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Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:33 pm
by Montanabob
VimSince03 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:32 pm
ilovethecats wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:30 pm
coloradocat wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:44 pm
When a player enters the portal does he automatically remove himself from the team or is he just notifying the country that he's available to be recruited for transfer? If he's not technically done at his current school that would be one change that could be made either nationally or by individual schools.
That is the worst part of the portal if you ask me. Any player at any came can enter the portal without the coaches knowledge. They are essentially free agents all season long. Any coach can view the portal and if anyone strikes them as a player who might be able to help can reach out to them. Again...all without the coaches notice.
I'm a big advocate about players having options. But the more I learn about this the worse I think it is.
I also think that this could become such a huge deal that coaches might have to hire someone full time just to view the portal to see who is out there, both possible current players as well as players of need.
This is going to be facinating to watch the next couple years
If a current player enters the portal, MSU Compliance automatically notifies the coaches. So they know about but can't really do anything about it. No planning can go into it.
https://msubobcats.com/documents/2018/9 ... df?id=5098
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:45 pm
by stevo
VimSince03 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:32 pm
ilovethecats wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:30 pm
coloradocat wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:44 pm
When a player enters the portal does he automatically remove himself from the team or is he just notifying the country that he's available to be recruited for transfer? If he's not technically done at his current school that would be one change that could be made either nationally or by individual schools.
That is the worst part of the portal if you ask me. Any player at any came can enter the portal without the coaches knowledge. They are essentially free agents all season long. Any coach can view the portal and if anyone strikes them as a player who might be able to help can reach out to them. Again...all without the coaches notice.
I'm a big advocate about players having options. But the more I learn about this the worse I think it is.
I also think that this could become such a huge deal that coaches might have to hire someone full time just to view the portal to see who is out there, both possible current players as well as players of need.
This is going to be facinating to watch the next couple years
If a current player enters the portal, MSU Compliance automatically notifies the coaches. So they know about but can't really do anything about it. No planning can go into it.
Coach said he gets an email from the portal as soon as a player enters it and declares.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:50 pm
by ilovethecats
VimSince03 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:32 pm
ilovethecats wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:30 pm
coloradocat wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:44 pm
When a player enters the portal does he automatically remove himself from the team or is he just notifying the country that he's available to be recruited for transfer? If he's not technically done at his current school that would be one change that could be made either nationally or by individual schools.
That is the worst part of the portal if you ask me. Any player at any came can enter the portal without the coaches knowledge. They are essentially free agents all season long. Any coach can view the portal and if anyone strikes them as a player who might be able to help can reach out to them. Again...all without the coaches notice.
I'm a big advocate about players having options. But the more I learn about this the worse I think it is.
I also think that this could become such a huge deal that coaches might have to hire someone full time just to view the portal to see who is out there, both possible current players as well as players of need.
This is going to be facinating to watch the next couple years
If a current player enters the portal, MSU Compliance automatically notifies the coaches. So they know about but can't really do anything about it. No planning can go into it.
Yes. Sorry I worded that funny. I meant that initially the coaches have no knowledge.
This doesn't even touch on how the relationship goes forward once a coach knows a player is in the portal. If you have a quality players that get a lot of time and helps win games; but you learn he's in the portal, do you still continue as is? Do you play someone else and get that experience assuming said player is leaving? Can't imagine the awkwardness that could ensue in all this.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:53 pm
by bobcat99
Most coaches have an idea of who on the team might want to leave.
These coaches can talk to whoever and leave whenever they want to, but the people who actually make this system money can't do that? Coaches just don't want to lose players, and rightfully so, but there's a lot of hypocrisy there.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:13 pm
by ilovethecats
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:53 pm
Most coaches have an idea of who on the team might want to leave.
These coaches can talk to whoever and leave whenever they want to, but the people who actually make this system money can't do that? Coaches just don't want to lose players, and rightfully so, but there's a lot of hypocrisy there.
Hey, you're preaching to the choir on that one. I've been saying that exact same thing forever. I like kids having choices.
What I don't love is any kid being able to transfer to any school at any time all without the coach knowing. It seems lie 180 degrees from what it used to be. I like the direction of the portal...but it seems pretty crazy the way it currently works.
It will only be a matter of time before we see a football player playing for two different teams in the SAME season like we're seeing in hoops right now. Look at the lady Griz' best player! She was playing for a different team just this fall!
All I'm saying is the more I learn about this, from people who know a lot about it, it could get crazy.
Wait until the first Cat player transfers to the Griz midseason and see where you stand!
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:14 pm
by CelticCat
They can bench the guy.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:28 pm
by 91catAlum
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:53 pm
Most coaches have an idea of who on the team might want to leave.
These coaches can talk to whoever and leave whenever they want to, but the people who actually make this system money can't do that? Coaches just don't want to lose players, and rightfully so, but there's a lot of hypocrisy there.
Like Choate said, it's not always smart for an 18 year old to walk away from a full ride scholarship, just because they are having a little adversity. Kids that age don't always make the best choices and can still benefit greatly from advice from parents AND coaches who usually do have a kid's best interest at heart. If a freshman with a full ride at MSU "decides" he has the talent to be in the PAC-12 and bails out, that PAC-12 offer will likely never come since the kid was an FCS talent to begin with.
So no, the portal isn't always good for the players in all aspects. There will be players who end up not getting a degree because they threw away a full ride scholly due to December being cold in Bozeman.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:54 pm
by bobcat99
I think some of you are misunderstanding things.
If you enter the portal, you can still go back to your school if your coach let's you! It doesn't mean you have to leave! James Blackmon of FSU is an example. Another kid from Alabama is another example.
You won't see players play for two different teams in the same year. Transfer rules still apply.
I hate this idea that transfers are quitters. Was Alex Neale a quitter when he transferred after one year in college? Was Sterk a quitter? Kids are going to transfer if there's a portal or if there isn't. It is a coaches job to make them stay, and that happens before a kid goes to talk to his coach about a transfer.
Now I want to clarify that I like Choate, a lot. I don't exactly agree with him, or the way he's going about this. Quit bitching. Straight up quit bitching and find the advantages. It's easier for Choate to find recruits too! Now they know who's available and who isn't. Take advantage of this and go find guys. If you can't make guys want to stay, then either you recruited the wrong guys or you aren't managing them well. Forget these excuses.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:05 pm
by CelticCat
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:54 pm
I think some of you are misunderstanding things.
If you enter the portal, you can still go back to your school if your coach let's you! It doesn't mean you have to leave! James Blackmon of FSU is an example. Another kid from Alabama is another example.
You won't see players play for two different teams in the same year. Transfer rules still apply.
I hate this idea that transfers are quitters. Was Alex Neale a quitter when he transferred after one year in college? Was Sterk a quitter? Kids are going to transfer if there's a portal or if there isn't. It is a coaches job to make them stay, and that happens before a kid goes to talk to his coach about a transfer.
Now I want to clarify that I like Choate, a lot. I don't exactly agree with him, or the way he's going about this. Quit bitching. Straight up quit bitching and find the advantages. It's easier for Choate to find recruits too! Now they know who's available and who isn't. Take advantage of this and go find guys. If you can't make guys want to stay, then either you recruited the wrong guys or you aren't managing them well. Forget these excuses.
My thoughts partway into Choate's speech were "Dude, you benefit or can benefit as much from this as you lose" but he did make some clarifications on what he deems to be acceptable reasons for transferring.
He has some valid points, but failed to address the player's point of view. Choate said they invest time, energy, training etc into these kids. But what about the kids who invest their time, energy, effort for a coach who just bails for a new job? It goes both ways.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:20 pm
by coloradocat
CelticCat wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:05 pm
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:54 pm
I think some of you are misunderstanding things.
If you enter the portal, you can still go back to your school if your coach let's you! It doesn't mean you have to leave! James Blackmon of FSU is an example. Another kid from Alabama is another example.
You won't see players play for two different teams in the same year. Transfer rules still apply.
I hate this idea that transfers are quitters. Was Alex Neale a quitter when he transferred after one year in college? Was Sterk a quitter? Kids are going to transfer if there's a portal or if there isn't. It is a coaches job to make them stay, and that happens before a kid goes to talk to his coach about a transfer.
Now I want to clarify that I like Choate, a lot. I don't exactly agree with him, or the way he's going about this. Quit bitching. Straight up quit bitching and find the advantages. It's easier for Choate to find recruits too! Now they know who's available and who isn't. Take advantage of this and go find guys. If you can't make guys want to stay, then either you recruited the wrong guys or you aren't managing them well. Forget these excuses.
My thoughts partway into Choate's speech were "Dude, you benefit or can benefit as much from this as you lose" but he did make some clarifications on what he deems to be acceptable reasons for transferring.
He has some valid points, but failed to address the player's point of view. Choate said they invest time, energy, training etc into these kids. But what about the kids who invest their time, energy, effort for a coach who just bails for a new job? It goes both ways.
I think Choate doesn't like that some of the players have entered the portal without having a conversation with him first and giving him a chance ahead of time to pull the kid back into the fold. I don't remember if it was the press conference or the podcast but he essentially said this and he specifically mentioned Sterk as someone who benefited from transferring. With all the transfers that Choate has brought in you can assume he doesn't hate the fact that players can transfer but that they might not fully understand what they are doing and aren't communicating with him. The one rule he could create by himself (with AD/Pres signoff) would be that anyone that enters the portal without communicating with him first is off the team.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:11 pm
by thefrank1
That is a punitive action and would not be a good step.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:31 pm
by Montanabob
thefrank1 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:11 pm
That is a punitive action and would not be a good step.
I agree. But if you look at the link below to the MSU website, if they put into the transfer portal, the coach can allow or disallow access to training facilities and other activities. They may lose financial aid, but again, based on coach, and subject to appeal.
So if you really want to leave, you really should talk to the coach and at least discuss it, or you may be in the cold. Now that being said, if you wait until after spring ball, you screw the team and the next person who applied for transfer. And if you put in for transfer, don't get any offers you like, you may come back begging for a scholarship.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:46 pm
by luckyirishguy25
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:54 pm
I think some of you are misunderstanding things.
If you enter the portal, you can still go back to your school if your coach let's you! It doesn't mean you have to leave! James Blackmon of FSU is an example. Another kid from Alabama is another example.
You won't see players play for two different teams in the same year. Transfer rules still apply.
I hate this idea that transfers are quitters. Was Alex Neale a quitter when he transferred after one year in college? Was Sterk a quitter? Kids are going to transfer if there's a portal or if there isn't. It is a coaches job to make them stay, and that happens before a kid goes to talk to his coach about a transfer.
Now I want to clarify that I like Choate, a lot. I don't exactly agree with him, or the way he's going about this. Quit bitching. Straight up quit bitching and find the advantages. It's easier for Choate to find recruits too! Now they know who's available and who isn't. Take advantage of this and go find guys. If you can't make guys want to stay, then either you recruited the wrong guys or you aren't managing them well. Forget these excuses.
Choate said it makes since for kids that are buried in a depth chart and just want to play, what he didn't like is kids coming to the program for one semester and deciding its too cold and there's nothing to do in the winter and wanting to leave. When I watched it, I was thinking he had a few freshman in mind.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:50 pm
by TomCat88
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:54 pm
I think some of you are misunderstanding things.
If you enter the portal, you can still go back to your school if your coach let's you! It doesn't mean you have to leave! James Blackmon of FSU is an example. Another kid from Alabama is another example.
You won't see players play for two different teams in the same year. Transfer rules still apply.
I hate this idea that transfers are quitters. Was Alex Neale a quitter when he transferred after one year in college? Was Sterk a quitter? Kids are going to transfer if there's a portal or if there isn't. It is a coaches job to make them stay, and that happens before a kid goes to talk to his coach about a transfer.
Now I want to clarify that I like Choate, a lot. I don't exactly agree with him, or the way he's going about this. Quit bitching. Straight up quit bitching and find the advantages. It's easier for Choate to find recruits too! Now they know who's available and who isn't. Take advantage of this and go find guys. If you can't make guys want to stay, then either you recruited the wrong guys or you aren't managing them well. Forget these excuses.
My wife said if I enter the portal I can never leave.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:18 pm
by bobcat99
luckyirishguy25 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:46 pm
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:54 pm
I think some of you are misunderstanding things.
If you enter the portal, you can still go back to your school if your coach let's you! It doesn't mean you have to leave! James Blackmon of FSU is an example. Another kid from Alabama is another example.
You won't see players play for two different teams in the same year. Transfer rules still apply.
I hate this idea that transfers are quitters. Was Alex Neale a quitter when he transferred after one year in college? Was Sterk a quitter? Kids are going to transfer if there's a portal or if there isn't. It is a coaches job to make them stay, and that happens before a kid goes to talk to his coach about a transfer.
Now I want to clarify that I like Choate, a lot. I don't exactly agree with him, or the way he's going about this. Quit bitching. Straight up quit bitching and find the advantages. It's easier for Choate to find recruits too! Now they know who's available and who isn't. Take advantage of this and go find guys. If you can't make guys want to stay, then either you recruited the wrong guys or you aren't managing them well. Forget these excuses.
Choate said it makes since for kids that are buried in a depth chart and just want to play, what he didn't like is kids coming to the program for one semester and deciding its too cold and there's nothing to do in the winter and wanting to leave. When I watched it, I was thinking he had a few freshman in mind.
Those kids would have transferred anyways. The portal didn't change that.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:54 pm
by rivercat
Transfer portal makes the FCS and G5 the minor leagues feeding the P5. Watch and see. However it will benefit only the very few who were truly overlooked. The rest will ruin their relationship with coaches and players and will end up regretting it. The transfer portal is a very quick and easy way to make a life changing bad decision. I'm within Coach 100%. Undeveloped frontal lobe.....
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:40 pm
by catsrback76
TomCat88 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:50 pm
bobcat99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:54 pm
I think some of you are misunderstanding things.
If you enter the portal, you can still go back to your school if your coach let's you! It doesn't mean you have to leave! James Blackmon of FSU is an example. Another kid from Alabama is another example.
You won't see players play for two different teams in the same year. Transfer rules still apply.
I hate this idea that transfers are quitters. Was Alex Neale a quitter when he transferred after one year in college? Was Sterk a quitter? Kids are going to transfer if there's a portal or if there isn't. It is a coaches job to make them stay, and that happens before a kid goes to talk to his coach about a transfer.
Now I want to clarify that I like Choate, a lot. I don't exactly agree with him, or the way he's going about this. Quit bitching. Straight up quit bitching and find the advantages. It's easier for Choate to find recruits too! Now they know who's available and who isn't. Take advantage of this and go find guys. If you can't make guys want to stay, then either you recruited the wrong guys or you aren't managing them well. Forget these excuses.
My wife said if I enter the portal I can never leave.
Kinda Hotel California-ish!
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:20 am
by DriscollCat
VimSince03 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:23 pm
25% of the names in the portal are from Division 1 football programs. Next year that could double meaning about half of Division 1 rosters will be influx
He did say something to that effect. If he did state it the way you put it here though, he is wrong. Just because 25% of the portal are D1 doesn't mean that 25% of D1 are on the portal.
For example, if there are 4 guys total on the portal, and one of them is D1 - then you can accurately state that 25% of players on the portal are D1. Doubling that would in no way mean that half of D1 rosters will be changing. This is a subtle but important distinction.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:25 am
by VimSince03
DriscollCat wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:20 am
VimSince03 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:23 pm
25% of the names in the portal are from Division 1 football programs. Next year that could double meaning about half of Division 1 rosters will be influx
He did say something to that effect. If he did state it the way you put it here though, he is wrong. Just because 25% of the portal are D1 doesn't mean that 25% of D1 are on the portal.
For example, if there are 4 guys total on the portal, and one of them is D1 - then you can accurately state that 25% of players on the portal are D1. Doubling that would in no way mean that half of D1 rosters will be changing. This is a subtle but important distinction.
I didn't put it correctly. He said a relatively large number of kids have entered the portal and 25% of them are from D1 programs. Basically, if 12,000 names are on the portal, 3,000 of them are from D1 programs...per the portal.
Re: 2019 Signing Day thread II
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:30 am
by ilovethecats
VimSince03 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:25 am
DriscollCat wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:20 am
VimSince03 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:23 pm
25% of the names in the portal are from Division 1 football programs. Next year that could double meaning about half of Division 1 rosters will be influx
He did say something to that effect. If he did state it the way you put it here though, he is wrong. Just because 25% of the portal are D1 doesn't mean that 25% of D1 are on the portal.
For example, if there are 4 guys total on the portal, and one of them is D1 - then you can accurately state that 25% of players on the portal are D1. Doubling that would in no way mean that half of D1 rosters will be changing. This is a subtle but important distinction.
I didn't put it correctly. He said a relatively large number of kids have entered the portal and 25% of them are from D1 programs. Basically, if 12,000 names are on the portal, 3,000 of them are from D1 programs...per the portal.
And he and coaches around the country expect that number could even double by next season.
