WBB vs Weber

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Helcat72
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WBB vs Weber

Post by Helcat72 » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:01 pm

Ladies came out shooting 3's for the whole first half. Went in down by 10. I went to watch the men for a while and came back toward the end of the 3rd. They were up by 2. Won by about 5 or so. Lundburg had 26. She took charge during this game at least offensively. They didn't seem worried after the first half. They must have known that Weber would come back to them. Played a lot of kids tonight. Preparing for Boise.


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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by Colter_Nuanez » Fri Jan 25, 2019 12:49 am



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by Ilikecats » Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:42 am

We wouldn’t of won this game without defense. Kuderer, Martell and Braxton in my opinion get the game ball for their defensive effort. This team just doesn’t have the overall defensive intensity it needs to be a winner. You never see hands up on defense or a focus on blocking out on rebounds. We also still shoot 3s when there’s an easier shot open in the inside. Idaho State plays with a defensive intensity that we need to match to have a chance on Saturday. They held Montana to 34 points last night and solid defense has become their mantra! Lundberg deserves all the accolades that she gets for her scoring. Hope that Binford starts recognizing players publicly for their defensive efforts. I’m old, but defense wins championships!



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by John K » Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:55 am

Ilikecats wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:42 am
We wouldn’t of won this game without defense. Kuderer, Martell and Braxton in my opinion get the game ball for their defensive effort. This team just doesn’t have the overall defensive intensity it needs to be a winner. You never see hands up on defense or a focus on blocking out on rebounds. We also still shoot 3s when there’s an easier shot open in the inside. Idaho State plays with a defensive intensity that we need to match to have a chance on Saturday. They held Montana to 34 points last night and solid defense has become their mantra! Lundberg deserves all the accolades that she gets for her scoring. Hope that Binford starts recognizing players publicly for their defensive efforts. I’m old, but defense wins championships!
So an honest question for those who follow the WBB program a lot closer than I do...no agenda. I'm just looking for some objective opinions. Binford seems to have pretty solid support among most Bobcat fans, and of course she has led the team to 2 regular season titles and 1 BSC tourney championship in the last 3 years. But reading these comments in a vacuum, with no historical context, you seem to be describing a team that is not very well coached. Am in I wrong in interpreting it that way?



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Helcat72
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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by Helcat72 » Fri Jan 25, 2019 2:20 pm

There is something missing since the years if John Stockton and the defensive assistant that left. Stockton seemed to get more offensive flow out of them, and the assistant got defensive intensity out of them. They look a lot like they did before that time.
Case in point: the year, with Peyton Ferris when we overcame a deficit at UM in the last few minutes and won. Both defensive and offensive intensity.


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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by Ilikecats » Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:15 pm

My apologies. In no way was my rant a negative view of Binford. I think she’s doing a good job and has assembled a quality team. I think basketball in general has become about 3 point shots and offense and the shift is having a negative impact. Binford preaches defense and the fundamentals, but we’re not seeing that on the court. It’s the players who have to figure it out.

We have everything we need to be dominant, but only the players can bring the defensive intensity to the court. The focus on points is important, but I think it’s important to also focus on stopping the other team from scoring more points than you. I agree with Helcat...... the intensity needs to be offense AND defense.



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by John K » Fri Jan 25, 2019 5:12 pm

Ilikecats wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:15 pm
My apologies. In no way was my rant a negative view of Binford. I think she’s doing a good job and has assembled a quality team. I think basketball in general has become about 3 point shots and offense and the shift is having a negative impact. Binford preaches defense and the fundamentals, but we’re not seeing that on the court. It’s the players who have to figure it out.

We have everything we need to be dominant, but only the players can bring the defensive intensity to the court. The focus on points is important, but I think it’s important to also focus on stopping the other team from scoring more points than you. I agree with Helcat...... the intensity needs to be offense AND defense.
Isn't that a primary part of the coaches job...to instill those fundamentals in her team? Are you saying that many of the current players just aren't receptive to her message? It seems like you're trying hard not blame her for something, that to me seems to be a failure on her part. It seems to me like she has always gotten a pass from most Bobcat fans, but if you look at the totality of her resume in 10 plus years on the job, it's been mostly pretty mediocre with the exception of those two great years in 2016 and 2017. Her teams were pretty much middle of the pack before those two years, and now they've dropped back down to middle of the pack again the last two years.



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by BelgradeBobcat » Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:22 pm

Three starters didn't play a minute for the program last season. That's pretty crazy-unless you're Kentucky. I think this team is still working out some chemistry issues. I think the blown lead epidemic-which started in the non-conference season is correctable. If they can get things figured out this team could be a dark horse in the tournament. Losing Nate Harris from the coaching staff has had a huge impact as well in my opinion.



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by Anacomando » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:56 pm

I like Binford; she consistently has a Top 4 Big Sky program!



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by John K » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:33 am

Anacomando wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:56 pm
I like Binford; she consistently has a Top 4 Big Sky program!
What? No she doesn't. Look at her record. That's just not true.



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by Anacomando » Sat Jan 26, 2019 7:34 am

John K wrote:
Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:33 am
Anacomando wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:56 pm
I like Binford; she consistently has a Top 4 Big Sky program!
What? No she doesn't. Look at her record. That's just not true.
Let's look at her record over the past decade! 1. She has never had a losing record overall in 10 years. 2. She has never had a losing conference record. 3. Her teams have generally progressively improved over the last 5 years. 4. Her overall conference record is 103-65 in the past decade. 5. Her overall record, in the past decade, counting this year is 174-122. That is 52 games over .500. In the Big Sky, the Cats obviously split home/away games. 6. However, most of the non-conference games played in the past decade have been on the road. 7. Her records stands as a winner: show me where she has had a losing record in a decade? You can't! Finally, put that in context of MSU Women's Basketball in it's history and compare/contrast to other coaches. And when you bring up other women's basketball coaches to compare, you have to see the big picture. Her athletes excel in the classroom too! Binford is one of the best coaches MSU has had!



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by BobcatDel » Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:36 am

John K wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 5:12 pm
Ilikecats wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:15 pm
My apologies. In no way was my rant a negative view of Binford. I think she’s doing a good job and has assembled a quality team. I think basketball in general has become about 3 point shots and offense and the shift is having a negative impact. Binford preaches defense and the fundamentals, but we’re not seeing that on the court. It’s the players who have to figure it out.

We have everything we need to be dominant, but only the players can bring the defensive intensity to the court. The focus on points is important, but I think it’s important to also focus on stopping the other team from scoring more points than you. I agree with Helcat...... the intensity needs to be offense AND defense.
Isn't that a primary part of the coaches job...to instill those fundamentals in her team? Are you saying that many of the current players just aren't receptive to her message? It seems like you're trying hard not blame her for something, that to me seems to be a failure on her part. It seems to me like she has always gotten a pass from most Bobcat fans, but if you look at the totality of her resume in 10 plus years on the job, it's been mostly pretty mediocre with the exception of those two great years in 2016 and 2017. Her teams were pretty much middle of the pack before those two years, and now they've dropped back down to middle of the pack again the last two years.
How do you define middle of the pack? Must be a bit different than mine. In supplementing Anacomando's comments on her record, her only losing season in conference play was her first, she has not had a losing conference season since. Her teams actually played in the Big Sky tourney championship game 3 times in her term here (2008 - Lost championship game to Montana, 2010 - Lost championship game to Portland State, 2017 - Won championship game over Idaho State)....doesn't that count...or what number would satisfy you - 5, 6, 8, 10... pick your number and let us know? She has had five teams that won over 10 conference games during the season (2007-08 W/L Rec =11-5; 2010-11 W/L Rec=11-5; 2011-12 W/L Rec = 10-6; 2015-16 W/L Rec = 14-4; 2016-17 W/L Rec = 15-3). She has coached up 2 Big Sky MVPs (Hommes, Ferris) and 2 Big Sky Defensive Players of the Year. In her term there have been 90 Big Sky All Academic Team members.

Do you or anyone on this board really think the talent on this year's team is what it was during the 2015-17 era? Tell me why...please? Look at the folks you had on the '15-17 teams .....Hommes (Big Sky MVP & MSU 1000 point club); Ferris (Big Sky MVP and MSU 1000 point club); Caudill (All time MSU assist leader and top 5 all time in 3 point shots made); Nordgaard (All time leading 3 point % shooter, top 10 all time 3 points shots made, recorded 76 steals in a single season for 8th on all time season list, one of the toughest players of her size I got to see - only 2 years playing at MSU); Trio of Dawkins - Stockton - Hommes played over 117 games together by the time they graduated in 2016 - All top 10 all time at MSU thus a very senior led group their final year; Hatchard - probably one of the toughest 6th person off the bench and tenacious defenders I have seen since being back, MSU Most Valuable Defensive player award 2017 - maybe you noticed like I did but she hustled until she puked behind the bench; Junkermeir - finished a 4 year career shooting nearly 40% from 3 points; Anaka Lai - emerging Freshman and Sophomore seasons that virtually sealed the championship game with her play; Trio of Nordgaard - Ferris - Junkermeir all playing pro-ball in Europe.

I'm sorry... I love the team we have now but they don't have the talent of the last couple years. They have one senior who is a great player but the team is still finding its identity. It still does not have that player like Nordgaard or Ferris that is a true leader that says "get on my damn back and lets win this"...can you coach that... I don't think so... I think you have to recruit that.... I think our redshirt senior next year will bring that to the team and there is still a chance someone will emerge more in this group. I wished we had Anaka Lai for her senior season I think it would have added much to the team. In my prediction thread, I talked about the senior/skill led teams at Northern Colorado, Portland State, and Idaho (I missed prediction on Idaho State) but I still say we are right where we should be with the team we have on the floor against the competition we face. What I do see is a team that is still growing, they are still needing consistency, they are learning, by season's end if they keep progressing they could be a factor and could still pull some upsets... like Northern Colorado, like nearly knocking off Portland State, etc.

Back on Binford, I also like that she is willing to bring in folks to help on issues. Some on the board think John Stockton was the second coming... but sorry to inform you, he didn't even attend most practices... often not attending for weeks... then coming in for a couple days to work on key issues the coach wanted help on like passing under pressure and then attending games when he could...... he did not create a smooth offensive scheme like some are saying. I credit Binford for recognizing the connection to one of the great all time assist leaders in NBA history and developing a way to use him periodically to help the team.

I liked Nate Harris, loved the guy and chemistry he had with the team and I hope he is successful. But Binford went out to get another assistant who made solid improvements in the defenses at Nebraska and Arizona and I think she will in time at MSU also. I don't doubt if she had the same crew as we had in 2015-17 it would be every bit as good.

Finally, come spend some time with the team and coaches in the Fast Break club or pre-game sessions or team dinner and I think you will appreciate what a fine group of women Binford has recruited and the atmosphere she is building. I like that she continues to build on recruiting lines in Minnesota, Washington, Colorado and Montana (4 Montana ladies next year). I keep asking the ladies and to a person they wished we could just sell better what the program really is all about, the positive atmosphere and chemistry in the program at MSU. She is focused on making them successful in life.

Are there things I wished she was doing better, yep. Would I like to see her be a bit more like our former nemesis across the divide, yep...he seemed like he got a bit more out of the skills he had but he also built a hell of a reputation by the time he got done with over 600 wins (Binford sits at over 220 wins now). Would I like to see a full court man to man, on the floor with skinned elbows, knock about, in the face defense the full game...yep.... but you know I coached some younger kids for a few years and one thing I learned is what you want and what you can get with the skill sets you have are sometimes two different things... you adapt.

Now John K... for you, you started this whole thread with a comment that there was "no agenda"... but based on some of the feedback you are giving it makes me think you don't think much of her coaching style or are pretty negatively disposed to it...... so it at least to me makes me think you do have an agenda... so what is it? Do you want her out? Tell us where she is so messed up we need to oust her? What does she need to change? Would you sacrifice building character for winning at all cost? What is it?



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Re: WBB vs Weber

Post by Catlady » Tue Jan 29, 2019 7:44 am

We got a good coach and she runs a very good program. Can she improve? Absolutely! We got everything we need to be a successful program. It’s down to execution.

Next 4-5 games are crucial! Got to lead with defense and energy!



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