He's Baaack

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Re: He's Baaack

Post by KittieKop » Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:36 pm

catsrback76 wrote:
catatac wrote:Saw that article on Facebook. Sounds pretty interesting the way thInga played out. So did the three powerful boosters basically make the decision to fire Stitt and hire Hauck back? I might be naive here but is that common in the world of college football, and could that possibly happen at MSU? Seems pretty crazy if you ask me.
It takes very MATURE boosters to give $$$ with no expectation of compensation back...i.e. you will bring this coach in or you will lose this money...! That said, those are the realities in a capitalist system. Money talks...follow the money...etc. My guess is that the facts lie somewhere in the middle.
If you don't think booster outrage and threats of funding support didn't influence our coaching change two years ago, you're sadly naive. Hell, there were plenty on here threatening to cancel tickets and Bobcat/QB Club memberships if Ash wasn't ousted. So, no, its not unrealistic at all that boosters largely "made" this decision.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by CelticCat » Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:38 pm

Griz fans see one poster over here say something, even if no one else is saying it, then they run back to egriz and say "Look what Cat fans are saying on BN". :lol:

I did some research here this morning, I was curious how the Griz have fared in the conference since he left and versus the other teams that have done well since then.

Conference only records since 2010:
Griz 41-23 64.06%
Cats 42-22 65.63% (Griz are 4-4 vs MSU)
EWU 53-11 82.81% (Griz are 2-6 vs EWU)
SUU 31-17 64.58% (Griz are 2-1 vs SUU)
NAU 40-24 62.5% (Griz are 4-3 vs NAU)

The Griz are a combined 12-14 versus those schools over that timeframe. Yes EWU skews the stats but they are only 4-3 against NAU, 2-1 against SUU, and 4-4 against the Cats. Far from the domination of the Hauck era.

If you go read egriz, the general mood seems to be the Griz are back at their rightful place at the top, are pretty much ignoring the last 8 years, and they still dominate the conference. It's pretty entertaining and pretty delusional. No offense to Colter either but I've listened to the Monday and Tuesday T&T podcasts and they are right with the rest of them in terms of what they think they are entitled to, what they deserve, and how much better they should be at football simply because of the fact that they are Montana. How dare a school like SUU post a better conference record than they?

I'll be the first to admit that what they did in the 2000s was ridiculous. You went into WaGriz knowing you'd probably lose, and they just beat the crap out of people for damn near a decade. Colter said they won more football games in that timeframe than any other program in the country at any level, and I believe it. They were a force, you feared them. No one is scared to play them anymore, that mystique is gone.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by Cledus » Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:41 pm

BozoneCat wrote:
cat_stache_fever wrote:IMHO, this move is a desperate one. I'm sure most Griz fans are feeling all warm and fuzzy today, and they should be; it's a fun story...

It's gonna end one of two ways: the Griz finish 11-1/10-2 each of the next 2 seasons, win the BSC and make deep playoff runs, Bobby leaves to coach somewhere like UTEP or San Jose State(this scenario is HIGHLY unlikely); the Griz finish 5-6 the next two seasons with "Stitt's guys." Everyone on egriz agrees this is a bad hire, Haslam(if he still has a job, panics) fires Hauck and we're right back to square one.(my money is on this scenario)

The landscape of the BSC is much different than the one Bobby left behind. He isn't inheriting a team fresh a chipper appearance, but rather a team that finished 7th(?) in a conference that's adding another member.
Good luck Bobby...you'll need it.
I love this hire for MSU, the only thing better for us would have been keeping Stitt around another 5 years. Hope Bobby can figure out what to do with a couple dozen receivers on his roster. :lol:
A lot of jiz fans have been all twitterpated at their "owning the state" because they got five of the top seven ranked players, according to Vim's rankings.

I'd have to double check that list, but I think most of those five are receivers, who were probably going to go to the jiz no matter who the coach is.



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Re: He's Baaack

Post by VimSince03 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:57 pm

Cledus wrote:
BozoneCat wrote:
cat_stache_fever wrote:IMHO, this move is a desperate one. I'm sure most Griz fans are feeling all warm and fuzzy today, and they should be; it's a fun story...

It's gonna end one of two ways: the Griz finish 11-1/10-2 each of the next 2 seasons, win the BSC and make deep playoff runs, Bobby leaves to coach somewhere like UTEP or San Jose State(this scenario is HIGHLY unlikely); the Griz finish 5-6 the next two seasons with "Stitt's guys." Everyone on egriz agrees this is a bad hire, Haslam(if he still has a job, panics) fires Hauck and we're right back to square one.(my money is on this scenario)

The landscape of the BSC is much different than the one Bobby left behind. He isn't inheriting a team fresh a chipper appearance, but rather a team that finished 7th(?) in a conference that's adding another member.
Good luck Bobby...you'll need it.
I love this hire for MSU, the only thing better for us would have been keeping Stitt around another 5 years. Hope Bobby can figure out what to do with a couple dozen receivers on his roster. :lol:
A lot of jiz fans have been all twitterpated at their "owning the state" because they got five of the top seven ranked players, according to Vim's rankings.

I'd have to double check that list, but I think most of those five are receivers, who were probably going to go to the jiz no matter who the coach is.
Also note that the list was a preseason list based off what I expected going into the 2017 fall season. The final list will be very different but my top 4 will include in order: Gabe Sulser (WR), Drew Turner (RB), Nolan Askelson (LB), and Garrett Graves (QB/ATH). 3 out of those 4 are Griz commits.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by PapaG » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:01 pm

catscat wrote:So at 10 Scott Breen says Huck's hired. Confirmed by Skyline Sports with 8 anonymous sources. Now at 10:30 he says that even though Skyline Sports has confirmed with 8 anonymous sources, dUMb is denying that Howck's hired. Good thing someone coined the phrase "fake news" to fit these situations.
Scott Breen is my homey! We played together on the Scarlets. Nice to see him still doing what he always wanted to do. I can't imagine he'd put something out that wasn't legitimate.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by WeedKillinCat » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:06 pm

KittieKop wrote:
catsrback76 wrote:
catatac wrote:Saw that article on Facebook. Sounds pretty interesting the way thInga played out. So did the three powerful boosters basically make the decision to fire Stitt and hire Hauck back? I might be naive here but is that common in the world of college football, and could that possibly happen at MSU? Seems pretty crazy if you ask me.
It takes very MATURE boosters to give $$$ with no expectation of compensation back...i.e. you will bring this coach in or you will lose this money...! That said, those are the realities in a capitalist system. Money talks...follow the money...etc. My guess is that the facts lie somewhere in the middle.
If you don't think booster outrage and threats of funding support didn't influence our coaching change two years ago, you're sadly naive. Hell, there were plenty on here threatening to cancel tickets and Bobcat/QB Club memberships if Ash wasn't ousted. So, no, its not unrealistic at all that boosters largely "made" this decision.
I understand that the boosters had an influence in firing Ash, but I think Waded did too. But at least MSU's hiring process was open and not secretive like in zoo town. It almost seems that the boosters force Haslems hand and said "you vill hire Hauck or else". I hope if blows up in all of those boosters faces


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by kennethnoisewater » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:07 pm

I think it's a good hire. I think MSU got the right guy with Choate, and UM got somebody similar with Hauck. In football, you have to have that Alpha dog leading your team. That was always my reservation about Ash, as much as I loved the guy. Both UM and MSU have a tough, alpha leader that young men love to follow. If both programs can keep those coaches, expect some great things in this rivalry.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by PapaG » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:31 pm

It's a three year gig for Bobby. He'll win games, get the Griz back to the playoffs, rebrand himself to get rid of the UNLV stench of failure, and be coaching at San Diego State by the 2021 season.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by 95bcfb » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:02 pm

kennethnoisewater wrote:I think it's a good hire. I think MSU got the right guy with Choate, and UM got somebody similar with Hauck. In football, you have to have that Alpha dog leading your team. That was always my reservation about Ash, as much as I loved the guy. Both UM and MSU have a tough, alpha leader that young men love to follow. If both programs can keep those coaches, expect some great things in this rivalry.
I think that you are right about the alpha dog analogy. My complaint with Hauck is not his arrogance, coaching style or even his complete lack of class but with the culture that he brought to UM. The win at all cost mentality brings a level of temporary success that I expect the Griz will have but in the end it bankrupts your program as both MSU and UM have seen in the past. I think that Hauck is a good coach but it is not enough for you to be a good coach. You need to be able to make young men into better people and develop a culture where excellence thrives on and off the field. I think that Choate is that type of person but time will tell. Time has already told the story regarding Hauck and this time around he will have even more pressure to succeed and less natural recruiting appeal. I would rather lose every single game forever than to return to the Kramer irra or the rape culture allowed by Hauck. This hire absolutely blows my mind. I know that the University as a whole is having a tough time but I have to think that this has to be one of the top FCS jobs in the country. Why would you hire a coach that has so much baggage when you could get an equally good coach without the baggage. The whole hiring process resembles that of a bunch of hippy pot growers high on weed trying to decide what to eat for dinner rather than an executive board meeting by top level business executives deciding on their next CEO. Maybe Hauck will do well and avoid his previous mistakes but I really don't understand why you would take that chance.



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Re: He's Baaack

Post by cats2506 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:11 pm

Grizaddict wrote:I think you guys should resurrect that thread from a few years ago when some rumors surfaced that Hauck was coming after the Cats open position. I seem to recall a lot of intrigue and excitement here over that potential. Very few seemed to take issue with Hauck then and many were excited he'd be the one to take you to the promised land. Funny how that has all suddenly changed.
Hmmm. funny I dont remember it that way at all.

What I remember is that BH made an inquiry to a well connected individual about applying, whoever it was told him not to bother since he would never have the chance. That was about the end of the story other than some BH/fizz jokes


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by ilovethecats » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:38 pm

cats2506 wrote:
Grizaddict wrote:I think you guys should resurrect that thread from a few years ago when some rumors surfaced that Hauck was coming after the Cats open position. I seem to recall a lot of intrigue and excitement here over that potential. Very few seemed to take issue with Hauck then and many were excited he'd be the one to take you to the promised land. Funny how that has all suddenly changed.
Hmmm. funny I dont remember it that way at all.

What I remember is that BH made an inquiry to a well connected individual about applying, whoever it was told him not to bother since he would never have the chance. That was about the end of the story other than some BH/fizz jokes
yep, that was far from the case. I remember, because I was one of maybe 2 people to say I loved the idea! to be fair, I loved the idea for two reasons; one....there wasn't a chance in hell we'd hire him. and two...I wanted to see the complete head explosions from the fans to the west. that entertainment alone was worth it for me to see hauck coach the cats.

let's just say that when he inquired about the job, guys with FAR more money and pull than myself didn't share this opinion of entertainment!

as per usual on these boards, a few people say something or have an idea, and fans from the other board rush over and say "all the cat fans..." happens here too. let's try to remember that a few people on a message board, hell...even a LOT of people on a message board are probably about 2% of the fanbase. I think it'd do a lot of people a lot of good to keep this in mind.... :idea:



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Re: He's Baaack

Post by Cledus » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:41 pm

95bcfb wrote:
kennethnoisewater wrote:I think it's a good hire. I think MSU got the right guy with Choate, and UM got somebody similar with Hauck. In football, you have to have that Alpha dog leading your team. That was always my reservation about Ash, as much as I loved the guy. Both UM and MSU have a tough, alpha leader that young men love to follow. If both programs can keep those coaches, expect some great things in this rivalry.
I think that you are right about the alpha dog analogy. My complaint with Hauck is not his arrogance, coaching style or even his complete lack of class but with the culture that he brought to UM. The win at all cost mentality brings a level of temporary success that I expect the Griz will have but in the end it bankrupts your program as both MSU and UM have seen in the past. I think that Hauck is a good coach but it is not enough for you to be a good coach. You need to be able to make young men into better people and develop a culture where excellence thrives on and off the field. I think that Choate is that type of person but time will tell. Time has already told the story regarding Hauck and this time around he will have even more pressure to succeed and less natural recruiting appeal. I would rather lose every single game forever than to return to the Kramer irra or the rape culture allowed by Hauck. This hire absolutely blows my mind. I know that the University as a whole is having a tough time but I have to think that this has to be one of the top FCS jobs in the country. Why would you hire a coach that has so much baggage when you could get an equally good coach without the baggage. The whole hiring process resembles that of a bunch of hippy pot growers high on weed trying to decide what to eat for dinner rather than an executive board meeting by top level business executives deciding on their next CEO. Maybe Hauck will do well and avoid his previous mistakes but I really don't understand why you would take that chance.
As was mentioned on Skyline through a quote attributed to McElwain, griz coach is the worst job in the country because expectations are as high there as they are at Alabama, except for a fraction of the pay.

Given Saban stands to make about $11.125 million this year that means Hauck has all the b.s. at 1/33 the pay. He's part of a very small population of coaches willing to put up with that b.s.

Imagine being the fb coach at Villanova or another east coast FCS school. Absolutely no pressure at all, almost no fan base and corresponding expectation, and same pay.



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Re: He's Baaack

Post by Buckaroo Bonzi » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:48 pm

kennethnoisewater wrote:I think it's a good hire. I think MSU got the right guy with Choate, and UM got somebody similar with Hauck. In football, you have to have that Alpha dog leading your team. That was always my reservation about Ash, as much as I loved the guy. Both UM and MSU have a tough, alpha leader that young men love to follow. If both programs can keep those coaches, expect some great things in this rivalry.
I do too , I could see Catgrizz deciding the Big Sky Champions in a few years , and I'd be OK with that as
long as we continue to keep the STREAK intact .


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by ilovethecats » Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:04 pm

Cledus wrote:
95bcfb wrote:
kennethnoisewater wrote:I think it's a good hire. I think MSU got the right guy with Choate, and UM got somebody similar with Hauck. In football, you have to have that Alpha dog leading your team. That was always my reservation about Ash, as much as I loved the guy. Both UM and MSU have a tough, alpha leader that young men love to follow. If both programs can keep those coaches, expect some great things in this rivalry.
I think that you are right about the alpha dog analogy. My complaint with Hauck is not his arrogance, coaching style or even his complete lack of class but with the culture that he brought to UM. The win at all cost mentality brings a level of temporary success that I expect the Griz will have but in the end it bankrupts your program as both MSU and UM have seen in the past. I think that Hauck is a good coach but it is not enough for you to be a good coach. You need to be able to make young men into better people and develop a culture where excellence thrives on and off the field. I think that Choate is that type of person but time will tell. Time has already told the story regarding Hauck and this time around he will have even more pressure to succeed and less natural recruiting appeal. I would rather lose every single game forever than to return to the Kramer irra or the rape culture allowed by Hauck. This hire absolutely blows my mind. I know that the University as a whole is having a tough time but I have to think that this has to be one of the top FCS jobs in the country. Why would you hire a coach that has so much baggage when you could get an equally good coach without the baggage. The whole hiring process resembles that of a bunch of hippy pot growers high on weed trying to decide what to eat for dinner rather than an executive board meeting by top level business executives deciding on their next CEO. Maybe Hauck will do well and avoid his previous mistakes but I really don't understand why you would take that chance.
As was mentioned on Skyline through a quote attributed to McElwain, griz coach is the worst job in the country because expectations are as high there as they are at Alabama, except for a fraction of the pay.

Given Saban stands to make about $11.125 million this year that means Hauck has all the b.s. at 1/33 the pay. He's part of a very small population of coaches willing to put up with that b.s.

Imagine being the fb coach at Villanova or another east coast FCS school. Absolutely no pressure at all, almost no fan base and corresponding expectation, and same pay.
I think it goes both ways though. those expectations, asinine fans, great facilities etc. are what might make that job so great compared to others even if the pay is the same.

not to mention, a guy like hauck and a majority of the coaches around the country are tough enough to deal with delusional fans on message boards!



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Re: He's Baaack

Post by Colter_Nuanez » Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:30 pm

CelticCat wrote:Griz fans see one poster over here say something, even if no one else is saying it, then they run back to egriz and say "Look what Cat fans are saying on BN". :lol:

I did some research here this morning, I was curious how the Griz have fared in the conference since he left and versus the other teams that have done well since then.

Conference only records since 2010:
Griz 41-23 64.06%
Cats 42-22 65.63% (Griz are 4-4 vs MSU)
EWU 53-11 82.81% (Griz are 2-6 vs EWU)
SUU 31-17 64.58% (Griz are 2-1 vs SUU)
NAU 40-24 62.5% (Griz are 4-3 vs NAU)

The Griz are a combined 12-14 versus those schools over that timeframe. Yes EWU skews the stats but they are only 4-3 against NAU, 2-1 against SUU, and 4-4 against the Cats. Far from the domination of the Hauck era.

If you go read egriz, the general mood seems to be the Griz are back at their rightful place at the top, are pretty much ignoring the last 8 years, and they still dominate the conference. It's pretty entertaining and pretty delusional. No offense to Colter either but I've listened to the Monday and Tuesday T&T podcasts and they are right with the rest of them in terms of what they think they are entitled to, what they deserve, and how much better they should be at football simply because of the fact that they are Montana. How dare a school like SUU post a better conference record than they?

I'll be the first to admit that what they did in the 2000s was ridiculous. You went into WaGriz knowing you'd probably lose, and they just beat the crap out of people for damn near a decade. Colter said they won more football games in that timeframe than any other program in the country at any level, and I believe it. They were a force, you feared them. No one is scared to play them anymore, that mystique is gone.
If you listen to yesterday's episode, we address exactly this: it's not John Zamberlin, Scott Downing, Steve Mooshagian, Jerry Glanville and Rob Ash anymore. Almost everyone in the league has a coach of higher aptitude or at least one who will not bow down to Bobby Hauck.

In terms of what I think the expectations should be at Montana, it has nothing to do with entitlement or what "the Griz deserve." I would say the exact same thing about Montana State. In fact, with Montana State's leadership from the top down combined with MSU's superior academic reputation and Bozeman's burgeoning growth, I would argue that the expectations for Bobcat football should expect to be a national power consistently.

Between 2000 and 2009, Montana won 119 football games, the most ever in a single decade in college football history. That, I think, is quite literally impossible to replicate at the same school although NDSU is going to blow that number out of the water likely by the end of this decade.

"No one is scared to play them anymore, that mystique is gone" — I said this on the show many times during the fall as to the ground I felt UM was losing with Stitt at the helm and how the fear of the Griz was fading. It's true - hardly any team in the league, if any, fears Montana anymore.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by bobcat99 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:32 pm

95bcfb wrote:
kennethnoisewater wrote:I think it's a good hire. I think MSU got the right guy with Choate, and UM got somebody similar with Hauck. In football, you have to have that Alpha dog leading your team. That was always my reservation about Ash, as much as I loved the guy. Both UM and MSU have a tough, alpha leader that young men love to follow. If both programs can keep those coaches, expect some great things in this rivalry.
I think that you are right about the alpha dog analogy. My complaint with Hauck is not his arrogance, coaching style or even his complete lack of class but with the culture that he brought to UM. The win at all cost mentality brings a level of temporary success that I expect the Griz will have but in the end it bankrupts your program as both MSU and UM have seen in the past. I think that Hauck is a good coach but it is not enough for you to be a good coach. You need to be able to make young men into better people and develop a culture where excellence thrives on and off the field. I think that Choate is that type of person but time will tell. Time has already told the story regarding Hauck and this time around he will have even more pressure to succeed and less natural recruiting appeal. I would rather lose every single game forever than to return to the Kramer irra or the rape culture allowed by Hauck. This hire absolutely blows my mind. I know that the University as a whole is having a tough time but I have to think that this has to be one of the top FCS jobs in the country. Why would you hire a coach that has so much baggage when you could get an equally good coach without the baggage. The whole hiring process resembles that of a bunch of hippy pot growers high on weed trying to decide what to eat for dinner rather than an executive board meeting by top level business executives deciding on their next CEO. Maybe Hauck will do well and avoid his previous mistakes but I really don't understand why you would take that chance.
Hauck didn't bring that culture there. That was more the fans, imo.



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Re: He's Baaack

Post by CatsRback » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:13 pm

Seldom post but enjoy reading...
As I see it um is now in a "lose-lose" scenerio...if they hire bobby, tremendous pressue and expectation of instant success starting NEXT year. If they don't hire bobby, even greater pressure and expectation of instant success... In either case, the first unexpected loss and/or another loss to the CATS and griz nation will explode! First player run in with the law, Missoula will explode. Would hope the AD would back track and actually put together an open, fair process..



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Re: He's Baaack

Post by Hawks86 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:14 pm

It will be interesting to see what grizzly Clay approved for a contract.


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Re: He's Baaack

Post by Hell's Bells » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:04 pm

Colter_Nuanez wrote:
CelticCat wrote:Griz fans see one poster over here say something, even if no one else is saying it, then they run back to egriz and say "Look what Cat fans are saying on BN". :lol:

I did some research here this morning, I was curious how the Griz have fared in the conference since he left and versus the other teams that have done well since then.

Conference only records since 2010:
Griz 41-23 64.06%
Cats 42-22 65.63% (Griz are 4-4 vs MSU)
EWU 53-11 82.81% (Griz are 2-6 vs EWU)
SUU 31-17 64.58% (Griz are 2-1 vs SUU)
NAU 40-24 62.5% (Griz are 4-3 vs NAU)

The Griz are a combined 12-14 versus those schools over that timeframe. Yes EWU skews the stats but they are only 4-3 against NAU, 2-1 against SUU, and 4-4 against the Cats. Far from the domination of the Hauck era.

If you go read egriz, the general mood seems to be the Griz are back at their rightful place at the top, are pretty much ignoring the last 8 years, and they still dominate the conference. It's pretty entertaining and pretty delusional. No offense to Colter either but I've listened to the Monday and Tuesday T&T podcasts and they are right with the rest of them in terms of what they think they are entitled to, what they deserve, and how much better they should be at football simply because of the fact that they are Montana. How dare a school like SUU post a better conference record than they?

I'll be the first to admit that what they did in the 2000s was ridiculous. You went into WaGriz knowing you'd probably lose, and they just beat the crap out of people for damn near a decade. Colter said they won more football games in that timeframe than any other program in the country at any level, and I believe it. They were a force, you feared them. No one is scared to play them anymore, that mystique is gone.
If you listen to yesterday's episode, we address exactly this: it's not John Zamberlin, Scott Downing, Steve Mooshagian, Jerry Glanville and Rob Ash anymore. Almost everyone in the league has a coach of higher aptitude or at least one who will not bow down to Bobby Hauck.

In terms of what I think the expectations should be at Montana, it has nothing to do with entitlement or what "the Griz deserve." I would say the exact same thing about Montana State. In fact, with Montana State's leadership from the top down combined with MSU's superior academic reputation and Bozeman's burgeoning growth, I would argue that the expectations for Bobcat football should expect to be a national power consistently.

Between 2000 and 2009, Montana won 119 football games, the most ever in a single decade in college football history. That, I think, is quite literally impossible to replicate at the same school although NDSU is going to blow that number out of the water likely by the end of this decade.

"No one is scared to play them anymore, that mystique is gone" — I said this on the show many times during the fall as to the ground I felt UM was losing with Stitt at the helm and how the fear of the Griz was fading. It's true - hardly any team in the league, if any, fears Montana anymore.
One point: NDSU has eclipsed UM dominance with how many championships they have won this decade.


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Catfanatic84
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Re: He's Baaack

Post by Catfanatic84 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:30 pm

My thought is we quit wringing our hands over the Griz hiring Hoax. Let's concentrate on what we have control over....filling the stands and writing checks to get the facilities upgraded!! Go Cats!!!



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