently on Thursday night than Saturday afternoon.
All the while, you are playing for a coach that has to win or he's getting fired. So, you have to eliminate every mistake as much as you can. The two ways to do that is put a player on the bench or yell at him. Asking politely seldom works. On top of that, parents and fans will not remember the 5 times a coach instructs without yelling, but will remember the times a coach goes ballistic because that is what registers.
I posted after I saw the Bobcats in person that I think Zeke and Quentin both have tremendous upside, but it's painfully obvious that they are freshmen at times. In the Portland State game at home, Zeke made the mistake of saving a ball under the opponents basket and gave up a layup. Honestly, it was an elementary mistake ... I would expect junior high players that have been coached to know to take the ball out of bounds with them as opposed to saving a ball blindly under the opponents basket. Personally, I would have been furious because at that level every basket counts.
These aren't things that are unique to Montana State and Brian Fish. They are college basketball issues. It is why you see so many transfers in college basketball, because it's easier to transfer than to learn, work through and grow up the way that Kirby and Nikkarinen have.



bobcatfan4life
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by bobcatfan4life » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:06 am

This game could have easily gotten away from us when they got up by 10 or so in the first half but we fought back and went into half with a lead. We stayed close the entire game which in past years this would have turned into a blow out. I of course wanted to win because I hate losing to the Griz, but was happy to see how we fought until the end. Some mistakes were made in the final few minutes that could have turned the game in our favor but none the less, we have been in every single game in conference play.

As for comments made about Fish treating players badly, it is interesting because the coach prior to him treated the players the same way but no one made a big deal about it. I do believe that there comes a point where he just has to let them play and not be yelling at them from the sideline. I am not saying it is okay if he is treating players in a bad way, just find it interesting that as fans you see him do that, but Huse did the same thing and there was not much said about it.



thefrank1
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by thefrank1 » Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:13 pm

This is my perspective on the last two coaches. I had been away for a few years and went to a few games in the northwest while Huse was still coach.

I was struck at the total lack of rapport between the Huse and the players. They would not look at him nor interact with him in any way. He was extremely distant. That lack of rapport led to few if any interactions with the players during the game but the body language by Huse and the players said it all. Further, there was never any cohesive strategy that was employed in any of the games I saw. All individual effort.


By the time I returned to Bozeman, Fish was coach. I had seen a few of his games in the northwest and California before returning. The rapport was better between he and the players but I did not feel his abusive behavior during the games was helpful. Since returning to Bozeman, I have been able to watch more closely. This year in particular, he has demonstrated that he has the skills of a good team builder. He also has a strategic approach to the season and it has paid dividends. He has demonstrated an ability to develop talent. This year, Lassi and Zeke are examples of that ability. I commend him for these achievements. His biggest growth area is in personal relations. He has improved but still lashes out from his frustration in a negative way. Our players seem to stand at times and it seems that they are programmed to wait for instructions.


Fish is eons ahead of Huse but can still get better.



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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by WalkOn79 » Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:34 pm

msu_agfan wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 7:09 am
We lost and that always stinks, but the game was fun to watch, we didn't get blown out, we were in it all but the first few minutes, we had monster blocks, tremendous passes, great dunks (remember just a hand ful of years back when we didn't even have a dunk!). If we play like that we will win at least 60 percent of the remaining games.
Devon has come a long ways. He's going to be a force in the conference the next two years!


"The pride and tradition
of Montana State football
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the timid or weak!"

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phantom
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by phantom » Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:53 pm

WalkOn79 wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:34 pm
msu_agfan wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 7:09 am
We lost and that always stinks, but the game was fun to watch, we didn't get blown out, we were in it all but the first few minutes, we had monster blocks, tremendous passes, great dunks (remember just a hand ful of years back when we didn't even have a dunk!). If we play like that we will win at least 60 percent of the remaining games.
Devon has come a long ways. He's going to be a force in the conference the next two years!
The progress he has made is incredible. Good shot blocker and I love watching him run the floor in transition. The pass from Harry to him in transition for the dunk was awesome. Next step is to be more consistent with his low post scoring.



bobcatfan4life
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Re: MBB vs UM

Post by bobcatfan4life » Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:57 pm

thefrank1 wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:13 pm
This is my perspective on the last two coaches. I had been away for a few years and went to a few games in the northwest while Huse was still coach.

I was struck at the total lack of rapport between the Huse and the players. They would not look at him nor interact with him in any way. He was extremely distant. That lack of rapport led to few if any interactions with the players during the game but the body language by Huse and the players said it all. Further, there was never any cohesive strategy that was employed in any of the games I saw. All individual effort.


By the time I returned to Bozeman, Fish was coach. I had seen a few of his games in the northwest and California before returning. The rapport was better between he and the players but I did not feel his abusive behavior during the games was helpful. Since returning to Bozeman, I have been able to watch more closely. This year in particular, he has demonstrated that he has the skills of a good team builder. He also has a strategic approach to the season and it has paid dividends. He has demonstrated an ability to develop talent. This year, Lassi and Zeke are examples of that ability. I commend him for these achievements. His biggest growth area is in personal relations. He has improved but still lashes out from his frustration in a negative way. Our players seem to stand at times and it seems that they are programmed to wait for instructions.


Fish is eons ahead of Huse but can still get better.

Reality is they are both imperfect humans in a job where there are a lot of eyes on them. I personally saw a lot from Huse that I struggled with in how he treated the players. The other thing about him was that I really didn't see players make a huge improvement from year to year under him, as you mentioned with Lassi and Zeke, and even Devin this year. Even in Fish's first couple of years, players like Colbert and Dison improved under Fish. Of course there is always room from improvement from the coach, but what I like about this team is they fight hard and they make hustle plays. If they don't make those plays, they tend to lose like early in the year.



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